No ranting, just facts VTEC vs. Zetec
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From: Gaithersburg, MD
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yep pretty much. It is kinda sad. Not many people can have a spiritied debate. Rather they get offended easily and go off bashing. I still don't understand why we need to compare the civic and the focus. Sure they are in the same class, but you have to buy what you want to buy. We all have our own opinions, but the facts are getting all jumbled up in this mess of crap!
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From: Duluth, MN
Rep Power: 0 Exactly... same class, but as others have said, this is a 7th Gen Civic, not a Focus web site. Not to mention people saying things like "don't have time to read all the posts..." and not having a clue what they're about to talk about or if it's been covered in previous posts. If you don't have time to read the thread, don't post in it.
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From: Jersey Shore
Rep Power: 312 Originally posted by ojjr22
Also to jolly sid that 100,000 mile warranty your talking about YOU PAID FOR IT. If you think you got it for free then you obviously didn't read your contract well enough when you got your car. The focus gets that warranty for FREE. By the way the first tuneup isn't do for 100000miles so it's not far from the vic.
Also to jolly sid that 100,000 mile warranty your talking about YOU PAID FOR IT. If you think you got it for free then you obviously didn't read your contract well enough when you got your car. The focus gets that warranty for FREE. By the way the first tuneup isn't do for 100000miles so it's not far from the vic.
If you love the focus warranty so much go buy one and annoy people on a focus forum.
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From: Gaithersburg, MD
Rep Power: 413 Some Facts!
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2004/hond....num3.0.honda*
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2004/ford....num16.0.ford*
Everyone has their reasons for buying or not buying a car. And we are on a civic site, so people are gonna bash every other car in our class out there, which is kind of a crappy approach. There are so many models and engines to choose from for both the civic and the Focus that it isn't even a good comparison. Not the mention, like was said before, the Focus has a 2.0 or a 2.3L engine. That is .3 or .6L more of displacement! Yes it has more power, yes you might not like the way it is styled, yes the first year had lots of problems, no we don't know if the reliability of the newer ones are good or bad, etc. blah blah blah blah.
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2004/hond....num3.0.honda*
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2004/ford....num16.0.ford*
Everyone has their reasons for buying or not buying a car. And we are on a civic site, so people are gonna bash every other car in our class out there, which is kind of a crappy approach. There are so many models and engines to choose from for both the civic and the Focus that it isn't even a good comparison. Not the mention, like was said before, the Focus has a 2.0 or a 2.3L engine. That is .3 or .6L more of displacement! Yes it has more power, yes you might not like the way it is styled, yes the first year had lots of problems, no we don't know if the reliability of the newer ones are good or bad, etc. blah blah blah blah.
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From: Milford, CT
Rep Power: 0 Me not knowing a lot about the Focus engine, or many Ford engines other than the V8's is where my confusion was coming from which is legitimate. The whole Vtec Zetec thing had me confused as to what exactly it was which trahma helped a bit with the sorting. If you all look back at the first few pages he describes it, and basically they are not the same system as has been pointed out several times. Vtec is def. no shot of NOS. Ive actually heard that to do a decent turbo setup that it needed to be disconnected??? This was coming from a friend who has owned nothing but Camaro's, a Stingray, and a new MR2 that he turboed.
Again I am lost on the Focus engine, but if you wanna talk Ecotec or the old Saturn 1.9L SOHC/DOHC or even the other GM 4-banger engines, then thats another topic completely.
Again I am lost on the Focus engine, but if you wanna talk Ecotec or the old Saturn 1.9L SOHC/DOHC or even the other GM 4-banger engines, then thats another topic completely.
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From: Los Angeles
Rep Power: 289 ive heard that the Euro Focus build quality is very good cuz its more of a premium car there. then again, i think its the same for the civic in japan, its more of a premium car there. i guess car companies had to cost cut in production in these cars to sell them as econboxes.
Zetec doesn't mean shiat. I'ts not an acronym like Vtec, it's not Variable anything, it's just a word. Kinda like Ecotec or Duratec or Triton. Just a word. Perod. End of story. Don't believe me? Ask Ford.
Originally posted by Jodster
There is a reason the 2.3L motor makes more power and torque than the 1.7L motor. You see why? Because the Ford Zetec motor has more displacement. Bigger motor=more power and torque. Its a given. Just like the K24 motor. 160Hp and 151ft tq. So yes the new Focus motor is making more power than our D17. Plus you have to realize that it is also a DOHC.
But you are not comparing apples to apples. Take the K20A3 and compare it to the 2.0 Zetec motor. You can't compare the 2.3 Zetec motor to the D17 Vtec motor.
There is a reason the 2.3L motor makes more power and torque than the 1.7L motor. You see why? Because the Ford Zetec motor has more displacement. Bigger motor=more power and torque. Its a given. Just like the K24 motor. 160Hp and 151ft tq. So yes the new Focus motor is making more power than our D17. Plus you have to realize that it is also a DOHC.
But you are not comparing apples to apples. Take the K20A3 and compare it to the 2.0 Zetec motor. You can't compare the 2.3 Zetec motor to the D17 Vtec motor.
Oh, and one last thing. My girlfriend owns a 2003 Focus sedan. Now, as a Civic owner I like my car more than her Focus, but I have to admit the Focus' build quality is better than my Vic. It's quieter and rides nicer. The interior materials might be a little cheaper, but overall the Focus is build better than my Vic. People need to get off the Domestics back about build quality. This isnt the 80's and 90's anymore. If you would actually drive some of these new domestics, you'd find out quick that build quality has really skyrocketed. Even with the Mustangs, and Silverados, and especially the new F-150s. I'm disappointed with Honda and the build quality of the 7th gens. I know I'm not the only one.
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From: NJ
Rep Power: 0 Wow thank-you for the people that can actually make a comparrison without arguing like children. I was arguing before only because I showed facts between the two cars and everyone wants to start arguing with me so in return I fight back. I not a huge fan of the focus because of the looks but overall it does perform better than the vic as stated by metallica54. Also to metallica I agree with you on the case of build quality, it has gotten alot better. I myself am dissapointed with the quality of the 7th gen. especially that I got rid of a 6th gen for this one.
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From: Gaithersburg, MD
Rep Power: 413 you always make me laugh!!!
Build quality is partly opinion based and partly long term reliability based. Now in 10 years our civics start falling apart and the focus doesn't, then if there is enough data, the focus would have the better build quality. In order to know the build quality you need to either 1) work in the plant 2) be a tech for the company 3) have taken apart a bunch of each car or 4) have studied the data on complaints and recalls.
the ranking of cars in the magazines is mostly opinion. JD power and associates I beleive takes the hardcore data of recalls, complaints, and other things the companies report to rank the car companies. but even that is biased.
Build quality is partly opinion based and partly long term reliability based. Now in 10 years our civics start falling apart and the focus doesn't, then if there is enough data, the focus would have the better build quality. In order to know the build quality you need to either 1) work in the plant 2) be a tech for the company 3) have taken apart a bunch of each car or 4) have studied the data on complaints and recalls.
the ranking of cars in the magazines is mostly opinion. JD power and associates I beleive takes the hardcore data of recalls, complaints, and other things the companies report to rank the car companies. but even that is biased.
A descendant of 2k1civic.com
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From: Nebraska
Rep Power: 360 Originally posted by orion_squall
mmm...
Focus has a better build quality than civc?
this does not really explain why they received 3x and more complaints on all their parts compare to civic...
jsut an opinion?????? ha...
mmm...
Focus has a better build quality than civc?
this does not really explain why they received 3x and more complaints on all their parts compare to civic...
jsut an opinion?????? ha...
**cough cough. . ** and umm .. 3x more recalls?
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Originally posted by pheaton
**cough cough. . ** and umm .. 3x more recalls?
**cough cough. . ** and umm .. 3x more recalls?
I didn't say recalls, I said complaints from buyers for its build. Read well.
A car can have only 36 recalls but 1000's of complaint on its build. AND THAT IS THE PROBLEM...why? you can search for the reason when you are buying another car one day.
Also I have posted NHTSA statistic and the link, I will not poste again. The thread here is for giving out informations and facts. I have done so and people who read it knew them so that when they buy a car they have the informations in mind.
Accepting the facts or not it is not really our concern. If you really like Ztec and Focus then it will be the best car for you. I just don't get why some guys (not you) got civic then regreted then came to this site humiliating civic, promoting Focus, with no good arguments. They can simply trade civic their for watever they want. Who in this site is stopping them from doing so?
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From: Mexico
Rep Power: 0 Originally posted by Bellz
Now you're comparing the 2.0 litre to the D17? Man, give it up.
Let's compare motors with similar sizes....I'll even go down to the K20 in the Si.
Si =160hp
30 more than your 2.0
To argue that the standard motor in a Focus is better than the standard motor in a Civic is meaningless. Honda isn't even trying to compete with the base civic. That's what the Si is for.
Now you're comparing the 2.0 litre to the D17? Man, give it up.
Let's compare motors with similar sizes....I'll even go down to the K20 in the Si.
Si =160hp
30 more than your 2.0
To argue that the standard motor in a Focus is better than the standard motor in a Civic is meaningless. Honda isn't even trying to compete with the base civic. That's what the Si is for.
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From: Fort Oglethorpe
Rep Power: 316 Originally posted by j0rge
w8 the svt 2.0 has 172 hps
w8 the svt 2.0 has 172 hps
lease: yes, Honda skimped on the horsepower and shoulda used the 200hp version.
'nuff said. Please let this thread die already!
I was under the impression that Zetec was iVTEC without the VTEC, ie, just the "i". That would mean just variable timing control. I also thought it appeared on Escorts years before Ford ever dreamt of the Focus.
Oh, and anyone who thinks that 149ftlbs at 4200rpm out of 2.3L is impressive needs to have their head checked.
Oh, and anyone who thinks that 149ftlbs at 4200rpm out of 2.3L is impressive needs to have their head checked.
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From: Tampa, Florida, US
Rep Power: 285 Originally posted by FLBrian
don't they have a 5.0 still...at least they make the engine still im sure for the new ones
don't they have a 5.0 still...at least they make the engine still im sure for the new ones
I think that speaks to Ford's lameness more than anything else. The 5.0 was a blast, as were the original 351's (Windsor/Cleveland).
On the other hand, you've got GM killing the F-body and Toyota killing all their fast cars in favor of fast-looking cars. I guess no one really likes the enthusiasts anymore.
Bummer.
On the other hand, you've got GM killing the F-body and Toyota killing all their fast cars in favor of fast-looking cars. I guess no one really likes the enthusiasts anymore.
Bummer.
