em2maxamillian

I have a 2004 Honda Civic EX 4-door with the 1.7 Vtec, 5 speed man, 56k miles. I just bought this car from the original owner. Three days in, O2 sensor on bank 1 went out, changed the sensor and all the spark plugs. Car has been running fine, but I've noticed that sometimes at idle, i can feel the engine "shaking," almost like it's misfiring...but not as severe. It's not showing ANY codes at all and the engine never stalls or anything, so I just played it off as an old motor mount or something. But this morning, for the first time, I had to crank the engine a few times for it to start. Drove it around, but never gave me any problems during the day. Could this be a fuel or ignition problem? I'm pretty sure the car still has the original coil packs and wires and such. I tried fuel injector cleaner in the tank just this afternoon, so we'll see how it goes. Maybe it's the injectors? Fuel Filter? Fuel Pump?

Thanks for any advice guys. It's my first Honda, so I'm a little lost.

lazlong

When you start the car do you just stick the key in and immediately turn it to start (III)? If so, try turning it to ON (II). You'll hear the fuel pump relay click (behind the glovebox), the fuel pump run for 2 seconds to build pressure, then the relay click off. Then try to start it. Post back if you're still having a hard time starting it.

Rough idle sounds like a motor mount. Rear mount is usually the weakest.

anibis

Sometimes my '05 can be a pain to start. It doesn't happen very often but every now and then I have to keep cranking it and give it a bit of gas before it starts up. Not sure what's causing it but it's been doing it for years, I'm not worried about it.

If it becomes a problem every time you start it we can go from there but one rough start isn't much to worry about.

I have 120k on my original coils, they're supposed to be replaced at 100k but the car still runs really good.

Have you checked your motor mounts for cracks or gaps in the rubber? I just put a light on one side of the mount and looked through the other side and jiggled the motor a bit, if it's broken you will see a gap. Rear mount is a pain to see through though. Driver side mount you just have to worry about leaking b/c its an oil shock basically.

em2maxamillian

lazlong: I think I know what you're getting at, and you're right, I didn't prime the pump that morning, I just got in and started it. I shall prime it from now on and see if the problem occurs again.

lazlong and anibis: I'll have the shop inspect the mounts next time I go in for service. I just had the service done, so it'll be a while, but I put a lot of miles on the car, so maybe in a few months.

I forgot to mention that when I put the car in reverse and engage the clutch, I can hear a rattling sound. It doesn't happen when I give it a lot of gas and basically ride the clutch, but when I try to balance the clutch out for a smooth engagement, I can hear the rattling. Again, this only happens in reverse while engaging the clutch. Maybe that could be a mount too?

thanks again guys, you're helping me out a lot

em2maxamillian

So, its been a couple months since I posted this thread and all has been well. I've been following your guys suggestions and have been letting the fuel pump prime before I start the car first thing in the morning and I haven't been having any problems...until now. Its been months, but yesterday afternoon and this morning, the car took a long time to start. I just gotta keep cranking the engine over and it eventually sputters to life. After that, it starts up just fine for the rest of the day. Its odd. Possible causes? Plugs are new NGKs, but they are not iridium, i put platinum back in because I'm cheap. I was thinking maybe it's fuel related? Clogged injector? Fuel filter? I don't think it can be the coil packs because the car would prob. be throwing a code or running bad. So I'm thinking injectors. Next week I'm tearing the car down and doing a major tune up, so I'm going to change the fuel filter. Any way I can check the fuel injectors?

johndeerebones

I had my egr valve off yesterday, dropped some junk down the port so I plugged in the egr and left it dangle to avoid a check engine light thinking it wasn't there. Long story short I started it to blow the crap out and noticed it ran like poop, no light. The reason is this. EGR is a massive vacuum leak. If it wasn't on cold start with the rough idle and such I might think the EGR was stuck open, but 1 shouldn't matter on a cold start, 2 you said it starts and runs fine the rest of the day. Intermittent starting issues are usually something to do with fuel pressure, or the main relay is intermittent on priming the pump. When you turn the key can you hear the pump, or just waiting a couple seconds?

04 Honda Civic

iTrader: (2)

Check your plugs make sure they are Denso PKJ20CR-M11. Also check your front motor mount it was what caused the vibrating on my car. I though I was running rough, but in reality it was just my motor mount was broken.

04 Honda Civic

iTrader: (2)

For starters you should put stock, or at the very least stock spec plugs in.

em2maxamillian

Thanks guys for the fast reply.

1) john: yes, I do hear the fuel pump and the relay when I turn the ignition on first thing in the morning. It clicks off after a couple of seconds and then all I hear is silence as I assume the system is primed and the pump has stopped. The car has 56k on it and the fuel filter has never been changed. Could that be the issue?

2) 04 Honda: thanks for always helping me out. You reply to a lot of my threads, I appreciate it. Would the plugs matter. I know that you can't just use any plugs in a Honda, hence why I went to NGK. They are almost exactly the same except the stocks were iridiums. Should I get the new ones from Honda? Where else can I get the Denso iridiums?

johndeerebones

I am not for complete sure, but the only "filter" on these things is the sock on the bottom of the pump. They don't have a regularly serviced filter. With lower miles like that it may have sit around enough to make fuel gum and varnish get on the pump, which is in the tank, but can't really say that unless you are taking fuel pressure while it has a problem. A good parts store should have denso plugs or be able to get them. Good does not imply Autozone, O'Reilly's, Advance or Walmart types mind you. I am not a fan of any "box" parts stores except in dire emergency they are open late. Most of the good stores are open till 5 or 6.

em2maxamillian

Actually, i think the car did sit for a while. When I bought the car from the previous owner, the registration he paid for it was VERY high. It suddenly dawned to me that the reason it was high was probably because he had to pay penalties for late registration and not turning in the plates while the car sat. I guess I'll start from the fuel filter and work my way down.

04 Honda Civic

iTrader: (2)

These cars dont have fuel filters just more like strainers. You can check to see if its dirty but honestly I think you have an ignition problem

04 Honda Civic

iTrader: (2)

Doesnt matter where you get them. Here are the part numbers according to the Chilton Manual

NGK:PZFR6F-11
or
DENSO:PKJ20CR-M11 (This is what your car comes with from the factory most likely) (This is what I used)

I bought my Densos from the dealer.
I had previously put regular NGK V-powers and after only 10k miles my car started to really run terrible. I find these cars hate certain spark plugs. Spend the extra money for the Irridiums.

I am not saying this will fix your problem completely, but its a good starting point.

Edit:Once again check your front mount, it can make the illusion like your motor is running rough but in reality its just the motor not being dampened properly.

em2maxamillian

Thanks for all the help man. I got new denso plugs, but they are not the one you mentioned (DENSO:PKJ20CR-M11). The ones I got match almost complete except for the M11, prob. because I got the plat. not the iridium. I have the mounts change and we'll go from there. Maybe I'll have the injectors and such checked too.

em2maxamillian

I just wanted to see if anyone out there experiences the same problem as mentioned earlier in this thread. I changed all the plugs and everything, but occasionally the car has moments where it takes time to start. I'd say one or twice every two weeks. I just need to crank the engine over and hold it but it will eventually sputter to life.

60k miles, 2004 Civic EX