Rep Power: 0

Still in Iraq

 
Rep Power: 268

Well many of these things you are claiming are subjective so i'm not going to argue back and forth what is better or worse. However, from my experience and stats, you can say a stock civic can't outhandle a srt-4, which I believe would be shown by figures such as times through slaloms. In Motortrend's slalom in which they subject all of their cars to, the dodge srt-4 went through the slalom at 68.3 mph. Where the Honda Civic was recorded at 62 mph. Even the import's beloved s2000 was .3 mph better at 68.6 mph. With a .88g's on the skidpad, I would say this car is far less that just a "straight line performer" only. Like I said, I'm not even a big fan of the srt-4 but I do give credit where it is due.

 
Rep Power: 401

I'm not one for mag racing, so I'll touch on that quickly.

I've also seen slalom times for the S2k as high as 72mph. that same mag has the srt4 at 64.3mph. that's why mag racing is so iffy. one person may be better at driving one car than another, etc, depending on overall experience and such. zzyzx is a civic owner here and has yet to lose to ANY srt4 in auto-x, for example. i also looked up times for last year's SCCA auto-x national and regional championships. 7th gen civics, and other imports such as the RSX-s, mazda compacts, sentra spec-v's, civic Si, celica, and even previous gen civics were all running FASTER times than the SRT4's. they do not auto-x well. i'm not going to go searching for the times agian at this moment, but the civics and other imports were outhandling the srt4's at the regional and national championships in 2004 SCCA showroom stock classes. so i remain firm on my point that the SRT4 is fast in a straight line. for LESS than 20k you can get faster cars in the cornering and handling department. if you buy an SRT4 for it's performance in anything other than straight line, you pissed your money away.

yes other things are opinion, but IMO the seats feel cheap and uncomfortable.

 
Rep Power: 268

Well I hope zzyzx would be doing well with these mods....
Engine/Performance Modifications:
DC headder, Greddy Evo Exaust,
Suspension/Wheel Modifications:
Eibach sportline springs, Hotchkiss 25.4mm Rear Anti-roll bar, 03 Civic OEM front anti-roll bar (15.9mm)
Axis se7ens (17X7) for the street, Rota Slipstreams (15X6.5) for race days
Continental ContiExtremeContact for the street (215/45-17) Falken Azenis for autocross (205/50-15) Energy suspension Bushings (Front only).

But stock for stock, I don't see a huge advantage given to an import just b/c it's an import. Besides, I don't believe in your daily commute to work, you often need to auto cross down the expressway. Give me all the stats you want, I still would take a srt-4 over a civic anyday. More performance available for less money, and even if the civic can turn on a dime, it doesn't really matter if it's getting left behind by a faster car. If you want it for a daily driver, that's cool, just don't think that for 17k, you're car blows away the competition in every category. Believe me, I know civics are good little cars, but I feel srt-4's can be as well, if properly taken care of. Besides, if I were in the market for one of these, I would quickly pick the cobalt ss over both. If you want a car, that can handle, it was the fastest in the Motortend slalom for a FWD in 4 years. lol.

 
Rep Power: 401

If you would prefer the SRT4 over a civic, that's your choice, and I'm not going to try to force my opinion on you. I just prefer something that is more than just a straight line performing car. Again this is personal preference, which we obviously differ on.

zzyzx has beaten other similarly modded SRT4's to my understanding. In other words, in the same class/mod group.

 
Rep Power: 0

Really, so many people down the SRT on it's handling and that it's only good in a straight line which is far from the truth. It's not the best, but it handles DECENTLY. Keep in mind the suspension is tweaked from the factory for drag, 0 camber is a little hint. It's obviously assumed by Dodge that most are going to drag race it, so it's setup like that.

I just don't see how pulling a .85g's on the skidpad and doing 69mph in a slalom attests to shitty handling. That's better than a RSX type S. Not the best, but not bad, and still plenty of room for improvement anyhow.

The SRT lightweight was doing 1.0 something and handled badass with just mopar stage 3 coilovers and a bigger rear sway bar.

And for reliable autocross results with professional drivers...take a look at one lap of America...
I know most here are going to just not listen to this post, just trying to enlighten some people who obviously don't take the time to read up on what they're talking about.

 
Rep Power: 401

what do you mean "reliable autocross results with professional drivers".... what the hell do you think the SCCA auto-x regional and national championships are? As I said, last year the SRT4 had SLOWER times than many other cars that could be bought new for UNDER 20k. So I've taken plenty of time to "read up" on what I'm talking about.

Aside from that, I've seen other mags get better g's and slalom on the RSX-S than the SRT4. which is why mag racing is dumb. each mag tends to get different results. hence the reason i quoted the real world example of the SCCA regional and national championships in 2004.

now, no one here is saying the SRT4 is shitty handling. HOWEVER, that is NOT what the car accels at, and other cars can be bought for LESS than 20k that handle BETTER. THEREFORE the neon is a straight line car, and if someone buys it for its handling, then they're dumb.

 
Rep Power: 0

I thought they stopped letting people meet at crossroads?? too many ricers started being retarded when anyone would have a meet there so we stopped showing up.

unless you're not talking about crossroads. but IMO it's the ricer capitol of so cal.

 
Rep Power: 320

the SRT-4 lightweight had a lot more than that done to it. Did you look at what you typed, LIGHTEIGHT, that thing well over 600lbs taken off it, that is going to affect almost everything about the car including handling. They also installed an adjustable camber system, something the stock SRT-4 does not have, it is set to 0 camber, you can not adjust this with out riping your suspension off and replacing it with aftermarket pieces. There was alot more than just coilovers and a sway bar done to that car. You can easily get a much cheaper car to do that if far less effort and money.

 
Rep Power: 349

sig time.

 
Rep Power: 401

 
Rep Power: 381

qwiksilvertrav, in real life Skid pad #'s and slalom speeds mean relitivly little becuase to attain high numbers in those tests its more a question of what tire you are using rather then how the car is setup. (Honda is notorious for under-tireing their cars stock, S2000 excluded).. So Unless all Viehicles Measured on that test used the same compound tires, its pretty much useless to compair Car A's skidpad # to Car B's Skid pad #'s.

T/A, I acutally got to have some fun with a completly bone stock 2005 Civic EX (under 300 Miles on it...) last week. Quite fun really, A little trail braking can go a long way to getting your butt through a turn... The owner asked me how I was able to flick the car thorugh the turns so quickly with out having the stock (CRAP) tires squeal at all... any way, the thing could do with a set of dampers and a better set of tires, otherwise its actually a pretty well handling car. (as long as you drive it properly)

 
Rep Power: 381

Did a little reasurch... apparently the Stock RSX-S Tire is the Michelin Pilot HX MXM4 An all-Season Grand Touring tire
The stock SRT-4 tire is the BFGoodrich g-Force T/A KDW-2... an Ultra High Performance Summer Tire...

Peformance wise, the T/A KDW-2 is going to grip substantually better then the Michelin. So like I said, you can't compair Skidpad and Slalom #'s with cars running different tire compounds. (and if the RSX is pulling # better then the SRT-4, and the RSX is running "Allseason" tires (.86g from what I can find Vs the SRT-4's .85g).... imagine what it will do with a good set of Summer tires.)

 
Rep Power: 308

I think this topic is soo beat! If you like the SRT4 get it and drive it. If you like the s2000....get it and drive it....if you like eating poopy sandwiches...get it and eat it. Who cares what car does better at what. Everyone gets their car for different reasons.

 
Rep Power: 320

I like the s2000, but I can't get one

 
Rep Power: 0

Reliable as in One lap has PROFESSIONAL drivers and not some yahoo from down the block driving the car. Not to saying SCCA is completely unreliable. I referenced to the mag results not as absolute facts, just to give you an idea.

Funny, you where just saying the SRT completely is **** at handling and it's only good at straight line. What happened? Now you said you didn't say that?
You're obviously HIGHLY bias towards Honda and hate Dodge which is just fine. But don't go spewing out BS about another car that you don't know a whole lot about out of pure bias.

And if someone's going all turn, of course they're stupid for buying the neon...it's FWD!!! Anyone who buys a car for turns and buys FWD is stupid. You need something like your car for turns. Small and RWD and AWD owns the AutoX. BUT in the end it all depends on the driver.
But a Neon in general can be made to handle just as good as any other FWD car...they've been doing it for years now.

Actually it's 400 pounds, gutted interior and trunk. Lighter wheels also. ACR is on that track, buy an ACR, gut the interior, 1400.00 suspension from mopar and poof, you got some serious handling.

Anyways ALL I'm saying is, the SRT can do much more than just a straight line...

 
Rep Power: 320

Funny... you just went from SRT-4 to ACR, they don't exactly have the same suspension. the SRT-4 has non adjustable camber, the ACR does have adjustable camber, funny how you just switch Neons though, like saying oh you want to drag, let me go home and get my SRT-4, oh you want to autox, let me go home and get my ACR. None the less, stripping off 400 or 600 lbs is still going to make HUGE differance in handling.

Yes, I'll agree an SRT-4 CAN handle good if done properly, but everyone I have ran into with an SRT-4 doesn't even know what camber is, some how I'm thinking they don't know much about cornering.

As for the bit about FWD not handling, you're foolish for thinking that. True, RWD will be able to out handle a FWD, but generally speaking, those cars cost way more than a good handling FWD. The Miata is the only car that I can think of that comes close to handling like a civic and it starts at 22k, and personally I couldn't drive one every day. So my point is, unless you are planning on putting 40+k down on a car, FWD and RWD won't make a bi difference. But that's just me

 
Rep Power: 401

as i said, the neon's handling is **** compared to OTHER cars under 20k.

and as jrfish already pointed out, you're switching cars and backpeddling and blah blah. rather than continuing to bicker i think that's enough for today.