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please ban civictuner please

 
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"i practice my apexs and braking technique at a road course"

uh...a road course? u mean ur back alley? hahaha, since u probably don't even have ur license and u can't drive...haha, do u even know what an apex is? how do you practice ur "apex"??? and braking techniques...like what? step on the brake? hahahahaha....do u even drive standard? can u heal-n-toe? this isn't gt3, it's real life moron

 
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BAN THE WHOLE LOT OF THEM !

I'm going to argue that 2.25" exhaust is NOT the max for a n/a motor.
both Super Street and Sport Compact Car, have run Dyno's on something with a larger
motor, like a 2.0 Cavalier and proven that though the gains from 2.25 to 3" are very small they are there.

Also a resonator is absolutly pointless. Why would you put something to restrict flow on your exhuast, it is only there to act as a secondary muffler, take it off and leave it off.

Heck if you believe in Back pressure so much, you should just add a second cat to your exhaust.

I am a firm believer that the "Back pressure is necessary" theory is a MYTH, I've yet to see any evidence of it.

I have 2.5" exhaust from the cat, no resonator. The only reason I didn't get 3" is cuase it's very hard to fit in the space provided on the Civics.

 
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u don't believe in backpressure? ever try to drive with a car with just a straight pipe? there's absolutely no torque...and like you said, if the 2.25 and 3" gains are very minimal, why not go with 2.25"?? it's cheaper than 3" pipe...yes, u don't need a resonator, but u definitely need a cat if u wanna keep ur car street legal...

 
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No resonator = noise violation.

 
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No Resonator = **** sounding exhaust.

 
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He's a post *****. I don't even come here often and can see that from this post alone.

 
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I didn't know that was a law in some states, if so good point, if you wanna keep your car on the road.

As to "No res = dookie sounding exhaust"
According to who, and if that were the popular opinion, why do most of the aftermarket exhaust take them off also.

As to the Post about "No backpressure = No low end torque"
I wanna see proof!
Right now I have straight 3" straight pipe from the Cat back, runs fine, no noticable difference, AGAIN, the hp and torque gains (or losses) that we are talking about are not alot, and definatly not enough to notice. (I love when people do a small mod and claim they feel all the power, it's all mental)
And even if your correct
Well none of us are driving Chevy Big blocks, our cars are only under 2K rpm for the first .1 second of the 1/4 mile.

 
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Every legal exhaust system has Resonator connected on midpipe(B-Pipe)

 
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If it's a question of Legality. Then I can't argue with it.
But resonators still do not make the exhaust sound "Better" just softer, it's a matter of opinion, and I believe popular opinion is louder and deep is better.
It also hinders the exhaust flow so =P

 
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hahaha, i can't believe what u just said above....

popular opinion is louder and deep is better? hahahahaha, man, u watch too much fast and furious....most people out there right now are SHITTING their pants when they put an exhaust on and it's loud...NO ONE wants a loud exhaust, maybe just you and a choosen few....notice how the market for exhausts lately all lean towards street legal exhausts that isn't louder than 96db? or is it 92? i dunno...but yea, if u really want a fart cannon, go for it....

 
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^^^ sorry but I got to say
you got poned

 
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I thought it was about which exhaust yielded the most HP and still maintained legality.

 
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If you wanna disagree with me about popular opinion, then go ahead, but your fast and furious ricer comment put your theory in the hole, becuase it was a pretty popular movie, now wasn't it.

Also our cars are 1.7l. you can take the whole exhaust off, and the noise will be tolerable. Right now I have the resonator and the muffler off, I haven't recieved a single comment about noise from anyone riding in my car, I have completely stock stereo, and I ussually have it at 3 or 4 clicks. It really doesn't get loud till over 5k rpm.

If I've been owned by anything, it was Telly's (i think) original comment about a resonator being a legal requirement. I wasn't aware of that. And I'm not suggesting to anyone to make some illegal welded mods, cuase they can be a real pain to undo.

Going back to the begining, resonator and fart cans aside, it was stated that larger pipe than 2.25" would not produce gains (Someone even said it would hurt)

This still isn't true, Though the gains are small, they are there. Dyno's in SSC and Superstreet have proven it. So the question you have to ask yourself when doing exhaust, is "Do I want to increase the noise to gain the HP"

Well that is the basic question when getting ANY exhaust, and most everyone on here would say YEAH.

So when choosing 2.25", 2.5" or even 3.0" the question is "Do I want to increase the noise a little more for the little more gains?"

Well everyone on here will have different answers, but to tell people a lie that over 2.25" will harm your car or Not gain anything is wrong, let them make their own choice.

I choose the 2.5" cuase the 3 wouldn't fit, I can tell from experience the noise isn't bad, and I my cost was dirt cheap, cuase I shopped around.

Sorry for the long post.

 
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The resonator itself is not a legal requirement. The sound level that it reduces your exhaust to IS. Thus, take out your resonator if you want, but you have to find something between the cat and the tailpipe to muffle the sound even more (ie more restrictive muffler). Pretty much the only thing that can do this is a resonator no?

 
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uh, where have you been for the past few years? fast and furious was popular? yea, and those people who worshipped the movie ended up wrapping their car around a pole....

i'm an engineering and have just finished studying fluid mechanics and hydrolics....basically, that course is about pipe sizes and the most effective pipes for whichever situation, which includes the flow of water, flow of air & gasses....we found that 2.25" has the lowest friction resistance, and also to be one of the most efficient pipes for volume flow rate....the 3" pipe isn't that far behind...but what's the point of buying a 3" pipe when a 2.25" will work perfectly fine? and for ur information, i never said anything about the 2.25" or 3" not adding performance....all i'm claiming is that the 2.25" will be more efficient/effective than the 3"

 
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Ohh... Okay, then I misread your post, sorry.

Yes, a resonator would be a good option versus a more restrictive muffler.
But once Again a 1.7l engine will not go above the sound level of most states.
And if that is the case, the best option, would be one of those prefabricated muzzles that you can stick into your tip and take back out when you go to the track.

If you have a High displacement engine, such as a big block, you will definatly need a resonator. If you have a large 4 cylinder or a 6 cylinder you may or may not be able to use the muzzled exhaust.

Also the exhuast muzzle (I have a funny feeling it has a technical name I can't think of) is going to be cheaper than replacing a resonator.

 
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Seriously no offense, i'm not trying to rag on you, but it is very hard to take you seriously as an engineer when you are making statements like this and argueing with a 12 year old about busting donuts in a back alley or some junk.

I'm glad to hear your an engineering student, I'm a civil engineer. I work full time and go to school part time finishing my degree. What field of engineering are you going into? If you haven't decided Civil and Environmental are great fields to get into and the demand for work is VERY high, there is a really short supply of Civil and Env. engineers coming out from the schools. PM me if you want and I'd be happy to talk about it more.

**Here is the Part I live for**
You're going to have to explain more in depth what your doing in your class that found a 2.5" pipe to flow more fluid than a 3.0" pipe. I'm just testing some number on some mannings software and for a comparision between and 2.5" and 3.0" inch pipe (Same Manning's Coeffecient (0.012), Channel Slope(0.0005ft/ft), Both Full flow) The 2.5" discharges 0.01 cfs at 0.39 ft/s while the 3" discharges 0.02 cfs at 0.44 ft/s
Apples for Apples a larger pipe will always increase flow. So if you can explain it better I'll see if I Can follow along.

I never accused you of saying anything, someone who only posted once, claimed that 3" would either harm the system, or produce less gains, I dunno, and I don't wanna look it up.

all i'm doing is disagreeing with you that 3" will be more efficient/effective than 2.5"

Sorry for the two post I wanted to use the quote feature, i'm not trying to imitate the JayDm guy

 
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lol

 
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I hate all of you for making me read all that crap.

 
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I know ... I'm a dork... I admit it

 
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Damn gtracing you got pwned. It's OK come to Mississauga for my bday. It was a good debate nonetheless.

 
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whoa, we are both civil engineers!!!!! crazyness...i understand what your saying...but remember, increased diameter of the pipe also decreases the pressure....so with a bigger diameter pipe, u won't have any pressure in the pipe, causing ur car to lose torque....and also, with a bigger diameter pipe, we're also decreasing the velocity of the gases coming out, with a slower velocity of the emissions coming out, the muffler will make a farting sound cause of all the vibrations (i guess it's vibrations) making it sound louder than what it really is...we have a 4 cylinder engine, u really think a 3" pipe is gonna help our car gain that much hp? maybe i think u need to go upgrade?? if anything, we'd need more torque to compensate for our dinky 127hp engines

 
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trust me, i've gone through enough catbacks on my old car to know....anywhere from 2.25" to 3.5" diameter piping....i found out that the larger the pipe, the nastier the car sounds....but after i turbo charged & engine swapped it, the 3" sounded the best if u ask me...and the only reason i'm arguing with a 11teen is cause he literally is a dumbass and should be banned from this board

and telly, no, i never get owned....

u should come to etown to celebrate my bday with me!

 
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oh besides, 3" diameter pipe wouldn't even fit our cars without it hitting the sway bar or rear lower control arm...if anyone even makes a 3" catback for our cars

 
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That is crazy, there aren't that many Civil majors out there.

My whole arguement is that even though pressure and velocity are going to be lost, it does not Restrict the flow of gases out of the cylinders, becuase there is no pressure resisting the flow. One of the main reason to have thin pipes creating velocity and pressure, is to move the exhuast (AND THE HEAT.) But now-a-days cars are running at lower and lower temps, and they are operating at High rpms (Just like our Hondas) So it is becoming much safer to lose that velocity and pressure.

And yes 3" won't fit I tried =)

I also always say, get custom bent pipe, it's cheaper and just as good.

Well we could arguee about this for years, but I'll wait till the next exhaust thread pops up... you guys have a good B-day.

 
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Yea, all shut up and back to the topic.

 
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4jacks: yes, i do agree that 3" has a much lesser restriction, but the problem with that is our cars will lose too much torque..(which we all rely on because the lack of hp like stated above), so there's really no point in getting an exhaust that big....in the end it all comes down to ur driving skills, who cares about exhausts..i don't even have an exhaust my this car right now, only header...no catback...

and yea, i'm taking civil engineering, i'm currently in my second year, i'm not in no university, just doing college at nait (northern alberta institute of technology), 2 year problem, and after i graduate..that's it for me..haha, gotta find a job...

civicvtec1ps: STFU! can't u see us "engineers" are having a conversation?

 
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p.s. 4jack, maybe u can help me with my homework!!! =)

 
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YEAH BEOTCH! This is the Topic.

lol j/k

That's SERIOUSLY the way to Go!
That's what I did, I did two Years at a Community College, then got a job.
After less than a year on my job, i'm making $30k a year
PLUS they're paying 100% of my college tutition if I get an A or B and
75% if I get a C.
So You know I'm getting a A in every class.
Adding in my tutition i'm making almost $40k
Plus, even though it's going to take me longer to finish the four year program
By the time I'm done I'll have four years of working experience and be able to test for the P.E. exam.
If I can get my P.E. lisence that's 60-75K EASY

That's cool that you got fluids in a two year program, at University of Delaware, where i'm finishing my Bacholear's it's a 3rd year course.

You can find a job right now NO problem, Hell if you wanna move to Maryland, I can get you interview at my work, we need Civil and Environmental Engineers right now.

And I know I lied and said I wasn't debating this anymore, but i'm too big of a dork. You're only losing that power under 3k rpm's or so... OVER 3k rpm's is where you begin to see the increases. And over 3k is where our cars perform!! if you run the 1/4 mile, you will only be under 3k rpm for under 1/2 a second of a 15-16 second race. It just doesn't make sense