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I’m getting ready to do a clutch replacement in an 02 coupe, but after reading many guides and watching many videos there is one thing I don’t yet understand.

How do you drop the subframe while supporting the transmission from underneath? I was thinking to support the engine and tranny with my floor jack and the jack included in the trunk, but when I drop the subframe how will I remove it? The subframe is a loop or circle and will be around the jacks supporting the tranny and or engine.

I’m sure some will say you can do the job without removing the transmission, but I’d like to get it out to do a thorough cleaning and inspection, might even open it up to replace the input shaft bearing.

Thank in advance for the help!

 
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Remove front/rear engine mounts. Unbolt control arms and sway bar links. Unbolt and remove subframe. Then support the engine and unbolt/remove the transmission.

Alternatively, I believe you can pull the transmission out the top if you remove the water outlet from the end of the head.

 
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Thanks for the reply Brotato. I thought the subframe supports the engine and transmission, Can you just remove it without supporting the weight of the engine and transmission?

 
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The mounts on the frame rails will hold them. The mounts at the rad support and firewall are attached to the subframe. I went out the top with i did my clutch and trans swap. I didn't want to mess with the subframe

 
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I thought about out from the top, but seams like you'd need a lift to get it out...

 
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How much additional stuff needs to be removed to get it out from the top?

 
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Also curious if most people consider replacing the input shaft bearing in the transmission housing when doing the clutch. Seems like its pretty straightforward, and parts are pretty cheap. Given you have the tranny out... worth it?

Thanks!

 
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I will leave this to @Colin42. I haven't done it.

I believe he was referring to the pilot bearing. The input shaft bearing requires the transmission to be opened and disassembled. The pilot bearing goes in the end of the crankshaft, the tip of the input shaft slides into it when mated to the engine. It's worth replacing while you're there.

 
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Thanks for the reply Brotato... I was actually referring to the input shaft bearing the requires the transmission to be opened up and disassembled as you pointed out. Eric (the car guy) mentioned it was a common problem with the 7th gens in the video below, and it looked like a pretty straightforward fix to do while you have the tranny out of the car.

,

 
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If you're comfortable opening the transmission then go right ahead. I never had any issues with mine after 250k miles.

 
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Just the water passage and upper rad hose, car is probably due for a coolant change anyways

If you're comfortable taking the trans apart go for it

 
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Radiator was flushed very recently. Thinking the best way for me, might be to go out the bottom still...

 
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With the steering rack mounted to the firewall (as opposed to the subframe), it's really not too difficult to pull the subframe.

On my '03 CRV I dropped the subframe and pulled the transmission in an hour and 15 minutes. Granted, not the same as the Civic but shares the same chassis. Engine/transmission are reversed. Also granted, this is far from my first rodeo.

 
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Good to know Brotato! This will be my son's first rodeo... But I'll be there to give him a hand.

 
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Good luck to you. Remove the two lower control arm bolts and disconnect the sway bar from both sides. You may have to unbolt the sway bar from the subframe as well. If I remember correctly the sway bar goes over top the exhaust for some stupid reason. You can then pop the axles out of the transmission and swing the control arms out of the way. Then it's just front and rear engine mount, and unbolt the subframe.

If you go this route, you must support the engine with a floor jack or something when removing the transmission. Use a chunk of wood between the jack and oil pan. If you have a D17a1 with the steel oil pan, don't go in the middle or you'll bend the pan and possibly block the oil pick up. This shouldn't be an issue on the D17a2 with the aluminum oil pan.

 
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Thanks again for the reply. This gets to the original intent of my post. I was having trouble understanding how to put a jack under the engine, and still get the subframe out. Still not sure I get it...

 
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Refer back to previous replies.

Engine/transmission are held in with four mounts. Driver side going from the engine to the chassis "frame", passenger side going from the transmission to the chassis "frame", front going to the subframe, and rear going to the subframe. The two mounts on the driver and passenger side will hold the engine/transmission in place by themselves.

1. Remove everything I mentioned in my previous replies (control arms, sway bar, etc.)
2. Unbolt the front and rear engine mounts.
3. Remove the subframe.
4. Now support the engine and remove the passenger side mount.
5. Separate the engine/transmission and lower the transmission out the bottom.

 
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^^^^^ Exactly what I came for. Thank you so much!

 
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Now just hope none of the control arms bolts are seized to the bushings. Fixing those is a PITA.

 
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Another reason i went out the top, didn't want to damage the balljoint boots, or have the control arm bolts be seized

 
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Okay, officially going to start this repair this week. Doing the timing belt (got an oil leak from either the cam seal, crankshaft seal or oil pump) and replacing the clutch and oil pan gasket...

Last question I have is regarding timing. If I am supporting the engine by the oil pan, how/when do I replace the oil pan gasket?

Note, also replacing the shocks on all 4 corners with Tein Flex Zs...

 
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Thinking maybe I replace the oil pan gasket first, put the oil pan back on, then get started on the clutch...

 
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Either after you remove the subframe but before you drop the transmission, or after you re-install the transmission but before installing the subframe.

What trim is your Civic? EX trims with the aluminum oil pan don't have a pan gasket, just RTV.

 
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That makes perfect sense. It’s an LX couple. Interesting that EX is RTV only. Wonder why there’s a difference. It’s the same engine right? I’ve got another 2002 Civic that’s an EX sedan.

 
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EX is the "Sporty" version (without considering the Si, of course), so they might have thought the aluminum pan reduces weight?
Unsure why no RTV...

 
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Aluminum vs steel pan

 
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So, got everything done, but ran into some major problems... Here's the message I sent to the Honda service center in advance of our appointment on Monday. Any advice appreciated...

History:

• We just bought the car a couple of weeks ago. It had signs of significant oil leaking at the oil pan and timing belt cover that we discovered after purchasing. (Shame on us). We did a lot of service on the vehicle, all per the honda service manual specifications, but we have an even bigger leak now, coming from the same area.

• We did a full timing belt service to inspect where the leak was coming from. Upon inspection, it appeared the leak was coming from the oil pump, near the back of the engine block, so we went in to replace the oil pump o-ring that sits in between the oil pump and the block.

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  • We torqued the 5 oil pump bolts to spec (Honda service manual), and used Hondabond RTV as suggested by the Honda service manual between the oil pump and the block, ensuring that we carefully cleaned off all prior RTV from the mating surfaces.
  • While doing this service, we ran into a couple of problems:

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    1. Since we had already replaced the crankshaft seal, when reinstalling the oil pump, we did not notice that the oil pump was not aligned with the flat sides of the crankshaft, and as we screwed it down, we stripped out the threads in one of the 5 oil pump fastener holes. the one on the bottom right, circled in red in the attached picture. We fixed this using a helicoil kit to match the original bolt (Heli-Coil Thread Inserts 5546-6). This worked well and the bolt held the torque specs required by the service manual.
    2. We ended up attempting to install the oil pump numerous times, given the stripped bolt, each time removing the hondabond RTV and re-applying. The service manual states that you should put hondabond into the threads on the bolt holes. We think that over the several times of installing the pump, we got too much hondabond in the whole circled in blue in the diagram, that when we torqued the bolt down to the specified torque, a little chip of the aluminum engine block at the back of where the bolt hole is, broke off of the engine. We JB Welded this chip back in place. Multiple layers of JB weld. As we thought about it, we didn't think oil could get in to this bolt hole, but I suppose it is possible, though this does not appear to be where the oil is coming from.

• While doing the timing belt we replaced the following items:

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  • Camshaft seal (didn't appear to be leaking)
  • Crankshaft seal (didn't appear to be leaking)
  • Water pump and water pump o-ring (Aisin, honda OEM)
  • Auto-tensioner, spring and tensioner bolt.
  • Timing belt, steering pump belt, alternator/AC belt
  • Lower timing belt cover
  • Oil pump o-ring
  • oil pan gasket
  • valve cover gasket and seals
  • We also put in new coilovers, a new clutch, clutch plate, flywheel, throw-out bearing, rear main seal, axle seals, input shaft bearing (inside the transmission). It's been a lot of work.

Hoping to find the source of this major oil leak and find a way to fix it permanently.