ATF vs MTF
09-20-2004
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ATF vs MTF
Just more of a curious question, but is there any real difference between ATF and MTF? I think I need to change my ATF here sometime soon and was wondering what would happen if I accidentally put in MTF. Are there some weird detergents in one, but not the other? 
Just wondering for general knowledge.
Just wondering for general knowledge. 
09-20-2004
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Rep Power: 249 Taz:
go to redlineoil.com and check out the descriptions for their ATF and MTL products adn you'll see most of the difference.
The short version is that ATF is a lot slicker because you want max lubrication because all the clutch plates in an ATF provide the wear and friction, and you want the gears to be as safe and slick as possible.
IN a manual tranny, it's different, because you have what are called synchros to help get you into the next gear at any RPM. if you look up "Double clutching," you'll get a better explanation than I can give here, but it boils down to in a tranny, the shaft from the input (engine) needs to be moving at the same rate of speed as the output shaft (wheels) for the gears to mesh together. the grinding you hear on older trannies happens when one set of gears is trying to turn the other set to the same rate.
What a synchro is is a little fork that speeds up the input shaft to whaever gear you are going to before you actually get in gear... think of it as kind of a helper that says "heads up, going to third.. need to get in there before he puts it in gear and speed up the gear so we don't grind"
The synchro forks need friction to do their job of spinning the drive to a faster speed. Hence, MTF/MTL has a different composition to allow the synchros to mesh up and get that friction, while ATF is very slick and focuses on minmal friction and max heat dissipation.
Hope that answers your question. BTW, the biggest thing that we do to our cars that are stick is drive them wrong and put wear on the synchros... save your tranny and when downshifting in a 5-speed, blip the gas so the engine RPM's are about at what they will be in the new gear, THEN shift out of neutral to the new gear. F you double clutch, you'll make it last even more, but it's a bit over kill.
go to redlineoil.com and check out the descriptions for their ATF and MTL products adn you'll see most of the difference.
The short version is that ATF is a lot slicker because you want max lubrication because all the clutch plates in an ATF provide the wear and friction, and you want the gears to be as safe and slick as possible.
IN a manual tranny, it's different, because you have what are called synchros to help get you into the next gear at any RPM. if you look up "Double clutching," you'll get a better explanation than I can give here, but it boils down to in a tranny, the shaft from the input (engine) needs to be moving at the same rate of speed as the output shaft (wheels) for the gears to mesh together. the grinding you hear on older trannies happens when one set of gears is trying to turn the other set to the same rate.
What a synchro is is a little fork that speeds up the input shaft to whaever gear you are going to before you actually get in gear... think of it as kind of a helper that says "heads up, going to third.. need to get in there before he puts it in gear and speed up the gear so we don't grind"
The synchro forks need friction to do their job of spinning the drive to a faster speed. Hence, MTF/MTL has a different composition to allow the synchros to mesh up and get that friction, while ATF is very slick and focuses on minmal friction and max heat dissipation.
Hope that answers your question. BTW, the biggest thing that we do to our cars that are stick is drive them wrong and put wear on the synchros... save your tranny and when downshifting in a 5-speed, blip the gas so the engine RPM's are about at what they will be in the new gear, THEN shift out of neutral to the new gear. F you double clutch, you'll make it last even more, but it's a bit over kill.
09-20-2004
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Rep Power: 249 Even Better:
http://mydreams.go.ro/art_double_clutching.html
much better explanation and howto than I can give.
http://mydreams.go.ro/art_double_clutching.html
much better explanation and howto than I can give.
09-20-2004
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Originally Posted by reddawnman
Taz:
go to redlineoil.com and check out the descriptions for their ATF and MTL products adn you'll see most of the difference.
The short version is that ATF is a lot slicker because you want max lubrication because all the clutch plates in an ATF provide the wear and friction, and you want the gears to be as safe and slick as possible.
IN a manual tranny, it's different, because you have what are called synchros to help get you into the next gear at any RPM. if you look up "Double clutching," you'll get a better explanation than I can give here, but it boils down to in a tranny, the shaft from the input (engine) needs to be moving at the same rate of speed as the output shaft (wheels) for the gears to mesh together. the grinding you hear on older trannies happens when one set of gears is trying to turn the other set to the same rate.
What a synchro is is a little fork that speeds up the input shaft to whaever gear you are going to before you actually get in gear... think of it as kind of a helper that says "heads up, going to third.. need to get in there before he puts it in gear and speed up the gear so we don't grind"
The synchro forks need friction to do their job of spinning the drive to a faster speed. Hence, MTF/MTL has a different composition to allow the synchros to mesh up and get that friction, while ATF is very slick and focuses on minmal friction and max heat dissipation.
Hope that answers your question. BTW, the biggest thing that we do to our cars that are stick is drive them wrong and put wear on the synchros... save your tranny and when downshifting in a 5-speed, blip the gas so the engine RPM's are about at what they will be in the new gear, THEN shift out of neutral to the new gear. F you double clutch, you'll make it last even more, but it's a bit over kill.
go to redlineoil.com and check out the descriptions for their ATF and MTL products adn you'll see most of the difference.
The short version is that ATF is a lot slicker because you want max lubrication because all the clutch plates in an ATF provide the wear and friction, and you want the gears to be as safe and slick as possible.
IN a manual tranny, it's different, because you have what are called synchros to help get you into the next gear at any RPM. if you look up "Double clutching," you'll get a better explanation than I can give here, but it boils down to in a tranny, the shaft from the input (engine) needs to be moving at the same rate of speed as the output shaft (wheels) for the gears to mesh together. the grinding you hear on older trannies happens when one set of gears is trying to turn the other set to the same rate.
What a synchro is is a little fork that speeds up the input shaft to whaever gear you are going to before you actually get in gear... think of it as kind of a helper that says "heads up, going to third.. need to get in there before he puts it in gear and speed up the gear so we don't grind"
The synchro forks need friction to do their job of spinning the drive to a faster speed. Hence, MTF/MTL has a different composition to allow the synchros to mesh up and get that friction, while ATF is very slick and focuses on minmal friction and max heat dissipation.
Hope that answers your question. BTW, the biggest thing that we do to our cars that are stick is drive them wrong and put wear on the synchros... save your tranny and when downshifting in a 5-speed, blip the gas so the engine RPM's are about at what they will be in the new gear, THEN shift out of neutral to the new gear. F you double clutch, you'll make it last even more, but it's a bit over kill.
So would this be some good ATF to go with? Or should I check out the stuff from Redline?
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