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4th Amendment

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Old Sep 6, 2003
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4th Amendment

I posted this a while back, but now that there is a forum. I can target a more select audiance of individuals. Such as those that think the police have limitless power.

The Fourth Amendment to the Bill of Rights of the United States Constitution states:

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

The Fifth Amendment reads, in part, "No person shall be...compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law...." These amendments provide the foundation for the rights that protect all U.S. Citizens from intrusive law enforcement practices.

1. Don't Leave Contraband in Plain View
Although law enforcement officers must obtain a warrant before they can conduct a privacy-invading search, any illicit material that can be plainly seen by any person from a non-intrusive vantage point is subject to confiscation. An arrest and a valid warrant to search the rest of the area is likely to ensue. A "roach" in the ashtray, a pipe or baggie on the coffee table, or a joint being smoked in public are common mistakes which all too-frequently lead to arrests.

2. Don't Put Anything Incriminating Into the Trash
Various courts have ruled that law enforcement officers are allowed to rummage through curbside trash bags without a warrant. A few seeds or stems can then be used as a basis for obtaining a warrant to search the individual's home. In fact, anything discarded into the public domain can be picked up by the police and used as evidence.

3. Never Consent to a Search
Many individuals arrested on marijuana charges could have avoided that arrest by exercising their Fourth Amendment rights. If a law enforcement officer asks permission to search, it is usually because: (1) there is not enough evidence to obtain a search warrant; or (2) the officer does not feel like going through the hassle of obtaining a warrant. Law enforcement officers are trained to intimidate people into consenting to searches. If an individual does consent, he waives his constitutional protection and the officers may search and seize items without further authorization. If officers find contraband, they will arrest the person.

If an individual does not consent to a search, the officer must either release the person or detain the person and attempt to get a warrant. The fact that an individual refuses to consent does not give the officer grounds to obtain a warrant. The individual should politely say, "I do not consent to a search of my person, belongings, home, or vehicle. I retain my Fourth Amendment rights and all other rights under the United States Constitution. I will say nothing until my attorney is present."

If the officer conducts a search anyway, without a warrant, any contraband will likely be declared invalid evidence by the judge, and any charges will probably be dropped. If the officer does attempt to obtain a warrant and is successful in doing so, the validity of the warrant can still be challenged in court. It is always better to refuse to consent to a search.

4. Don't Answer Questions Without Your Attorney Present
Whether arrested or not, individuals should always exercise the right to remain silent. Anything a person says to law enforcement officers, reporters, cell mates, or even their friends can be used as evidence against him or her. Individuals have the right to have an attorney present during questioning. The right to remain silent should always be exercised.

5. Determining if You Can Leave
A person may terminate an encounter with officers unless the person is being detained under police custody or has been arrested. If the person cannot tell whether he or she may leave, the person can ask officers, "Am I under arrest or otherwise detained?" If the answer is, "No," the person may leave.

6. Do Not Be Hostile; Do Not Physically Resist
There are times when individuals politely assert their rights and refuse to consent to a search but the officers nonetheless proceed to detain, search, or arrest them. In such cases, it is important not to physically resist. Rather, the individual might say, "Do what you feel you must; I will not physically resist. However, I do not consent to this." The individual can later challenge the search in court.

7. Informing on Others
The police and prosecutors often try to pressure individuals into providing information that would lead to the arrest and conviction of others. Threats and promises by police and prosecutors should be viewed with caution and skepticism. Decisions should only be made after consulting with an experienced criminal defense attorney and examining one's own conscience.

Consider downloading this bustcard. Even if you do not engage in "criminal" activity its a good idea for everyone to know their rights. The police will ofcourse try and pressure you remeber your rights and be safe!
http://www.aclu.org/library/bustcard.html
- Quoted from Marijuana.com
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Old Sep 6, 2003
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aghhh that made me dizzy. but i somewhat understand it. thanks for the info
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Old Sep 6, 2003
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the constitution rocks.!
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Old Sep 6, 2003
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just say no and watch were u put ur stach
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Old Sep 10, 2003
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Or just dont break the law.

Just thought i'd throw that out there!
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Old Sep 11, 2003
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I agree with not breaking the law, but some laws should not exist, so I refuse to follow them. And I will refuse until the day I die, or the government figures it out.

Originally posted by Narc
Or just dont break the law.

Just thought i'd throw that out there!
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Old Sep 11, 2003
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my friend has a manila envelope with his aunties address and stamps on it... whenever he gets pulled over he puts anything incriminating inside and seals it before the cop comes... apparently they cannot open it because it is property of USPS and it is a federal offense for the officer to open it without a warrent. is this true?
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Old Sep 12, 2003
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Originally posted by seijin_av
my friend has a manila envelope with his aunties address and stamps on it... whenever he gets pulled over he puts anything incriminating inside and seals it before the cop comes... apparently they cannot open it because it is property of USPS and it is a federal offense for the officer to open it without a warrent. is this true?
i dont' know if its true or not, but if it is, how sweet is that??!! thats pretty cool. im sure that there are ways around this, as with all things in the law.
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Old Sep 12, 2003
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Originally posted by Diemos
I agree with not breaking the law, but some laws should not exist, so I refuse to follow them. And I will refuse until the day I die, or the government figures it out.

Good luck with that.
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Old Sep 13, 2003
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Thanx, im movin to canada soon, so no longer will my ideals be persecuted with such great force.

Originally posted by Narc
Good luck with that.
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Old Sep 14, 2003
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Please don't. We have enough problems as it is.
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Old Sep 14, 2003
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Too late, already applied for permenant residence.

Originally posted by Narc
Please don't. We have enough problems as it is.
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Old Sep 14, 2003
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The laws in Canada aren't that disimilar from those in the US. The only thing that brings it down is the "Young Offenders Act" which basically gives young people under the age of 18 (I think it's 18) the carte-blanche to do what they want because they'll get merely a slap on the wrist for it...sucks if you ask me.

Diemos: Depending on where you're moving to it might be a good idea to learn French first.
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Old Sep 14, 2003
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I am moving with a friend, he speaks french fluently. Although, I dont think we will be moving to a french area. It takes approximately 4 years to earn citizenship once you get to canada, so we will have a long while to wait.

EDIT: We are going for mainly research. We intend on growing a variety of plants, and different organisms that are illegal in the united states.

Originally posted by Pharoh
The laws in Canada aren't that disimilar from those in the US. The only thing that brings it down is the "Young Offenders Act" which basically gives young people under the age of 18 (I think it's 18) the carte-blanche to do what they want because they'll get merely a slap on the wrist for it...sucks if you ask me.

Diemos: Depending on where you're moving to it might be a good idea to learn French first.
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Old Sep 14, 2003
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It's not that hard to become a Canadian Citizen here..I wish they would screen them a little better..For example:

This guy I know moved here from Lebanon with his wife. He worked under the table for years and collected welfare at the same time. He pumped out three kids so he could get all the Child benefits from the government....Then he sent all the money back to Lebanon to get a huge house built and moved his back there about a week ago...Wtf! I can't beleive this wasn't detected sooner...

Being somewhat billingual in some provinces will land you better jobs as your friend will probably tell you.

The number one bonus about Canada is the Health Care system. You pay higher taxes for it but it's a great trade off to be sure.
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Old Sep 14, 2003
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Hey Pharoh, dont know if you heard but the Young Offenders Act has recently been replaced with the Youth Criminal Justice Act. The act now clearly states that an officer MUST NOT charge a youth with a criminal offence unless it is violent in nature, or there exist factors which would make "extra-judicial measures" not applicable (ie has been cautioned for the offence in the past)

If you thought kids could get away with crap before, wait till kids find out about this.

For example, lets say I catch a couple of 17 year olds smashing your car window, geting in and stealing your sterio and causing heavy damage o the interior. Assuming the've never been caught for this before, I could not lay a charge if I wanted to.

IMO Canada is the best country to live in, but the judicial process is greatly flawed.
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Old Sep 14, 2003
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Originally posted by Narc
Hey Pharoh, dont know if you heard but the Young Offenders Act has recently been replaced with the Youth Criminal Justice Act. The act now clearly states that an officer MUST NOT charge a youth with a criminal offence unless it is violent in nature, or there exist factors which would make "extra-judicial measures" not applicable (ie has been cautioned for the offence in the past)

If you thought kids could get away with crap before, wait till kids find out about this.

For example, lets say I catch a couple of 17 year olds smashing your car window, geting in and stealing your sterio and causing heavy damage o the interior. Assuming the've never been caught for this before, I could not lay a charge if I wanted to.

IMO Canada is the best country to live in, but the judicial process is greatly flawed.
Yeah, no wonder so many peeps take it into their own hands. We caught these two 17 year old brothers breaking into our cars in my old building and what we did to them wasn't peaceful but we were told to do whatever we had to BEFORE we called the cops...so we did.
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Old Sep 14, 2003
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Yep. It would be unethical for me to direct you to take the law into your hands, but Citizens do have the right to arrest someone he finds commiting a indictable/felony offence, and to use as much force as is neccessary to effect that arrest.

Good job.
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