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98 Honda Civic with 175K miles on it, died suddenly after driving about a mile, and wouldn't start up.

I can hear the fuel pump come on when turning the key initially, I hear the relay click. I've checked all fuses, all seem good. I turned the car over with the spark plug threads grounded, and see no spark. (please verify there is nothing special I need to do to see spark).

The plug wires all measure good to the distributor cap, at about 5 Ohms. I found this previous thread and started checking the ignition coil -

http://honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2851807

According to this, my TEC coil should read .63-.77 Ohms between the A and B terminals, and 12.8-19.2K between the A terminal and the secondary winding. My readings -

0.8 Ohms from A-B
9K from A to secondary

Obviously these readings are outside of the spec, but are they far enough out to warrant replacing the ignition coil?

Anything else I can/should check before buying a new ignition coil (I'll likely replace the entire distributor and be done with it)

I hate throwing parts at a problem until I'm fairly certain of the cause.

Thanks in advance!

 
Rep Power: 519

I wouldn't care about ohming anything.

Does the coil make spark? How much spark? How large of a gap can the spark jump? Will it only jump 1/8 inch? Will it jump 3/4 inch or more?



If NO spark at all:
Is there B+ at the coil?
Attach a dwellmeter on the coil neg, (same as if one was reading point dwell in the olden days).
Crank it.
Is there ANY reading at all? Even like 2 deg?
If there is ANY reading other than 0 or 90, then the igniter is trying to fire the coil.
If there is dwell but no spark, the coil is bad.

HTH

 
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I don't have a Dwell meter, I'm guessing a multi meter won't work? How do I safely test spark from the coil? I checked it at the spark plug, and get nothing.

How fast should the distributor spin on startup? It seems to be spinning about 60 rmp.

 
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Only if it is able to measure dwell.

Duty Cycle might work too, but I have never tried using that for this test.


The spark must jump from the coil to a ground.
*I* use a long screwdriver, I just make sure it is touching a ground (top of trans) during the test.
You can use a screwdriver that is connected to ground with a jumper wire.

If you lose the grounding from whatever tool you try to use, the spark will try to use YOU for its path to ground. That hurts, and can cause things to fly.
Only as fast as the camshaft turns. Don't worry about it.
Do worry if the engine sounds like it is cranking slow from a weak battery or weak starter.

 
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Thanks for the speedy reply! Very helpful and exactly what I was looking for.

So, screwdriver connected to ground, hold one end near the secondary coil and see if it arcs.

Sorry for the newbie question, but I'm curious...does the A and B terminal come directly from the battery? Should that be a straight 12V, or is there other circuitry involved?

Edit, I found this, I think it answers my question.

 
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A terminal at the coil? That's B+ (Battery Positive Voltage).
B is "points signal" or the trigger signal from the igniter that turns the coil on and off to make spark. Like connecting and disconnecting a ground rapidly.

 
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Checked spark at the coil, nothing, dead cold.

B+ is good.

Is there anything else worth checking? I'm thinking my next step is just to replace the entire distributor.

Thanks again!

 
Rep Power: 519

Dwell would tell me if the coil alone is faulty or if the problem is deeper, as in igniter/dist/something else. Could mean the difference between a $50 coil or a $200 dist. (guessing at prices). Simple test, like 10 minutes total so I can make the right call when I have to diagnose a no-spark.

Without knowing if the neg side of the coil is getting triggered properly, all I can do is guess....just like you.


Um, know any gearheads? Classic car guys that would have a dwellmeter for points ignition?
How about an LED test light?

 
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Understood and agreed Ezone, and your prices are pretty much dead on.

Ignitor isn't available anymore anyway, so you end up replacing the distributor in its entirety.

I'd have no problem spending the $55 to buy an automotive meter that could measure dwell if it was a bigger cost difference.

With my luck lately, I'll buy the meter and replace the coil, and the ignitor will go bad next month....lol (last month was the head gasket, month before the alternator).

 
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You're kidding, right?
http://www.hondaautomotiveparts.com/...C+-+WEASTEC%29

#7 is available if you wanted to pay for it.


Even at that price, you could still save 90 McDoubles if that helps find the actual problem.

I was thinking a meter might cost like 20 McDoubles from Sears, but maybe I'm thinking 30 years ago too.

At work we joke about how a well engineered car will have everything expire around the exact same time....I once had an 84 Mazda 626 at 180k that crapped the timing belt tensioner pulley, the igniter, and the head gasket all within 1000 miles of each other.

 
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I could have sworn I saw the ignitor as NLA....But they're proud of that thing, aren't they!?

So after checking Sears for a dwell meter ($55, although on sale!)... I sucked it up and bought the remanned distributor from Napa. $170. Stuck it on this morning, and she fired right up.

Thanks for all the help! I certainly learned from your input....much appreciated!