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^^^ ofcourse as I siad the COG moved, but that's agian hard to compinsate for, it falls under one of those variable I didn't account for.

 
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Yeah, I was treating the turn as a wrench, but that is clearly wrong, you're right it should be moment equation. I guess I was just over simplifing, but I think my point is still clear, that the wieght in that back is going to be more than just it's "dead" weight as we called it.

My physics class made the assumption ABS stppoed the brakes from alowing the car to lock the tire. SO the tire would never skid, hence you would only have the static friction, where as a skiding tire used the kinetic friction fractor, you can probably see why we came up with ABD has a shorter stopping distance, given that assumpution.

And yeah, I know a couple of guys in Applied physics (it's a course here pretty much only physics major take) and they told me about it, sounds way to much for me. But then I talk about the equations of momentum transport ChemE's use and the freakout, it amazing how much difference there is. Of course, ChemE momentum Transopt only deal in the microscopic world, actually closser to nano, but whatever.

 
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How come civic ex coupes don't do 15s, there 2533 pounds and dyno 115 whp stock? Is it possible with a civic ex coupe as well, with driving techniques.

 
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Different gearing, that would be my guess. Civic's aren't that far from the 15's, they run what, 16.3 stock I think is the best I've seen.

Jetta may have a better power curve too. Those look like small tires on that car, are they the factory size?

 
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I don't see much Civic dyno'd at 115 whp stock. Mine dyno'd 105.8 stock. After all kinds of bolt-on I eventually gets to 120 whp. Then I decided to get better midrange so I put on cam gear, maxed out at 5300rpm (instead of 6300) and 111 whp. They dyno'd the car with cam gear retarded I got 125 whp at 6700rpm. *4th gear.

 
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Yeah its hard to compare Dynos, you can go on four diff dynos with the same car and the dynos will be completely diff, I'm giving you AEM's dynos.

 
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I've toyed with dudes in Jettas, but I guess the newer ones are heavier, and older ones are probabaly not in as good condition. I'm from Montreal Canada we have harsh winters, maybe our cars get wear out faster.

 
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The Jetta has a much broader torque curve than the Civic. My car was making peak torque around 3000 rpm, and peak horsepower around 5800 rpm. The Civic EX peaks at 4800 rpm and 6300 rpm. Those wheels are actually 15" and the car came with 14". The overall diameter of the tire is 1/2" shorter than stock with the setup I had. They were also a lot lighter. I was able to pull 2.25 60ft times on those street tires.

As for the gearing, the Civic's have much shorter gearing than the Jetta. The stock gearing on that car had a 3.67 final drive, 3.45 1st grear, 1.94 2nd gear, 1.29 3rd gear, 0.97 4th gear, and 0.80 5th gear.

Just to add, my Jetta was running those times with 172,000 miles on. Of course I was always a bit of a fanatic when it came to maintenance.

 
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The Civic is 2533 without driver and gas. If you want to compare that to how much my Jetta weighed, you would have to take 2712 - 195 (me) - 22 (gas) which equals 2495 lbs. You say 115 whp stock for the EX (sounds a bit generous to me) vs my 121 whp in my Jetta. Now consider torque numbers. I had 125 ft-lbs at the wheels. The Ex only makes 114 ft-lbs at the crank.

 
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Yeah that makes more sense, the Jetta is lighter and has more hp and more torque which equals 15s. Actually the 2533 pounds is the curb weight, its not even the gross weight, so with all the fluids its probabaly even heavier. How come your Jetta is so light, are the older jettas lighter?

I looked up AEM dyno for the stock EX civic, and its 111whp not 115.

 
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I wish I still had that Jetta. Yes they are lighter, plus it was a base model without power windows which had a stock curb weight of 2591 lbs. For daily driving I had removed the spare tire and jack, removed the steel rear bumper reinforcement beam, and the wheels only weighed 11lbs a piece. Also, the aftermarket exhaust and suspension were lighter than the stock parts.

I got rid of the car for two main reasons. First, I wanted a low mileage car. Second, I got sick of replacing blown trannies. The VW stock transmission does not like a lot of abuse.

 
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The impact bumpers are heavy. It would be cool to remove them, but its hard to remove them for a daily driving car.

 
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We are supposed to get into 6th and 7th gen Civic isn't it?

 
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So what can I do to my 7th gen EX to keep up with a 6th gen si? Anything?

We can mod the suspension and wheels, and the 7th gen will have sick sick handling, similar curb weight, bu thte 7th gen has a more rigid chassis. But what can we do about the engine and transmission?

 
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Basically nothing if you keep D17 with no FI. There's a chance if you meet with a stock Si and the driver who drives it knocks the engine(shifting too fast with too little or too much fuel) everytime he shifts into gear then you are going to win.

 
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I know a guy who does that. We raced a Prelude (mine 92 Si, his 00), and I always kept up with him.

 
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Eeeeeeeexcellent... Eeeeeexcellent getting a lil closer.....there's hope.

Would it be too diffucult to drive around with an aftermarket flywheel thats 11 pounds.

 
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Never played with flywheel before, so no idea.

Only know that if the flywheel is too light, it won't hold the torque, causing loss of power.

 
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I had a light fly wheel on a B16A, nothing hard about driving it dialy, you just have to shift quick, a short through shifter is really nice. With the light whieght fly wheel the RPMs will drop quicker, but they will rise quicker too,

 
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Sure? Drop quicker is nice, at least for fast shifting. Thanks JR

 
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This would us 7th gen civic EX guys keep up with the stock 6th gen SI.

 
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The problem is how fast the engine rev up is not proportional to how fast the car will go, sigh.....

 
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Well if you lighten the flywheel, there will be more usable HP to the wheel. You will gain some HP to the wheel.

 
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You are taking off rotational speed off the motor, I'm not sure how much the stock one wieghs, but a general rule of thumb is that 3lb of non moving wieght=1 lb of rotation weight. So if you save 10 lb on your fly wheel, it would have the same effect as dropping 30 lbs off you car. (of course that is just a rule of thumb, not exact) Anyway, my guess is you can save 30lbs else where much cheaper. Taking off your power steering, A/C would help probably just as much, and cost less. This mod is usually one of the last you do in a long string of wieght reduction.

 
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Well, this along won't let you keep up with a 6th gen Si, but certianly every little bit would help.

 
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I would personally try a more aggresive cam with RSX injector or something to that effect before I try this. But that's just me