Engine Post your engine related problems in this section. Engines will cover from Fuel, Engine, Cooling, Exhaust physical related items.

Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Feb 3, 2023
  #1  
mkeschinger's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered!!
 
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 47
Likes: 4
Rep Power: 0
mkeschinger is an unknown quantity at this point
Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

I searched and can't find anything . After the car warms up a bit, there is a knocking on the driver side of the engine, only when I accelerate and the speed doesn't change, only gets louder as I throttle harder. I say it like that because I can use the cable by the throttle body to duplicate it and verify it's in the engine bay, not inside as I previously thought. Happens when the car isn't moving.
Here are the prelims-
2001 civic ex coupe
things related to possible knock-new plugs, cleaned coils- ps fluid fine, ac pulley bypassed with a shorter belt(done by previous owner) belt looks ok, ps pulley tight, belt tight, checked the bolts on the ps unit and they are ok. checked the adjustment bracket- good, checked the PS reservoir- good.
I used my screwdriver stethoscope and it seems like the knocking is coming from the area of the metal near where the engine mount is on that side. I originally thought PS because of where it was coming from, but it doesn't sound like it. I'm new but I would think if it was engine, the sound would be constant and the speed would increase as I used the throttle.
Any help would be good and welcome! Or I cave in and go to the shop...

Thanks!
Reply
Old Feb 3, 2023
  #2  
Colin42's Avatar
"Marge, anyone could miss Canada! All tucked away down there."
 
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 9,636
Likes: 1,283
From: Barrie, ON Canada
Rep Power: 222
Colin42 is a name known to allColin42 is a name known to allColin42 is a name known to allColin42 is a name known to allColin42 is a name known to allColin42 is a name known to allColin42 is a name known to all
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

If you feel like pulling the oil pan off you can check the rod bearings. Or get your oil analyzed.
Reply
Old Feb 3, 2023
  #3  
Wankenstein's Avatar
OF top 99.5% creator (Formerly of the Puffinblunts variety)
 
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 3,634
Likes: 109
Rep Power: 210
Wankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud of
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

Please post a video of the noise here.

Do a motor/transmission mounts test.
Use a helper. One person remains in the driver seat for tests.

First, with engine off, car in neutral, from the front of the car push it backwards. If you hear metal tapping it's a bad mount.

After that test next involve engine on, parking lot or open space to test (not near house/garage) one person stand to the side of the engine bay (never in front of behind car). Driver engaged brake pedal first and then puts the transmission in forward gear while brake pedal still held down. Rev engine slightly while still in forward gear and brake engaged. Listen for tapping and look to see if engine lifts up higher than normal.
Let car rest a bit in neutral and try the same procedure in reverse gear, brake engaged.
Reply
Old Feb 4, 2023
  #4  
mkeschinger's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered!!
 
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 47
Likes: 4
Rep Power: 0
mkeschinger is an unknown quantity at this point
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

hey, I forgot to record the sound, but I will do that tomorrow. It does it when the car is not moving as well. I can throttle up from the engine and cause it. It's a manual so it happens in neutral, with the ebrake on as well. It happens moving forward or backward with the car on, only after it warms up a bit. Thanks for the help! Looking forward to getting it settled.
Reply
Old Feb 5, 2023
  #5  
Wankenstein's Avatar
OF top 99.5% creator (Formerly of the Puffinblunts variety)
 
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 3,634
Likes: 109
Rep Power: 210
Wankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud of
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

Watch videos or follow the procedure I listed for testing engine mounts. Engines will lift a bit even with good motor mounts. It's excessive lifting you are looking for. Loud metallic tapping along with excessive lift or engine sag to one side are sure signs of mount failure.

Rod knock is a serious issue and shouldn't be driving it all if that's the issue. Read https://blog.1aauto.com/what-is-rod-...0are%20driving.

Some say rod knocking causes blindness (author WANKENstein) 😄

Last edited by Wankenstein; Feb 5, 2023 at 01:30 AM.
Reply
Old Feb 5, 2023
  #6  
mkeschinger's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered!!
 
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 47
Likes: 4
Rep Power: 0
mkeschinger is an unknown quantity at this point
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

ok. I tried to do a longer video on the phone, but the file size was too large, then had to find a converter. Hope this works.

Attached Files
File Type: mov
20230205_110940.mov (6.17 MB, 84 views)
Reply
Old Feb 5, 2023
  #7  
Wankenstein's Avatar
OF top 99.5% creator (Formerly of the Puffinblunts variety)
 
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 3,634
Likes: 109
Rep Power: 210
Wankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud ofWankenstein has much to be proud of
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

One option is to link YouTube of issues.

Sounds like engine noise and not mounts. Hard to tell from video, very well could be rod knock. Hopefully others will chime in with an opinion.

Might be loose valve(s). How many miles since the last valve (job) lash? Do you know how to check them?
​​​​​​

Last edited by Wankenstein; Feb 5, 2023 at 06:56 PM.
Reply
Old Feb 6, 2023
  #8  
mkeschinger's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered!!
 
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 47
Likes: 4
Rep Power: 0
mkeschinger is an unknown quantity at this point
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

Last valve job? No idea. I bought this around Christmas and have been working on it. I don't know that it's EVER had one. I will look into those. Will that make me go blind too?
Thanks for the help.
Reply
Old Feb 14, 2023
  #9  
mkeschinger's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered!!
 
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 47
Likes: 4
Rep Power: 0
mkeschinger is an unknown quantity at this point
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

Well, the good news. It's not the timing belt .. The bad news- brought it to a mechanic, who admittedly doesn't do a lot of honda stuff or engine rebuilds- says it's coming from lower in the engine , so valve train is out. But said it may be a bearing or the crankshaft. Changed the oil to a thicker one and it lowered the sounds a little. They say it would take taking apart the engine, which he doesn't do, and possibly doing a rebuild or a swap . Guess it's time to look up what's in the lower part of the engine or crankshaft... Open to ideas or feedback.
Thanks for the help!

M
Reply
Old Feb 14, 2023
  #10  
Colin42's Avatar
"Marge, anyone could miss Canada! All tucked away down there."
 
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 9,636
Likes: 1,283
From: Barrie, ON Canada
Rep Power: 222
Colin42 is a name known to allColin42 is a name known to allColin42 is a name known to allColin42 is a name known to allColin42 is a name known to allColin42 is a name known to allColin42 is a name known to all
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

Probably a lot cheaper and easier to just dump another engine in.
Reply
Old Feb 15, 2023
  #11  
BrotatoChip's Avatar
Super Moderator
 
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,073
Likes: 2,096
From: Ohio
Rep Power: 224
BrotatoChip has much to be proud ofBrotatoChip has much to be proud ofBrotatoChip has much to be proud ofBrotatoChip has much to be proud ofBrotatoChip has much to be proud ofBrotatoChip has much to be proud ofBrotatoChip has much to be proud ofBrotatoChip has much to be proud ofBrotatoChip has much to be proud ofBrotatoChip has much to be proud ofBrotatoChip has much to be proud of
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

If it were main crankshaft bearings or rod bearings, there would be metal flakes in the oil. You could send an oil sample to Blackstone labs to be analyzed. That would rule out a bearing failure.
Reply
Old Feb 15, 2023
  #12  
mkeschinger's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered!!
 
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 47
Likes: 4
Rep Power: 0
mkeschinger is an unknown quantity at this point
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

Originally Posted by BrotatoChip
If it were main crankshaft bearings or rod bearings, there would be metal flakes in the oil. You could send an oil sample to Blackstone labs to be analyzed. That would rule out a bearing failure.
there are metal flakes unfortunately...
Reply
Old Feb 15, 2023
  #13  
mkeschinger's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered!!
 
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 47
Likes: 4
Rep Power: 0
mkeschinger is an unknown quantity at this point
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

Originally Posted by Colin42
Probably a lot cheaper and easier to just dump another engine in.
I was researching engines- will a JDM from japan fit in here without modification? I found one with an AC compressor for a grand plus shipping on ebay. Honestly, that would fix 2 problems for the price of one.
Reply
Old Feb 15, 2023
  #14  
FRSam's Avatar
Click Here
 
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 3,570
Likes: 1,349
From: Calgary, Alberta
Rep Power: 125
FRSam is a glorious beacon of lightFRSam is a glorious beacon of lightFRSam is a glorious beacon of lightFRSam is a glorious beacon of lightFRSam is a glorious beacon of lightFRSam is a glorious beacon of light
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

Originally Posted by mkeschinger
I was researching engines- will a JDM from japan fit in here without modification? I found one with an AC compressor for a grand plus shipping on ebay. Honestly, that would fix 2 problems for the price of one.
A JDM D17A is identical to the D17A2 in your car. It is a direct replacement.
Reply
Old Feb 15, 2023
  #15  
mkeschinger's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered!!
 
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 47
Likes: 4
Rep Power: 0
mkeschinger is an unknown quantity at this point
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

Originally Posted by FRSam
A JDM D17A is identical to the D17A2 in your car. It is a direct replacement.
OK, might be something to look at then. The person who had this before me pretty much trashed the car. I need to decide if it's worth putting more money into it or just run it til it dies.... Bought it for 1k, put 4k into it already...
Reply
Old Feb 15, 2023
  #16  
mkeschinger's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered!!
 
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 47
Likes: 4
Rep Power: 0
mkeschinger is an unknown quantity at this point
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

Originally Posted by mkeschinger
there are metal flakes unfortunately...
I called the shop that looked at it. Confirmed they were silverish flakes. Does the color or metal help determine what part is failing?

Reply
Old Feb 15, 2023
  #17  
xRiCeBoYx's Avatar
Administrator
Hey! Look At Me!! I'm a Supporting Member!!
Administrator
iTrader: (22)
 
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 21,620
Likes: 1,252
From: Las Vegas, NV
Rep Power: 511
xRiCeBoYx has a reputation beyond reputexRiCeBoYx has a reputation beyond reputexRiCeBoYx has a reputation beyond reputexRiCeBoYx has a reputation beyond reputexRiCeBoYx has a reputation beyond reputexRiCeBoYx has a reputation beyond reputexRiCeBoYx has a reputation beyond reputexRiCeBoYx has a reputation beyond reputexRiCeBoYx has a reputation beyond reputexRiCeBoYx has a reputation beyond reputexRiCeBoYx has a reputation beyond repute
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

Nah, not really. It's almost certainly a bearing issue, likely a wiped main bearing. About the most you can figure out without an engine teardown is (kinda) figure out how many rods are affected.

I had the same deal, happened in neutral, stopped, driving, but the one constant was that the frequency varied with engine RPM. I let it idle and counted every 4th knock for 15 seconds (every 4th because the frequency was too fast to count every knock and having been a band nerd in high school, counting by 4's came naturally to me). Took that number, multiplied by 16 (one factor of 4 because it was every 4th knock I counted, and another factor of 4 to get a full minute worth of counts). Final number I got was consistent with idle RPM, which told me it was theoretically one rod that was affected.

Nevertheless, my fix was swapping out the entire bottom end because I had spare bottom end lying around (I had a full engine, but the head was already removed and swapped from a previous head gasket change). I considered just changing out the just the bearings, but I didn't feel like doing a teardown on the affected block and figuring out what color bearings to buy.

edit: if you wanna compare your noise to the noise my car had, here's what mine sounded like
Reply
Old Feb 15, 2023
  #18  
mkeschinger's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered!!
 
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 47
Likes: 4
Rep Power: 0
mkeschinger is an unknown quantity at this point
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

Originally Posted by xRiCeBoYx
Nah, not really. It's almost certainly a bearing issue, likely a wiped main bearing. About the most you can figure out without an engine teardown is (kinda) figure out how many rods are affected.

I had the same deal, happened in neutral, stopped, driving, but the one constant was that the frequency varied with engine RPM. I let it idle and counted every 4th knock for 15 seconds (every 4th because the frequency was too fast to count every knock and having been a band nerd in high school, counting by 4's came naturally to me). Took that number, multiplied by 16 (one factor of 4 because it was every 4th knock I counted, and another factor of 4 to get a full minute worth of counts). Final number I got was consistent with idle RPM, which told me it was theoretically one rod that was affected.

Nevertheless, my fix was swapping out the entire bottom end because I had spare bottom end lying around (I had a full engine, but the head was already removed and swapped from a previous head gasket change). I considered just changing out the just the bearings, but I didn't feel like doing a teardown on the affected block and figuring out what color bearings to buy.

edit: if you wanna compare your noise to the noise my car had, here's what mine sounded like
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUuRwnIf8GE
It's close. Yours changes frequency, mine just gets louder. It doesn't change speed or frequency. It just gets louder when I accelerate. When it's at idle, nothing. Let got of the throttle, nothing. If I hold the throttle, it's constant. until around 50mph or so, then I can't hear it. Could be the magic spot where the engine hides it, which is what my guess is. I figured if it were a rod, it would be there and change speed/frequency as I accelerated. But nope... UGH!!! But other than that, it snowed here in Tucson this morning... Must be a cold day. .

M
Reply
Old Feb 19, 2023
  #19  
mkeschinger's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered!!
 
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 47
Likes: 4
Rep Power: 0
mkeschinger is an unknown quantity at this point
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

ok. Going to check 1 more thing. well 2 more... Had another mechanic look at it and he thinks it may be the water pump, given the location of where the sound is coming from. He listened to the pan to see if it was echoing in there and it wasn't so,going to check the water pump as the belt may be tight, but there may be a wobble under load.. and take the pan off and check the bearings anyway, just to be sure. Will keep you posted.
Reply
Old Mar 7, 2023
  #20  
mkeschinger's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered!!
 
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 47
Likes: 4
Rep Power: 0
mkeschinger is an unknown quantity at this point
re: Another knocking question... [solved rod bearing]

Well, it turns out- the water pump was going bad so replacing it was a good thing anyway.
That being said. It was the #1 rod bearing. It was in the beginning stages so it wasn't constant, only as it got a little warmer.
But, replaced all of the, just to be safe. SO, all better on that end. Next- find the power steering leak and adjust the clutch to I don't need to peg the floor to engage it.
Thanks for all the help!
Reply
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Honda Civic Forum
Replies
Last Post
nyckid
Engine
0
Mar 18, 2016 09:49 AM
Gtwn-civic
Mechanical Problems/Vehicle Issues and Fix-it Forum
4
Apr 18, 2012 02:10 AM
civicdynamo
1st - 5th Generation Civic 1973 - 1995
0
Sep 5, 2011 01:19 AM
sniperscout
General Honda Civic Forum Archive.
9
May 22, 2008 06:44 AM
BumpinCivic2k1
Suspension Performance Modifications
22
Aug 12, 2004 07:51 AM




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:30 PM.