Intercooler

Here is the exact question and answers I got from him like I promised I would post:


This is Jesse... how have you been? Still working at Martin? Think you can help me out with some info on my 2001 Civic?

Are these cars known more than the early Gens for bad transmissions?

Also it seems like all the fluids say specially formulated for Honda. They also want you to use their trans, PS, brake, etc... fluids. Will the trans be more prone to failure if I use a good brand Dexron III? This is a big myth I would like to put to rest.

Any help would be great!

See ya

hey, what's up.no, the civic transmissions,automatic,seem to have been of pretty good quality.we haven't replaced many at all.the problem transmissions have been, accord and odyssey.dextrn 3 is fine for the trans.power steering fluid is specific though.the trans you are referring to isn't a cvt is it.if it is then you do have to use honda fluid.if the civic is a lx or ex your fine with dextron.
see ya


Hope that solves the myths behind at least some of this.

He has worked there for years and years as a wrench plus he does them on the side to support his hobby but I find what he said about the transmissions not hardly ever going bad as a total opposite to what I read here.

Dexron III for me only now!

shroomster

frequent visits to the repair shop for you too...dummy

Intercooler

You mean you have been in a lot?

shroomster

I meant in addition to your using of dexronIII

Intercooler

So you are saying if I use Dexron III I will be at Honda getting my trans fixed often He is a fellow racer so if he thought I or anyone else should use the Honda crap he would tell me.

shroomster

I wanna say that it is ok to use dexron in the older honda trannies....don't quote me on it, but if i remember correctly that is where you use the dexron...

Boilermaker1

iTrader: (16)

There ARE additives in honda ATF and MTF thats specifically added for the health of honda transmissions. People have tested that, it has been PROVEN. If you're just going to slug a car around in traffic and never beat it up, I'm sure you could put whatever you wanted in there and it wouldn't make much of a difference, but if you're gonna pound it, use the good stuff, it doesn't cost much more.

Along the lines of this being the opposite of what he says....
1. Don't believe everything you hear
2. the people on here are less than 1% of your average honda owner
3. a lot of people on here are idiots who don't know how to drive properly and abuse their cars, resulting in endless trips to the shop where they blame it on the car instead of the way they treat the car. Its very easy to make this car last a good long while, even if you rag on it endlessly. Neutral drops, manually shifting an automatic, brake torquing, slam shifting, shifting without the clutch, riding the clutch, yanking the e-brake while moving, etc... aren't those ways.

Intercooler

Proof please. I would like to see the articles, text, tests done to prove these statements. I will send it to him... for sure. He's a mechanic at the dealership, car guy, racer and Honda owner. He did say the steering fluid is special but I would need to see some real data on any additive Honda puts in ATF to sway me to buy it. Has someone done an analysis on it? I probably shouldn't run synthetic in my car either if you go with what Honda says but I know what is best. What in a Honda automatic would be any different where they need a special kind of fluid?

As an additional piece of research on this I will ask the trans shop I have been dealing with for years and see what their take is on it. They hold several patents and go to all the seminars, etc... so they should have the latest info on this. More to come!

Boilermaker1

iTrader: (16)

It doesn't NEED. It STRONGLY SUGGESTS. The MTF is formulated with special additives to help with the health and longevity of the specific composition used in the synchronizer cones, so that they last as long as they should. Only Honda throws it in, because its specific materials for honda synchros.
ATF is the same way, its made to cooperate with the specific materials used in the clutches. I'll try and dig up the tests, a lot of them are just people having their transmission fluid analyzed vs other people's transmission fluid analysis (a la Oil analysis), but when you pile enough HG fluid results with enough non-HG fluid results, you get a pretty good idea that the honda stuff DOES help the transmission run better, but you'll probably not have too much of a difficult time finding it. People have chemically analyzed the fluids before, Honda MTF is higher in its moly content than most others.
Its not that hard to test it.... get a bottle of HG ATF, get a bottle of Dexron from Autozoo, send it to a lab get it analyzed.
Motor oil is motor oil, There's nothing special about the stuff with the Honda logo on it, just like there's nothing special about the spark plugs. Some things are pretty standard, but stuff in the transmission isn't standard they're pretty free to use whatever funky materials they want in there to make things last, and they tailor the lubricants to match. Benz is the same way... you MUST use Benz ATF because of the high carbon content they use in their clutch packs.

Intercooler

I can't find an analysis but you may have some merit to your claims. I just spoke to the trans shop and they kind of comfirmed some of what my mechanic friend said to a degree.

- Accords and Odysseys with the bigger motors can get flairs or stutters using Dexron III over Honda ATF. He said usually Civics are fine on Dexron III but since the cost of Honda ATF is not much more why bother.

- They use Honda ATF in ALL Hondas that come into their shop. They do have additives that make the transmissions shift and last better.

- No smoke n mirrors on Honda claim of additives. They do!


When I got my car just recently at 32k miles I did its first change with Dexron III. I will be changing the oil again at 37k miles so when I do I will charge it with Honda ATF and stick with it. At this point I guess I will use all Honda fluids except oil which I will stick with Mobil 1 Synthetic.

Here is some reading material: http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...f8c8d165e39611

nick95673

iTrader: (13)

Most people that join this forum probably searched it out when they had a problem. I never searched this forum out until I couldnt figure out how to take my radio out. So the guys on here are more likely to kill a tranny than the mom driving 45mph to and from work and karate practice. Simply because we are too damn curious.

CraigW

iTrader: (1)

But it was only 1 neutral drop !! And it was nowhere near redline.

OEM fluid.

spoonJDMlX

iTrader: (1)

that guy doesnt know what hes talking about.....

he said our trannies are fine? looooool man i asked the guys @ my honda dealer and they said we get about 3 01+ civics in each month on getting the tranny replaced....but hey, your word is as good as mine.....but i take mine over yours

civics4everyone

Most my family has had civics with no problems with anything except small things like trim, and plastic interior parts coming loose. we have had a 2001ex, 2000dx, 2002 lx(mine), 87 crxsi,85crx, and a 94 integra. We stll have all the civics with no tranny problems whatsoever. I use honda fluid because its not really worth saving 5 dollars to me, using dextron. Everyone knows honda are very reliable and actually can take alot of abuse and neglect. I think people who buy them as "race cars" are funny though. I think all these aftermarket parts to make a 115 hp civic faster is what may contribute to parts failing prematurely, not too mention younger drivers are harder on equipment. I have 66k and my tranny shifts smooth as ever.

Intercooler

Could have ALOT to do with location. Not many people racing Hondas that would be going to his dealership. In your neck of the woods you probably have a ton. Racing a Honda = trans problems.

spoonJDMlX

iTrader: (1)

my car is stock

never raced.....and taking it to redline doesnt mean your racing, your just putting alota pressure on the engine....but its perfectly ok since HONDA THEM SELFS set the redline......automatic, helllllloooo

R1Style

iTrader: (20)

when you changed your tranny oil to Detron III did you do a complete tranny flush or just a basic tranny fluid change?

If you didn't do a complete flush then you're pretty much mixing 50/50 Honda ATF and Dextron III.

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

sorry that guy doesn't know anything. One of our own resident mechanics and many of his friends already have idenfitied the DEFECT in the early trans to a weak clutch pack carrier. In actuality it is a terrible transmission and no amount of cautious driving will help. I'm at under 50k miles on my 02 and its already slipping. I drive like a granny most of the time. I've redlined two times in the past 4 years. Normal driving I don't go over 4k rpms so i know its the tranny. Other mechanics have blamed the inline filter on the problems as well as using different fluid. I've always used oem and change every 10k miles even tho other mechanics have told me due to the trans design, it should be changed every 3k. Its a piece of junk.

Intercooler

So what changed from the 6th Gens to 7th's? My 98 had 82k miles on it when I sold it and not problem one. I always used Dexron III in it and didn't even know about the Honda additive package. You mean Honda took a step backwards?

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

honda just used cheap parts in the newer tranny. the older civics upto 2000 are rock solid. i see so many driving around way past 100k and tranny is perfect even the ones who drag race with the auto

my friend had a 99 hx with auto cvt trans and he literally beat on it everyday. its the trans without gears, he would floor it and keep shifting the sport mode back and forth til when we finally stopped at a light it smelled like the car was gonna blow up haha. but it never did. ended up getting totaled by a water truck a few years later.

jackburton

iTrader: (1)

I use mobil one synthetic in my MT, f#ck the additives!LOL
Syncros...What are those? LOL