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Old 01-03-2006   #151
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"Now me and the mad scientist got to rip apart the block and replace the
piston rings you fried"
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Old 01-03-2006   #152
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heh, seriously though, best of luck. I personally would probably have just got a new engine, they're only like $200 on ebay
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Old 01-04-2006   #153
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Dam dude that sucks big time just hang in there and let us know if you need anyhelp. When i first installed my first vtec head ever i messed it up and the same thing happen. But now i am a pro at installing the heads on our civic
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Old 01-05-2006   #154
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here is a funny update. i went there this morning and talked with the service tech again. The manager I needed to see was gone I guess so I need to come back later. Well the tech was just listening to me again and saying we shouldn't have taken the job and me trying to explain that a modded car has nothing to do with what happened. Oh get this! THE TECH SAID THE MECHANIC CALLED HIM BACK TO THE SHOP TO SHOW HIM THE DENT AND SAY IT WAS ALREADY THERE BEFORE! BS. What a liar omg. Why would he call a tech back to show him that particular dent and not the three others that were on the car? oh gee i don't know because he did it? lol. This confirms even more how shady this guy is. So now i need to call the manager to make an appointment and ask them to pay for the broken parts and dent. If that doesn't work, hello corporate honda again I'd like to file another complaint...

haha i almost started laughing at this. when i was waiting to talk with the tech, I was looking at their job schedule. One day they had to do a TRANSMITION service bwahaha.
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Old 01-05-2006   #155
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you should tell them that they ruined your piston return springs too
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Old 01-05-2006   #156
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hey guys easy on saying monkeys with air guns break things......im a mechanic and trust me peoples views on mechanics are wrong, if something breaks its because it was going to not because of us. (i dont know maybe some other idiots break **** on purpose but they are what we call shopmonkeys that dont know what they are doing or anything about cars, just how to remove bolts and put them back with a new part)

the problem is some mechanics who know alot eventually dont give a **** after a while because theyre makin a shitload of money and just want the car out to make the hours.

and alot of times they just hand tighten things, some its ok but some things they shouldnt. for instance your exhaust manifold bolts, i gaurantee he just did them all by hand with a ratchet or a air ratchet to be quick because honestly it doesnt matter, as long as he knows hes not tightening them rediculously. but on the spark plugs where he probly did the same thing, thats stupid because spark plugs need to be torqued down, and one main reason is because upon torquing the plug it gaurantees the plug will face a certain direction in the combustion chamber and it is designed to fire facing a way that will give most complete combustion. so not torquing will not put it at the right direction.
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Old 01-05-2006   #157
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well torquing the plugs is more so the engine doesn't overheat. you are talking about indexing which is alot harder to do and sometimes does not even work. it means turning the plug so that the open part of the ground electrode faces the wave front for all four plugs. so you kinda have to visualize or mark the way the plug is installed. it doesn't matter anyway for a 4 banger. racecars yes.

peoples views on mechanics are correct actually. you being one of the good ones doesn't like that comment but believe me when i say for every 5 bad mechanics there is one good one. bottom line is people that are getting paid to work on a car other than his own isn't gonna treat it like his own. hes gonna do the job to get paid. no love
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Old 01-05-2006   #158
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Old 01-05-2006   #159
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seriously my car has been through so much grief i'm surprised its still going strong.
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Old 01-05-2006   #160
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it's a honda what do u expect?
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Old 01-05-2006   #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gearbox
well torquing the plugs is more so the engine doesn't overheat. you are talking about indexing which is alot harder to do and sometimes does not even work. it means turning the plug so that the open part of the ground electrode faces the wave front for all four plugs. so you kinda have to visualize or mark the way the plug is installed. it doesn't matter anyway for a 4 banger. racecars yes.

peoples views on mechanics are correct actually. you being one of the good ones doesn't like that comment but believe me when i say for every 5 bad mechanics there is one good one. bottom line is people that are getting paid to work on a car other than his own isn't gonna treat it like his own. hes gonna do the job to get paid. no love
i wont argue with you but trust me your not teaching me here, it does ensure that the side electrode faces the right way and ill believe ase certified master techs who are on state boards of auto repair and emissions control before i change my views to something a person tells me on a forum. and there is no open part to the side electrode, your thinking of the air gap between the side electrode and the center electrode. notice im not calling it the ground electrode because thats wrong, on some cars where one coil pack is used for two cylinders the secondary winging shoots the firing voltage through the plug from the center to side electrode, the side electrode is "grounded" to the head and the the remaining voltage goes to the opposing plug shooting from the side electrode to the center electrode, so in this case the side electrode is not the "ground".


as for your comment of 1 good out of 5 bad, i see how you can think that and in fact i understand because what they did to your car is pretty retarded and theyre dicks. but id say the number is more near 1-1 or even 2-1. but im referring to actual mechanics and technicians, not idiots who honestly have no clue what they are doing and starting out in the field or just never learned the importance of specific components, any damage they cause to your car or others is more the employers fault then the employee because they let the moron do the job that they arent capable of.
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Old 01-05-2006   #162
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ya i didn't know what it was called. but how does torque translate to direction of plug? it doesn't unless you mark the plug and then sometimes the plug won't be facing the right direction even when torqued properly. i've tried it and later found you might need level rings then gave up cause it was too much trouble.
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Old 01-05-2006   #163
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it does because it gaurantees the number of turns, meaning lets say its 20 turns till its hand tight, then torquing it to 17 ft.lb (or w/e is recommended for our cars i dont know-havent done mine yet) will be lets say another 2 and a half turns or something to that extent.
at first i didnt get it but after thinking about it i think it does make sense, plus i wasnt gonna argue with my teacher because the reason he told us about it was for complete combustion to effect emissions and he is a god damn emissions freak lol.

edit: ive never heard of marking the plug either, it would be kinda tough to do and to see since its down there so far.

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Old 01-05-2006   #164
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hmm ya i guess. do your plugs get loose cause i check mine every month or so and they always need tightening.
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Old 01-05-2006   #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gearbox
hmm ya i guess. do your plugs get loose cause i check mine every month or so and they always need tightening.
maybe you have stretched your splines....I say this only cuz I've heard you talk so much about retorquing and changing out plugs every oil change...
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Old 01-05-2006   #166
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if you install them and theyve still got the lock washer then you really shouldnt have problems, if you insist on retorquing i say maybe halfway between each plug change interval. changing plugs every oil change isnt nescessary unless your running real rich or youve got other things causing problems. but if you torque them to 17ft.lb then two months down the road you arent doing damage if your only torquing it to that number again. and remember its one click not two. (its a myth that two is better or nescessary)
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Old 01-05-2006   #167
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i use a beam style torque wrench anyway.
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Old 01-06-2006   #168
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncirom2003
hey guys easy on saying monkeys with air guns break things......im a mechanic and trust me peoples views on mechanics are wrong, if something breaks its because it was going to not because of us. (i dont know maybe some other idiots break **** on purpose but they are what we call shopmonkeys that dont know what they are doing or anything about cars, just how to remove bolts and put them back with a new part)

the problem is some mechanics who know alot eventually dont give a **** after a while because theyre makin a shitload of money and just want the car out to make the hours.

and alot of times they just hand tighten things, some its ok but some things they shouldnt. for instance your exhaust manifold bolts, i gaurantee he just did them all by hand with a ratchet or a air ratchet to be quick because honestly it doesnt matter, as long as he knows hes not tightening them rediculously. but on the spark plugs where he probly did the same thing, thats stupid because spark plugs need to be torqued down, and one main reason is because upon torquing the plug it gaurantees the plug will face a certain direction in the combustion chamber and it is designed to fire facing a way that will give most complete combustion. so not torquing will not put it at the right direction.

One of those "monkeys" hammered my mom's civic lugnuts on to over 200ftlbs. I had one hell of a time getting them off with a breaker bar. I had to change the front pads. They also "forgot" to mention that both lower control arm bushings were completely torn, but were quick to quote $200 for a front brake job. The pads were only 1/2 down, btw. So had they stripped the lugs, it would have been OUR problem... as usual. The shop NEVER breaks anything... it's always "we found another problem, your (insert part here) is stripped/broken and needs to be replaced. That will be (insert small fortune here)" They won't say "We accidentally stripped your oil pan bolt and have to replace the whole pan. We're really sorry, but it's no charge to you."

HAH! That'll be the day. I totally cringe in fear everytime I get an oil change.
The second my warranty is up, I'm outta there for good. Hopefully the cars will still be in one piece.

I AM a mechanic, and a very good one. I retired from the field and work out of my house doing things I like now. The problem is that no-one wants to pay a "good" mechanic "good" money anymore. So they have Young guys out of Highschool working on cars. And since it's probably a sweatshop type environment, nobody gives a crap. (Been there)
If it werent for the warranty, we would never take the car to Honda, or anyone else. Period. I do all my own work, including transmission overhauls. (No one ask..... I won't do it.) Funny how my own cars seem to last over 20 years without much incident.
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Old 01-06-2006   #169
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well there you go. just like the mechanic dented my car and then called in another tech to say see look it was already there before. i had an even bigger problem when i didn't know crap about cars and I keep taking my old jetta in for work. everytime we took it in they would say something else was broken. scammers is what they are. and the worst part is after all i've been through it looks like i won't even get the scratched and broken parts replaced. the service manager says i'm lying and there is no way to prove they damaged anything. they said the job was done very well by our best mechanic. BS
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Old 01-06-2006   #170
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damn man that sucks!
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Old 01-06-2006   #171
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman
One of those "monkeys" hammered my mom's civic lugnuts on to over 200ftlbs. I had one hell of a time getting them off with a breaker bar. I had to change the front pads. They also "forgot" to mention that both lower control arm bushings were completely torn, but were quick to quote $200 for a front brake job. The pads were only 1/2 down, btw. So had they stripped the lugs, it would have been OUR problem... as usual. The shop NEVER breaks anything... it's always "we found another problem, your (insert part here) is stripped/broken and needs to be replaced. That will be (insert small fortune here)" They won't say "We accidentally stripped your oil pan bolt and have to replace the whole pan. We're really sorry, but it's no charge to you."

HAH! That'll be the day. I totally cringe in fear everytime I get an oil change.
The second my warranty is up, I'm outta there for good. Hopefully the cars will still be in one piece.

I AM a mechanic, and a very good one. I retired from the field and work out of my house doing things I like now. The problem is that no-one wants to pay a "good" mechanic "good" money anymore. So they have Young guys out of Highschool working on cars. And since it's probably a sweatshop type environment, nobody gives a crap. (Been there)
If it werent for the warranty, we would never take the car to Honda, or anyone else. Period. I do all my own work, including transmission overhauls. (No one ask..... I won't do it.) Funny how my own cars seem to last over 20 years without much incident.
well i dont know how long you were a mechanic but its rule of thumb everywhere that if youve got a job inspecting brakes you recommen/do them if it is half worn or more. so they werent trying to rip you off and 200 really isnt that bad for a brake job. theyd have to cut the rotors, replace pads, clean and lube all the stuff.
as for the 200ft.lb yea they shouldve torqued them but dont worry 200 isnt gonna do any damage.
and yes there is no reason for the shop to pay for parts that brake, if the part brakes because of stupid employees then yes shop will pay and normally not tell you just to avoid more questions and loss of business so chances are its happend to you b4, but if theyre working on something and its rusted or worn and fragile then its not theyre fault for breaking it. when you take a car to a shop your pretty much agreeing to pay for anything that breaks during the repair if its not fault of the shop.

and i dont know how long you worked or where but every shop i know is a fun friendly atmosphere for the workers and most build family like bonds over time. the ones i could see having a bad experience is the ones that dont get along with the boss or other coworkers.
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Old 01-06-2006   #172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gearbox
well there you go. just like the mechanic dented my car and then called in another tech to say see look it was already there before. i had an even bigger problem when i didn't know crap about cars and I keep taking my old jetta in for work. everytime we took it in they would say something else was broken. scammers is what they are. and the worst part is after all i've been through it looks like i won't even get the scratched and broken parts replaced. the service manager says i'm lying and there is no way to prove they damaged anything. they said the job was done very well by our best mechanic. BS
damn thats sorry to hear, you should print pics of how nice your car is maintained and sue like hell.
the problem i have with dealerships is they dont really ever look to repair things, they always want to replace things which is why people form the hatred thinking theyre scamming them. (some do though)
my mom took her mercedes e430 for a quick look up while they did some airbag **** and my dad said just make a quick list of what needs to be done so its 100% and if its cheap ill just have you do it. they came out with a 6500 bill so we said **** off and spent like 400 bucks for it to be tip top shape.
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Old 01-06-2006   #173
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well i sure learned alot from this. be careful who you trust and don't ever expect the work to be 100% unless you did it yourself. i really have been through alot and paid way too much for other people to work on my car. well i guess i'll tell my circuit city story next.

i went in to have them install speakers and dynamat, well I guess what are the chances that i would ever take off the door panel so this gave them a great opportunity to be sloppy. well i finally did decide to take charge after my speakers continued to sound like barf and me wondering why. well lets see one spacer for the door speaker was completely cracked open because they couldn't aim the screw in the predrilled hole. so i tore apart everything and redid the whole thing with new spacers and dynamat. the dynamat was barely staying on because they simply ripped off the plastic and put it over all that sticky goo. well alot of parts it wasn't even touching metal. so i got a roller and pressed into it til it was decent. back to the rear, I was having problems with a speaker cutting out all the time and all they would do was play with the wires. turned out it was a bad connector because i finally got pissed and ripped all the wires out and wrapped it directly to the speaker. now my audio sounds awesome thanks to me.

another example of how stupid people are. i'm asking a best buy jockey if there is a way to arm my viper alarm when the turbo timer is counting down. he said nope no way it won't work when the car is on. then i come post here and everyone says cut the yellow wire. i cut it, problem solved. bestbuy =0 7thgen =1.

okay one last example...i was stupid and took my old jetta to have a new hu and speakers put in at a specialty shop audio express or something. well at first i turn it up and it sounds worse than my $5 computer speakers. so they're like oh maybe we can switch the polarity well that fixed it but jeez maybe they should test it first and not assume they actually did it right. there is more to this but basically its highway robbery what these places charge for install. it took me 30 mins as an amateur to install my alpine deck and mount it in the vic and thats cause i was watching tv. alot of these jobs are blown up to no end. just like this head swap. why it took 2 days is still a mystery where every turbo guy here says it only takes a couple hours maybe 5-6hrs tops if you haven't done it. and here i'm thinking these honda monkeys actually get training to work on honda cars. guess not. well i guess not all dealers are good. i've gone to the reno dealer to get stuff done and yes something happened there too. while the mechanic was replacing my faulty fuel sender, he spilt gas all over underneath the rear seat cushion so my car smelled like a gas station. well at least the manager was on my side and he said leave the car here we will send it out for a FULL detail. so no hard feelings. this retard manager here says oh i don't believe you that was my best mechanic and he wouldn't leave plugs loose or wires in the fan or low oil bla bla. oh okay i just imagined it then.

anyway, enough ranting. i'm going to talk to the manager on tuesday and if he doesn't at least offer to buy me new parts to replace the damaged ones and fix the dent too things will be getting alot worse for them. and those techies are so pathetic over there. some younger kid was trying to blame it all on my car being modified. I'm like do you realize how retarded you sound right now. please tell me how a different exhaust means they should leave the plugs loose. seriously is that the best they can come up with...and the other tech saying we should have never taken this job. oh really? you don't like working on a car for money because its modified big deal then you shouldn't have taken it. people need to educate themselves. it still blows my mind how someone supposed to know about cars can't even spell simple car terms like TRANSMISSION! jeez!

Last edited by gearbox; 01-06-2006 at 07:59 PM.
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Old 01-06-2006   #174
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tinman is just really nicetinman is just really nicetinman is just really nicetinman is just really nicetinman is just really nice
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Originally Posted by ncirom2003
well i dont know how long you were a mechanic but its rule of thumb everywhere that if youve got a job inspecting brakes you recommen/do them if it is half worn or more. so they werent trying to rip you off and 200 really isnt that bad for a brake job. theyd have to cut the rotors, replace pads, clean and lube all the stuff.
as for the 200ft.lb yea they shouldve torqued them but dont worry 200 isnt gonna do any damage.
and yes there is no reason for the shop to pay for parts that brake, if the part brakes because of stupid employees then yes shop will pay and normally not tell you just to avoid more questions and loss of business so chances are its happend to you b4, but if theyre working on something and its rusted or worn and fragile then its not theyre fault for breaking it. when you take a car to a shop your pretty much agreeing to pay for anything that breaks during the repair if its not fault of the shop.

and i dont know how long you worked or where but every shop i know is a fun friendly atmosphere for the workers and most build family like bonds over time. the ones i could see having a bad experience is the ones that dont get along with the boss or other coworkers.

I have been a mechanic for 20 years.

The car was taken in for a 60,000 mile FULL inspection. They couldn't see the control arm mounts were completely torn up when they "checked" the car and brakes? Everything was supposed to be inspected and problems noted. Also... None of the fluids were topped off, and I now seriously wonder if they flushed the transmission like we asked and PAID extra for. No no... I think the dealership mechanics are the worst. BTW, this BS is the very reason I became a mechanic in the first place. I also run circles around most people when it comes to troubleshooting vehicle electronics. I have a real knack for it. I have the title of Master Technician. So there...

I agree that a good shop is a joy to work at. I did time in a Mercedes shop with a master mechanic from Germany. It was great, and we are very good friends. The best moment was when an older inline 6 came in with overheat complaints. Removing the blown head revealed: 2, yes... 2 headgaskets sandwiched with lots-o-blue silicone gasket maker! WOW!!

Anyway, as I get physically older (brain hasn't caught up yet) I decided that turning wrenches is no way to retire. So I continue on electronics only. Much less physical stress.

I applaud a good and HONEST mechanic. I believe they are worth every penney they charge. Too bad there are so few.

Gearbox should be working for Honda in another year or two
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Old 01-06-2006   #175
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ya so i can keep em in line haha. this is the reason why i offer free services to 7thgen members. anything i can do that is somewhat simple I will do if you bring the car to me. speakers, amps, headlights, bumper removals, I can actually do quite a bit for not being a mechanic and its worth it because thats money that won't be going to ripoff shops. i've done almost all my own work modding the car because it easily adds up. I got quoted $100+ for sidemarkers! same for door markers, and installing speakers, amps, etc. its just too much to pay these days. another thing i've noticed is that people actually feel more secure taking it to an actual shop rather than driving by my parking lot. i still can't understand why except maybe taking to a "real" shop makes them feel secure? i don't know. I guess i used to be like that too. i didn't know anything when i got my car and i've learned so much tinkering with stuff and posting it here so everyone can enjoy.
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Old 01-06-2006   #176
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lol don't get me started about working in a shop like Wal-Mart; (I've heard stories about some guys will refuse to replace the TIRES when there is too much brake dust buildup on the rims) there is a thing when it comes down to it that all (most) shops adhere to and that is liability/accountability. things today are getting way out of hand pricewise so scamming and shortcutting is becoming a way of life for shops. any penny saved means another peny in the pocket. its outrageous, but the less you have to be held liable for when working on a car, the less you have to be held accountable for when the job is done. I've had this explained to me numerous times by people in Wal-Mart and by other mechanics (that I trust).



MY .47 cents
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Old 01-06-2006   #177
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like when they forget to add oil back to the car and blame it on the girl who brought it in? okay here we go again. I went to sam's club to get my tires balanced cause after the accident there was a bad vibration at 70mph in the steering wheel. Well the balance doesn't help at all and later I found out why. I go to a real alignment shop and they said it just needed a wheel balance. I said oh rly? cause I just got one. they said no you didn't the wheels didn't even have any weights on em! i was like haha okay? they wrote me a note on the repair bill basically saying sams club sucks and I went and got my money back since really they didn't do anything. I was talking all loud and finding people around cust service to explain what happened lol and they were like oh my i'm never coming here for repair work again. oh ya and when they did the "balance" they left off one of my locking lug nuts. I went back and said wtf is your problem letting me drive off without a lugnut do you realize how dangerous, bla bla warped rotors bla and then they couldn't even find it. so...i drive straight to the dealer and buy an overpriced wheel lock kit bring it back and say here is your bill $55 for new wheel locks. thank you.
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Old 01-06-2006   #178
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excatly.
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Old 01-07-2006   #179
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman
I have been a mechanic for 20 years.

The car was taken in for a 60,000 mile FULL inspection. They couldn't see the control arm mounts were completely torn up when they "checked" the car and brakes? Everything was supposed to be inspected and problems noted. Also... None of the fluids were topped off, and I now seriously wonder if they flushed the transmission like we asked and PAID extra for. No no... I think the dealership mechanics are the worst. BTW, this BS is the very reason I became a mechanic in the first place. I also run circles around most people when it comes to troubleshooting vehicle electronics. I have a real knack for it. I have the title of Master Technician. So there...

I agree that a good shop is a joy to work at. I did time in a Mercedes shop with a master mechanic from Germany. It was great, and we are very good friends. The best moment was when an older inline 6 came in with overheat complaints. Removing the blown head revealed: 2, yes... 2 headgaskets sandwiched with lots-o-blue silicone gasket maker! WOW!!

Anyway, as I get physically older (brain hasn't caught up yet) I decided that turning wrenches is no way to retire. So I continue on electronics only. Much less physical stress.

I applaud a good and HONEST mechanic. I believe they are worth every penney they charge. Too bad there are so few.

Gearbox should be working for Honda in another year or two
oh didnt realize it was for the 60k.... yea sounds like theyre lazy hacks.
LOL at the head-gasket mickey mouse work.
congrats on the ase master tech cert., maybe you can answer a question for me... to be a master tech do you need to do all 8 plus the L1 test or just complete all 8? i wasnt sure if l1 was extra.





diskreet: haha what a way to give it to sams club lol what you need to do is find a reputable independent shop in your area that does body work and mechanic work (not specializes in one and does the other on the side, does both exclusively) or at least the mechanic side. start bringing your car for little things first and just shoot the **** with the boss when you can, then eventually with the head mechanic and others just saying hey hows it goin. then after a few years if theyve done good work for you and youve had big jobs done good too start doing favors like cards or even bottles of alcohol for the holidays and if you get a good price on a bill turn it down and ask them to take a lil more.
maybe i just sound like an idiot right now lol but this is the only way to have trusty work done. i work for my father and our customers who act this way get the best treatment, (they all get good treatment actually but the nice ones... us mechanics care more about being sure its done on time and done 100%.
best way to shoot the **** would be start askin how long theyre in business and then bring up the sams club story, i like that one lol. just treat the mechanic and owner more like a friend doing a favor than a business your paying to do your work.
reason i say this is cus im pissed that you all feel this way and that mose people look at the auto service industry as hacks and sneaky liers. not pissed at your views, pissed at the idiots out there not caring what they do because they get theyre money......
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Old 01-07-2006   #180
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yup i have one shop in this entire place like that. i talk to the guy that opened the shop alot about this stuff and we get along pretty good. thats where all my business is going oil change, brakes, etc. they did my alternator before under warranty too no problems. I also know someone like this in my old town. i met him when he had a tiny one man corner shop and we always talked about stuff and how mechanics are messed up and stuff. well he opened his own shop finally and hired people but i can still always talk to him and get a straight answer.
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