Rep Power: 0

I'm about to replace my oil pump in my 2001 LX. The "frigging bastage" o-ring is leaking and I'm losing probably 3/4 quart per 3K miles. However, probably about 3 mos ago it made a sound one day that sounded like a "knack, knack" for probably 5 sec as I started driving it after cold. It increased slightly with gas.

Went away, didn't come back. Just started again the other day but again, gone and I can't get it to repeat. After research it looks like Rod Bearings are the likely cause so I'm thinking the dorked up Oil Pump may have led to more wear, or maybe just old car disease (160K). Questions:

1) Could I just try and fix the oil pump and see how she goes or should I go ahead and just do the rod bearings also. Meaning, if it made that noise are they pretty much toast? I'm thinking that I may have hope for the crank if I go this route. If I pull the pan and inspect them, what should I be looking for?

2) If I replace them, one thing I'm confused about it is it sounds like I have to pull the pan (regardless) to get the code. Then order the bearings. Then put them in and measure clearance with Plastigage. Then hope like mad that it is OK because if not I have to try a different set of bearings. My question is, how do others do this...seems like a lot of trial and error with 8 bearings that can't be returned?

Thanks for any help you can provide.

 
Rep Power: 518

Loose and worn bearings tend to make MORE noise (increase in intensity) as the engine warms and the oil thins out.

Noises that happen only when the engine is started cold and slowly diminish as the engine warms up are more likely to be piston (piston slap) and/or carbon buildup related.

A noise that lasted for 5 seconds might have nothing to do with either of the above, and was the result of your filter and oil galleries draining out after sitting for a length of time. It may take a few seconds to refill the filter and all of the oil passages after the engine starts and the oil pump starts working, circulating the oil.

 
Rep Power: 0

Thanks, ezone. So basically, would just shoot for the oil pump changeout and play it by ear. Here's another question - I started looking at the cost of the reman oil pump plus rod bearings and started thinking, dang, how much would a new reman engine be!? I looked at JDM and they have a D17 but it is an EX, SOHC, VTEC. I'm thinking all I have to change is my ECU but not sure. So bascially, I'd be looking at $450 engine, $190 shipping, $125 for ECU (automotix.net). Doesn't seem too bad given that I may have problems down the road anyway. Do you know what else I would have to change out to make it work? I'd probably prefer an LX but that's all they have in stock.

 
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ezone - I found a youtube of the sound - this sounds exactly like mine only it is just as I'm starting out in first gear.

[autostream]http://autostream.com/ibcivicforums/?page_type=firebirdplayerthumbnail&framepage=1423& transactionid=1377284259-9819999112&posted_by=_www.civicforums.com&youtube_ video_id=haAYUsdFB2A[/autostream]

 
Rep Power: 518

If you are only dealing with a leak, then just replace the seals and shove it back together.
If you think there is a pressure problem, then do an oil pressure check and see if there is really anything to be concerned with. Probably won't be.

How about just get the used engine, then swap your EX head over to the used block and reinstall? That way everything else stays the same, harnesses and PCM remain the same.

I think that's an awful lot of work to just reseal an oil pump that's leaking though.

 
Rep Power: 512

Sounds like the engine knock I had earlier this year. Started off just when I started my car. Got worse and the knock was all the time. Swapped my bottom end and now it's running happy. Found metal flakes in the oil left in the head, and my vtec solenoid filter was completely covered in metal flakes.

I still haven't pulled the block apart, but I imagine some of the main/rod bearings are done.

 
Rep Power: 0

Thanks - those are good points. On the leak, the dealership just said that I needed to rebuild the oil pump. Unfortunately, I didn't ask why. Before I swapped my transmission I checked the oil pressure and it was fine - maybe a bit on the low end but still within the service limit. That dang o-ring is what got me though. I will check the pressure again and see where I'm at and decide if I need to change the pump out.

Any ideas on the noise?

 
Rep Power: 0

I'm still curious on question #2 below - is that how the bearings are replaced...just by trial and error? It seems like it could get expensive.

 
Rep Power: 518

You, as a person, aren't going to rebuild the pump. Neither is anyone at the dealership. The only things that would be done are to replace the entire unit, or reseal it. I'm sure they would only reseal it, no matter what the voicebox on the phone told you.

If you really want to know, each part is plastigauged to check oil clearance and each bearing is then selected to obtain the minimum desired oil clearance. This should be explained in a service manual.......

During a real-world rebuild, the parts (crank, block, rods, etc.) are all sent to a machine shop (we don't have the facilities to do machine work on the premises here). They do the measuring, the machine work, and they pick the bearing set to go back in it.

At the dealer I'm in, we don't really rebuild much. It's unit replacement for the most part here. Either new or used or reman, whatever is cheapest 98% of the time.

 
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Alright, that helps. I looked in the SM and it basically says to keep changing them until the right size is found and if not to replace the crank. Seemed like a lot of bearings for the average joe. I think I will check the oil pressure and if it seems OK I will go for the o-ring. That's pretty cheap for now. If the noise continues (thoughts on the noise btw?) I will go for the reman/swap.

 
Rep Power: 518

Man, I gave up on trying to listen to videos on here long ago. Too many variables.

The video sounds like it's noise is piston related. Carbon buildup would be my first guess.......but it's damn tough to tell without hearing it first hand.

Cheapest suggestion, if that is the case, would be to use Top Tier gas.
http://www.toptiergas.com/retailers.html

Next might be a Top-End cleaner.

 
Rep Power: 0

17 psig at idle, 70 psig at 3000 rpm. Oil pressure threads were dorked up when I pulled it, but the 1/8 x 27 went in ok. Hope I didn't dork up the block. What's the trick on pulling the sensor?! The intake manifold is in the way.

OK - came down to 14 psig at idle but still over the 10 psig in the manual. Is that too low?

 
Rep Power: 518

Numbers posted look OK to me. I'd run it as-is.

 
Rep Power: 0

Thanks, ezone. I'm gonna torture that little o-ring when I get it out of there.