D17 Turbo VS K20a2 Swap... which is better?
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Originally Posted by shaman
with respect to the comment made above ^^^
"Civic with a stock K20A2 will be faster than a stock RSX-S simply because of the weight difference"
I thought about it and that may not be true... although our cars are lighter.... the k20a2 engine weighs more.... so i am thinking it will balance out... and the weight difference is insignificant
"Civic with a stock K20A2 will be faster than a stock RSX-S simply because of the weight difference"
I thought about it and that may not be true... although our cars are lighter.... the k20a2 engine weighs more.... so i am thinking it will balance out... and the weight difference is insignificant
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Originally Posted by 2K1Civic17"Gabe
I would not say worthless. It isnt any worse than the EX, IMO. They are equally as fast from every race I have done. I have a turbo'd LX, and love it. It has Loooong gears, where the EX has shroter gears. Who really cares about economy vtec, it doesnt mean much. You all take it as its the bombest cuz of VTECH! my ***, my LX seems to make pretty nice power, and would probably kill anybody driving a stock rsx-s or civic swapped with the stock motor.
and dont say, well if you throw a turbo on the K20, than it will be fair race, blah blah. it always turns into that Ive noticed. Im talking stock k20s, as the same with me running 8psi. Good race, but the turbo would win, I would think. Ive raced rsx-s's in my car non turbod, and they were not but a car ahead of me. probably a crappy driver though.
and dont say, well if you throw a turbo on the K20, than it will be fair race, blah blah. it always turns into that Ive noticed. Im talking stock k20s, as the same with me running 8psi. Good race, but the turbo would win, I would think. Ive raced rsx-s's in my car non turbod, and they were not but a car ahead of me. probably a crappy driver though.
K20A2
K-Pro
Quaife LSD
Exedy Hyper Single
Subarus FTW I do NOT miss my civic
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Originally Posted by quick silver
I would have no problem runnin against you, if you are game. My modz are:
K20A2
K-Pro
Quaife LSD
Exedy Hyper Single
K20A2
K-Pro
Quaife LSD
Exedy Hyper Single
You would probably win. I was saying a stock k20 vs turbo d17 running 8psi. The K-Pro and LSD would help you very nicely on beating me, lol. Im still down to race. Where are you in So. Cal? Im in Phoenix, so its probably not too far from ya.
Peace
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Originally Posted by aznboysrfr
no k20 is lighter than any sohc
Originally Posted by shaman
are you sure the weight difference will be significant..... ?
Originally Posted by dezod ON 1/26/05
Vehicle weight, driver weight, brake set-up, wheel size, wheel weight, cooling capacity with different engine bay confinements all play a role as well.....
True-a swap SHOULD reveal more power than the original motor in the car because why would you swap in the first place....ya know?
i.e.-K20 in a EM2 > D17 in an EM2
The curb weight, just taking that alone into account,
The Type S is 2840 lbs
The EX Civic is 2597 lbs
....
True-a swap SHOULD reveal more power than the original motor in the car because why would you swap in the first place....ya know?
i.e.-K20 in a EM2 > D17 in an EM2
The curb weight, just taking that alone into account,
The Type S is 2840 lbs
The EX Civic is 2597 lbs
....
Last edited by dezod; Apr 26, 2005 at 03:39 PM.
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Originally Posted by aznboysrfr
eh .. what I meant to say, was that none of the K series motors are lighter than any given sohc motor
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Rep Power: 278 I suck with all the engine codes, which prevents me from researching this, but has anyone swapped in the Si engine into their Em2? A guy on a local forum is running 300 hp in his si with a cybernation kit, and I just saw one of these engines on ebay for 1400.
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Originally Posted by shaman
"I think the K20A2 may actually be lighter than a D17A1."
^^^ hehe i highly doubt that
^^^ hehe i highly doubt that
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Originally Posted by 2K1Civic17"Gabe
You would probably win. I was saying a stock k20 vs turbo d17 running 8psi. The K-Pro and LSD would help you very nicely on beating me, lol. Im still down to race. Where are you in So. Cal? Im in Phoenix, so its probably not too far from ya.
Peace
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Originally Posted by aznboysrfr
eh .. what I meant to say, was that none of the K series motors are lighter than any given sohc motor
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Originally Posted by PoorCollegeBoy
I suck with all the engine codes, which prevents me from researching this, but has anyone swapped in the Si engine into their Em2? A guy on a local forum is running 300 hp in his si with a cybernation kit, and I just saw one of these engines on ebay for 1400.
As I was reading through this thread I was wondering why nobody was suggesting this. The EP3 engine (02-05 si hatch) is the K20A3. Stock, it puts down about 135-140 hp to the wheels, but you can get these engines relatively cheap compared to the A2 and people have had amazing success with turbos on them.
the cybernation stage 1 turbo kit is going for $3695 through ephatch (that's $100 off) right now and will get you about 260hp to the wheels.
95% of the information I give has been proven ... if I am unsure of something, then I typically don't respond to something. (fyi)
as far as the weight of the engines go, http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=879297
B20vtec = 401 pounds
K20a = 403 pounds
also notice this statement, "The B-Series motor DID have a power steering pump, and the A/C torque mount, so factor in 5 lbs or so on top of the numbers below.."
and if you check out SleepinEP3's post, in this thread, he states that his D16y8 (from intake manifold all the way to oil pan) weighed 300 pounds. the d17 isn't much heavier than a d16 and definitely not as heavy as a k20 or any b series.
in a nutshell ... K series = heavier than D series
as far as the weight of the engines go, http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=879297
B20vtec = 401 pounds
K20a = 403 pounds
also notice this statement, "The B-Series motor DID have a power steering pump, and the A/C torque mount, so factor in 5 lbs or so on top of the numbers below.."
and if you check out SleepinEP3's post, in this thread, he states that his D16y8 (from intake manifold all the way to oil pan) weighed 300 pounds. the d17 isn't much heavier than a d16 and definitely not as heavy as a k20 or any b series.
in a nutshell ... K series = heavier than D series
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Originally Posted by aznboysrfr
ah, okay ... nobody usually agrees with what I have to say, so I found it odd.
unless you weren't actually agreeing, then you can ignore what I just said ...
unless you weren't actually agreeing, then you can ignore what I just said ...
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Originally Posted by bloodzombie
As I was reading through this thread I was wondering why nobody was suggesting this. The EP3 engine (02-05 si hatch) is the K20A3. Stock, it puts down about 135-140 hp to the wheels, but you can get these engines relatively cheap compared to the A2 and people have had amazing success with turbos on them.
the cybernation stage 1 turbo kit is going for $3695 through ephatch (that's $100 off) right now and will get you about 260hp to the wheels.
the cybernation stage 1 turbo kit is going for $3695 through ephatch (that's $100 off) right now and will get you about 260hp to the wheels.
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Originally Posted by gh0st
doesn't the k20a3 have a different compression ratio compared to the a/a2. something along the lines of it doesn't respond too well to boost? either way, i'll pay the difference to run an a2 over an a3 anyday. (if i ever have enough $ to do that to begin with).
So when we talk about building up the internals, what exactly does that mean? Im somewhat of a noob to turbos....Im guessing pistons and rods, but what besides that? I really wish they had a SC for the D series, but as of now it looks like Im gonna swap A3 into my 04 next summer. I dont really care much about track times or racing, I just want some more power to get around in my daily driver. Would the D17 turbo suit my style? That would be my first choice, but everyones saying that even with low boost its not good for an unbuilt D17...I really just wanna be able to roll up on my friends and blow off lol.
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This is what I think:
I will never Turbo or Swap my D17 Civic.
I've just completed my I/H/E p&p head, bored TB (only got Valves, Retainers, Springs to go) and within the next few weeks geting it dyno tuned for a 75 WET SHOT!
I will keep the car untill the engine has just about had it! MAX 2 YEARS!
Then get a S2000 and TURBO THAT!!! That cars worth a TURBO Setup!
I will never Turbo or Swap my D17 Civic.
I've just completed my I/H/E p&p head, bored TB (only got Valves, Retainers, Springs to go) and within the next few weeks geting it dyno tuned for a 75 WET SHOT!
I will keep the car untill the engine has just about had it! MAX 2 YEARS!
Then get a S2000 and TURBO THAT!!! That cars worth a TURBO Setup!
Last edited by Tomola; Apr 28, 2005 at 09:09 AM.
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Originally Posted by sil04ver
So when we talk about building up the internals, what exactly does that mean? Im somewhat of a noob to turbos....Im guessing pistons and rods, but what besides that? ....I just want some more power to get around in my daily driver. Would the D17 turbo suit my style? That would be my first choice, but everyones saying that even with low boost its not good for an unbuilt D17...
These are for a Toyota Supra TT though, going in an IS300. Able to handle up to 1,000 RWHP.
Some people also choose a turbo profiled camshaft. They also do valves & retainers as well, but the basics would be rods & pistons.
a TURBO D17, with this :
installed to make this:
actually makes a VERY nice car. Very fun to drive and pulls quite hard. I loved driving my turbo'd D17. It was the 2nd most fun car I owned to drive. My 1st is the car I own now.
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Originally Posted by Tomola
This is what I think:
I will never Turbo or Swap my D17 Civic.
I've just completed my I/H/E p&p head, bored TB (only got Valves, Retainers, Springs to go) and within the next few weeks geting it dyno tuned for a 75 WET SHOT!
I will keep the car untill the engine has just about had it! MAX 2 YEARS!
Then get a S2000 and TURBO THAT!!! That cars worth a TURBO Setup!
I will never Turbo or Swap my D17 Civic.
I've just completed my I/H/E p&p head, bored TB (only got Valves, Retainers, Springs to go) and within the next few weeks geting it dyno tuned for a 75 WET SHOT!
I will keep the car untill the engine has just about had it! MAX 2 YEARS!
Then get a S2000 and TURBO THAT!!! That cars worth a TURBO Setup!
hopefully not on stock internals. (s2000)
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Re: D17 Turbo VS K20a2 Swap... which is better?
i hate to revive an ancient post, but i was having this continued debate with a member just last night. He was asking me if its better to do a D17a2 turbo or an K20a2 swap.
And from personal experience (i attempted a swap last year), it is alot easier and cheaper to go with a d17 turbo, then it is to do a k20a2 swap. Mind you i agree that when its all said and done, you can get alot more out of a k20a2 or possibly a k20a3 turbo.
But if money is an issue, i definately recommend a turbo setup
And from personal experience (i attempted a swap last year), it is alot easier and cheaper to go with a d17 turbo, then it is to do a k20a2 swap. Mind you i agree that when its all said and done, you can get alot more out of a k20a2 or possibly a k20a3 turbo.
But if money is an issue, i definately recommend a turbo setup
Last edited by shaman; Apr 9, 2007 at 08:43 PM.
