Rep Power: 0

I could really use some Expert help here. Hit an obstacle in the road and damaged the radiator and the car over heated. Replaced the radiator but now the car burns oil. Took the head off and had it pressure tested and its fine, put on a new head gasket but it still burns oil. I have been able to determine that it is the number 2 cylinder that has the oil leaking into it. I am assuming I need to pull the engine and have the block checked out. Does anyone know where I could take the car in the Colorado Springs area to get it fixed that wouldn't hold me hostage? I am thinking that if the engine needs to come out maybe I should have it rebuilt (I have no idea what a rebuild job would cost). What are your thoughts? This is a daily driver with 172K miles on it, not looking to modify it just need it to get to work.

2003 Honda Civic coupe DX
1.7 liter engine
manual transmission

 
Rep Power: 209

all sorts of damage can occur when an engine overheats,

sticking rings would be my first guess

 
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Thanks for the reply. Assuming it is sticking rings, how would I fix it?

 
Rep Power: 145

Arghhhh, you had the head off for the gasket and didn't do the rings?

Well, the head has to come off again to get at the rings.

You say you had it pressure tested? What was the pressure result for all the chambers? If one of the rings is bad that chamber pressure should be much lower.

How much oil are we talking about here? A liter a week? A month?

 
Rep Power: 209

you would need to remove the cylinder head and block and replace the piston and rings in that cylinder at minimum, depending on how bad the damage is you might need to have that cylinder (or all of them) bored and replace the piston(s) and and rings with oversized ones according to the size you have them bored to

 
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Ok, pulling the block is outside my capability right now. I don't have a cherry picker or engine hoist. Is there anyone in the Colorado Springs area that could pull it for me? What does a rebuild job cost on average for a 1.7?

 
Rep Power: 518

A compression test cannot evaluate the oil control rings.

A severe overheat can cause the rings to lose tension. Higher mileage engines tend to get oil control rings stuck anyway, a thermal event can make it worse. If it drank coolant that can hurt rings too.

Was the head warped from the overheat?




I'd rering it "in-frame" (without pulling the block out). Look closely at cylinder walls and piston condition while apart, see if there is a good reason to go deeper or if you can get away with cleaning the pistons and sticking fresh rings on them.

I just bought a Fit with 200k that's been hot and blew the head gasket. Oil rings were stuck. I reringed it without pulling the block out.

 
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No the head was not warped from the overheat. Should I put in new bearings?

 
Rep Power: 518

Sup to you.
I'd judge on how much noise they make right now, and how they look when you get it apart, and you can measure stuff once it's apart.

Overheat usually does not hurt bearings, but running with antifreeze in the oil will.

The Fit I just did was quiet before I took it apart, I did not replace any bearings.
Rering jobs under warranty do not get bearings.

 
Rep Power: 229

****many people do not trust stop leak***

But I've seen Lucas do amazing things for thousands of miles so in my opinion, if it is not your baby and you are not going to mod it I would throw in some Lucas stop leak with each oil change/top up and call her a day.

Pulling the engine removing the head/pistons/re-hone cylinders and so on to replace the ring will cost thousands.

Pulling the head alone is listed at 7.3 hours, If you can do it your self or find a shop that will charge you straight time and not "book time" then it might be what you want to do.

 
Rep Power: 0

The head was pressure tested not the cylinders. They were looking for leaks in the head thinking it was cracked. Then we thought the head gasket was bad but replacing it didn't help. I think it is going through a quart a week.

 
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I just called some machine shops and their rough estimate is $3000 to rebuild the engine. I wonder how much of a job it is to rering it. From the videos I saw on you tube it looks like the easiest way to get the head off is to leave the intake and exhaust manifolds on and disconnect the timing belt, coolant hoses, and wires. Then pull the oil pan and push the pistons up and out.
Since I would have it apart at this point, wouldn't new bearings make sense? I mean it does have 172K on it and they don't last forever. I see the suggestion to leave them it they aren't making noise. I am also thinking an oil pump isn't that expensive and since it will be in reach should I replace it too? maybe I am getting too far into the "if it ain't boke don't fix it" area.

 
Rep Power: 145

If you are willing to pay $3000 to rebuild the engine, you may as well just get a used engine with less kilometers.

Did YOU do the head gasket replacement? If so, the rings are not much more work to get at.

The intake is pretty easy to get off, it is the exhaust manifold that is the PITA, depending on where you live and how corroded the manifold connection is. My manifold is so rusted I don't even have the heat shield on it (must have come off somewhere down the 401 here in Ontario) and the bolts are almost indistinguishable as such. You don't have to take it all "off" but you obviously have to disconnect it.

If you are very mechanically inclined, you may be able to fit it into a weekend, but a completely dedicated weekend. If not, this had better not be your daily commuter, you may be at it for a while; there are a lot of considerations when taking it all apart. Get a Honda service manual at the very least so you know what you are getting yourself into.

 
Rep Power: 518

Easy. Just takes time and tools LOL

Pull the head off, pull the oil pan off.
Then you can take out the pistons and rods.
Remove the old rings, break an old set in half to use as scraping tools, and thoroughly clean the ring grooves of carbon buildup.
Slide new rings on the pistons per instructions, space apart the ring gaps per instructions, use a ring compressor to reinstall the pistons.
Reassemble the engine and drive another 100k+.

No block removal, no honing the cylinders. Just slap rings in and run it. This is what we do for engines getting rings under warranty at the dealer.

NOTE: The truth is in the honed crosshatch pattern on the cylinder walls. If the original pattern is still visible all the way through and around, then the cylinders are not worn enough to worry about.
My personal preference is usually to leave the manifolds in the engine bay.
Makes lifting the head out easier, less weight.


Like i said earlier, you can if you want. Same with the pump, if you want to spend some money.

I would not replace the pump unless it was really necessary.
I would pull the original pump off and replace the O ring and reseal it while everything is apart though.

I evaluate as I go, and I know that Hondas have pretty good reputation for longevity with care. We really don't have bottom end problems in general, that's one of several reasons I did not replace main or rod bearings in my Fit engine at 200,000 miles.

I DID replace the crank thrust bearings and the timing chain while I had it apart though. Both measured really close to the service limit specs, and I probably could have left them alone and been fine, but I replaced them anyway.
I did not bother to remeasure anything after installing them LOL




As far as time goes, you work at whatever pace you are comfortable.
At the shop I can probably do a set of rings on a 1.7 in a day if I don't get sidetracked.
I'd expect someone who does not do this every day to take a whole bunch more time.


My Fit...I took the engine apart on a Saturday, ordered parts Monday, then reassembled it the next Saturday. I kinda took my time with it too, and it's a bit more complicated than an engine with a timing belt.



Yeah, but a used engine is definitely going to need a fresh head gasket (they all do, so you may as well do it while it's out of the car and easy) and there's a good chance it will have stuck oil rings too. LOL