Rep Power: 282

Ok fellas, I'm not trying to hear I told you so but I'm just reflecting on my experience. Finally installed my stage 2 cam and valve train. This install is not for beginners as I ran into some minor mishaps that could have been detrimental. The guy doing the install lost one those "keepers". It's a C-shaped piece the holds the retainer on the spring. We think it dropped into the hole that drains to the oil pan and we almost had to drop the oil pan. Luckily my buddy had his old LX head from when he did his EX head swap and we used the "keepers" on that. So after everything installed including my wideband and valve adjustment we fired it up. Car started right up and damn it sounds like a motorcylcle. I have plenty of vids so don't worry they will be up soon. The car idled at 1200 in open loop and the afr were all over the place. Took it for spin and once I went into closed loop thats when the bogging started and the car wanted to stall out at idle. We adjusted the idle screw a bit and did not throw any codes and the car idled better w/o stalling. At the time I was running on a base tune on my friends Emanage to make it to the dyno shop.
The next day at the dyno I realized I was very rich since the tuner pretty much pulled fuel across the board. The car sounds mean as hell but I'm just not putting down the power expected. I didn't do a dyno before the install but wish I did bc I only made 107hp with 100 tq. This is really low and makes me wonder if Vtec is working. I lost bottom but it feels stronger up top. I don't know I'm just really confused bc I should be making at least 130hp. I have AEM v2 intake, megan 4-1 header, stock cat, and megan catback.
As far as driveability, the tuner was able to make the car idle between 800-1100 and the car does not cut off once in closed loop. During the tune he was watching the short term and long term fuel trims and it took a long time for the long term trims to adjust. He tried to add 1 degree of timing and the ECU went nuts. The car misfired and sounded like fire crackers were going off. He was very confused by this bc we should at least be able to add at least 2-4. Anyways, he set back to 0 and all is good. I only throw a code on cold mornings when its hard for the car to idle but I just reset it with an obd2scanner and it goes away. The codes I'm throwing are cylinder misfires in all cylinders. Once the car is warmed up it is fine though.
Gas mileage - was pretty much unchanged on the highway and made about 340 miles in a tank from the border of Virginia/North Carolina - Atlantic City, NJ. I havne't driven in the city yet to determine city miles.
So I wanted to share my experience and if you have any questions feel free to IM/PM me. My sn on aim is strose09. Also, if you have any insight as to why my numbers were so low please comment. I didn't think it would be that weak. I really want to race someone just to see if it's faster or not bc I can't tell like I said it "feels stronger". So if you're in Jersey and want to get a quick run. HOLLA AT ME.

 
Rep Power: 282

Also forgot to add my afr at WOT are about 13.5 and under normal driving range from 14.2-16's. Basically letting the ECU do its thing during normal driving.

 
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post some videos. I am surprised u didnt get better numbers. I woundering if u get that AEM computer we where talking about u could tune it different +1 for u man

 
Rep Power: 363

this is why people aren't doing n/a stuff w/ their d17.

 
Rep Power: 353

hhahhaha......... N/A d17 = gas saver.... not made for HP/TQ

ahha

 
Rep Power: 251

yikes! hope you figure something out.. thats kinda stock stock.. i think my lx is faster =P

 
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Ya makes me wonder if VTEC is working. My friend made 125whp but he had some underdrive pullies and and a light weight flywheel.

 
Rep Power: 347

700 dollars for 7 horsepower...How does it feel to get assraped?


Hope you can figure out what's up. Perhaps do an intake manifold swap?

 
Rep Power: 282

Yes, I'll be the first to admit I was blew some nice cash... but honestly I learned alot during this project that I wouldn't have learned if I didn't go through it.

 
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Bwuahah, stock the EX makes 101.1 whp dyno proven. Now you see why everyone says swap and turbo are the only ways to get hp. waste of money

 
Rep Power: 363

wait a sec, what tuning device are you using?

 
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i thought it was 110 whp?

 
Rep Power: 282

Emanage blue I used to tune. Tuned on a dynojet.

 
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I have the dynoes laying around here somewhere, let me try to find them.

 
Rep Power: 282

Emanage blue I used to tune. Dynoed on a dynojet an EX SI rims with lower tire pressure bc it was bloody cold that morning. I know there's plenty of ways to "inflate" your hp but really there's something wrong I think bc a stock EX should make more than that.

 
Rep Power: 282

 
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^ dynos really are to measure differences in hp between readings ... peak whp readings really don't mean much anyway. however, regardless of that, 101 whp is pretty low.

but yeah. you should've gotten a dyno beforehand ;P

 
Rep Power: 297

Well not to be a dick but you seem to be in over your head, hahaha. Crower cams work really well on these cars if you know how to use them.

First, after losing that keeper, you SHOULD have dropped the pan. That keeper will more than likely get sucked into the oil pickup strainer screen considering its so small. It will slow the flow of oil slightly and then if it keeps working against it, it will tear the screen and then say goodbye to MR D17. I have seen it happen on several occasions.

Second, no offence, but you obviously have no idea about tuning, even further such with our sensitive D17 ECU. You computer regulates the idle, not that throttle stop screw, you can adjust it all you want, your cars ECU will attempt to idle back to factory specs every time you adjust it untill you max out the IAC valve one way or the other and it trips a CEL. You put a bigger cam in and then your "tuner" takes fuel out while you are running a CEL which is probably a code throwing it into "safe mode" which has been know to batch fire injectors, retard the **** out of your ignition timing, and keep VTEC from functioning?? Think about how much sense it makes to try and add a bigger cam and take out fuel, it doesnt add up. It takes a seriously sweet and patient tuner to tackle a D17 e-manage setup. There are a ton of "tuners" around that have absolutely no ideas about the platforms they are tuning on, trust me on this, dont listen to anyone without D17 experience, or at the very least, obd2 experience!

Bottom line is your ECU is freaking out because it wasnt designed for the lift, duration, overlap of that cam. So before you start knocking Crower cams, do some homework. Im making about 260 whp on 9 psi thanks to Brian Crower. They seriously know their **** over there, no doubt.

 
Rep Power: 331

are you running a cat? just curious.. cuz i gained a hell of alot more HP than that just by eliminating my cat then your current setup...

 
Rep Power: 282

Ya kept the stock cat on. Even still a test pipe will only give me what like 5hp max right?

 
Rep Power: 282

02fpcivic... your points are well noted and yes I probably am over my head. I take constructive criticism so I dont' take your comments personal. Like I said this is my first real project and its more of a learning experience. I don't have enough knowledge to tackle a turboed car and figured the simplicity of N/A would be good to start out with. I was wrong clearly I still have alot to learn.

 
Rep Power: 272

lose the cat. that will definately help, you will feel it trust me. and o2fpcivic is right the tuner you are using is bogus

 

do u have to run a emange system for stage 2 n/a crower cams? is it possible to use a vafc2 instead? or use a vafc2 for stage 1 n/a cams?

 
Rep Power: 282

Yes you can use a VAFC2 search under djmota thats what he used and made 133whp. Not sure what other mods he had done though.

 
Rep Power: 812

ive found out the hard way anything more than a few boltons like intake and exhaust and the car freaks out. you just have to know when to quit. im glad i stopped thinking about the engine and went back to lighting mods. its not fun to have stuff break every week or gaskets exploding, vtec malfunctions, cam issues, etc.

 
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Finally got the vids from the dyno and some street pulls. I'm too tired to post them on youtube now but if you absolutely can't wait just IM me at strose09.

 
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so how much for the cams and emanage? lol jk

 
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Yeah, I wasnt trying to be a dick but these cars are pesky to mess with. If you talk to the few members on here making bigger power numbers, they should be able to help dig up some better numbers than that. We've dyno these things at 106-110 whp in good weather BONE stock, hehe.

 
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02fpcivic do you know of any good tuners that have particular experience with the "D17". I know now I can't just go to any honda tuner since our engine is like no others out there.

 
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Wow, something is definately wrong. My 01 EX dyno'd almost 2 years ago at 108.7hp bone stock with just the power steering belt off.