Final DYNO! Car is complete I/H/E PnP Cam gear VafcII graph, mods, pic, 2k2 auto - Honda Civic Forum



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Old 10-22-2005   #1
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Final DYNO! Car is complete I/H/E PnP Cam gear VafcII graph, mods, pic, 2k2 auto

This is the end as far as performance goes. I got the last few parts and headed down to the dyno shop today to get the cam gear and vafcII tuned. Well with the mods I have, they didn't have to add alot of fuel. Right now its around 14:1 with mostly +1 across the board. The before dyno was from last time, the new dyno is with the RSR exhaust and cam gear added. They ended up retarding the gear to -1.5 which gave more hp and little torque loss. They tried it at +2 and 0, but it wasn't really helping except the torque stayed the same. Overall its pretty much what you would expect from a power-robbing auto trans but thats about it.

Engine/Performance Modifications:
-Ground Wire Upgrade
-Apexi VAFC-II Controler
-Optima Yellow Battery
-Kamikaze Ceramic Header
-DH Racing Port and Polish Head
-B+M Transmission Cooler
-AEM Power Steering Pulley
-K+N Typhoon SRI
-Hyper Voltage System MR
-Upgraded Headlight Harness
-AEM 5 Bolt Cam Gear
-RS*R Ex Mag Exhaust
-FP60 and LC20 additives


Cam gear set: 1.5 degrees retarded

VAFCII set:

wide hi vtec

2600 +1
2700 +1
3000 +1
3400 +1
3600 +1
4000 +1
4400 +1
4800 +1
5200 +1
5800 +1
6400 +1
6900 +2

WIDE LO VTEC

1000 +1
1200 +1
1400 +1
1600 +1
1800 +1
2000 +1
2200 +1
2400 +1
2900 +1
3100 +1
3300 +1
3500 +1

Narrow hi vtec

2600 +1
2700 +1
3000 +1
3400 +1
3600 +1
4000 +1
4400 +1
4800 +1
5200 +1
5800 +1
6400 +2
6900 +2

narrow lo vtec

1000 +1
1200 +1
1400 +1
1600 +1
1800 +1
2000 +1
2200 +1
2400 +1
2900 +1
3100 +1
3300 +1
3500 +1

dyno temp around 65F with hood open

I lost a bit of torque below 3500rpms but the line is alot smoother than before, and everything else went up.

A/F is right around 14, tad lean but not a big deal. nice and straight.

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Old 10-22-2005   #2
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at least you gained somethin from adding those new parts not knocking on you but we can't make gains on the D17 more of a reason to get a swap
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Old 10-22-2005   #3
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Wasn't yours the engine that DH Racing did a really shyte PnP job on? Or was that somebody else?
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Old 10-22-2005   #4
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yea it was DH, but the job wasn't that bad compared to others. the head and header alone made most of the power actually. autos usually start at 90whp and mods don't add much. If this was a manual, add +20hp to my numbers. It feels better, low end about the same, but I only had a chance to hit hi rpms a few times. it felt like there was vtec now after 4.5k rpms.
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Old 10-22-2005   #5
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you need a stage 3 cam... then you'll see some good power
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Old 10-22-2005   #6
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All of that for only 4whp, damn...maybe in a manual you'll gain like 12whp, I think.
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Old 10-22-2005   #7
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i thought that, but i've been looking through the "power pages" of import tuner mag today where they pick a car and dyno after each bolton, and most of those gave the same result. 2-3hp for intake, same for exhaust. They ended up putting around $1k of boltons and the combined hp was around 5-10whp. So i don't feel too bad.
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Old 10-22-2005   #8
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and you guys can't just say i only gained 4whp peak. You gotta look at the whole graph. Cause technically I can say that I got a 10whp increase at 6800rpms.
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Old 10-22-2005   #9
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Sorry I just looked at the numbers, but seeing the graph now, you got a good increase at top end, how the car feels now when you get to 6000 rpms?
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Old 10-22-2005   #10
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i still gotta try. took it around 5.5k and i could feel the power come in. i'm too tired now but i'll prolly make a vid later.
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Old 10-22-2005   #11
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you shoulda gotten one of these...http://www.turbonator.com/index.html?id=adWordsCivic could have gotten 35HP for only $70.00. LOL
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Old 10-22-2005   #12
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it's not just about peak hp. 4 hp is only the peak numbers ... u gotta look at the over all ... at peak rpms, about 6800, he gained 10 whp.

gear, can you borrow someone's cai and re dyno? ... preferably an aem cai or injen cai...

oh yeah ... and don't let the intake touch the throttle body when you put the connector hose on it ;P
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Old 10-22-2005   #13
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lol. i was thinking about gettin the k&N typhoon cca (cold air/short) but it rains way too much to be practical. i would kill the car what i really need is a vented hood/
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Old 10-23-2005   #14
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I'm glad youre done w/ the power mods, I'm sure it's been a long road for you
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Old 10-23-2005   #15
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a vented hood would be great...i know with the cooler temps too now your car will feel great. but have you done any transmission upgrades? TC or flywheel? I bet with those two mods your car would be 'quicker' and you would notice the power throughout the powerband better
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Old 10-23-2005   #16
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auto trans
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Old 10-23-2005   #17
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wow....all that $$ for 104 whp
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Old 10-23-2005   #18
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real nice gains at hi rpm. i know thats where i need to gain more power myself. what do you have your cam gear set to?
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Old 10-23-2005   #19
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cam gear is retarded -1.5 degrees. He said most sohc honda motors will be similar due to their hi-rev nature. They tried at 0 and 2 advanced, but no gains really. With it retarded, I gained alot more hp and lost a tiny bit of torque (1-2tq).
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Old 10-23-2005   #20
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Ok, I am curious, Honda's have always been known for performance, or the ability to make it but by modding. What happened with our cars? If I would have known this, I would have gone back to 6th gen, or bought 8th gen. I am not a hp man, I love my fuel economy, but they seem sort of sluggish.
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Old 10-23-2005   #21
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Well after all the crap I threw on, I think the mileage is still good. Just use lubecontrol.com products. Its not anything new with our cars. The older civics weren't great with mods either. I think its more of a fad or rumor that has been spread. Because if you look at the dynos, the others civics are still only getting 1-2hp from boltons. Even the rsx doesn't get that much. Look at Import Tuner's power pages for the dynos. The only good power increase I've seen is with the 99-00 SI but you gotta do some serious engine work to get it making power and even then its gonna be way up top after 5k rpms. Unless you slap on a supercharger; then you're gonna be faster than most cars on the road.
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Old 10-23-2005   #22
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my old 96 had pickup, it would throw me back a bit. I love my 7th gen, but I wish there were more I could do with it. lol.
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Old 10-23-2005   #23
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Also manual vs. auto makes a difference. My heavily modded auto makes as much power as a stock manual civic.

for example, a 2004 civic si made 14whp total after $1500 for IHE.

a 98 civic ex made 12whp with IHE.

i think thats pretty consistant with numbers from ours cars.
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Old 10-23-2005   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gearbox
cam gear is retarded -1.5 degrees. He said most sohc honda motors will be similar due to their hi-rev nature. They tried at 0 and 2 advanced, but no gains really. With it retarded, I gained alot more hp and lost a tiny bit of torque (1-2tq).
hmmm. i woulda thought advancing it would have done more than retarding it. I'll have to remember that when i install my cam gear. was there anythign else to the cam gear besides installing and setting it?
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Old 10-24-2005   #25
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well its basically a timing belt change procedure. I had them do the timing belt, crank pulley (old was was breaking apart), and water pump since its the same labor. Also the dust covers have to stay off unless you want the gear to grind em up. That leaves the gear open unfortunately. But also makes it easy to adjust. You loosen the adjusting bolts and turn the middle wheel until the degree changes.

and yea advancing is supposed to give more torque, but our engines aren't the best for that anyway. they're built for hp, which is why retarding helped more. You can really feel a difference in the way it revs above 4k.
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Old 10-24-2005   #26
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hmmm...sounds good. whenever i run against anyone, they always gain and pass me when im at hi-rpm. once we shift i jump on them in low-mid. anythig that will give me some hi end is a plus to me
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Old 10-24-2005   #27
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ya and i remember there was a stock civic tested and at 2 degrees advance it made 2-3 whp from 4.5k rpms and up. So its prolly best to run it on a dyno a few times with your setup.
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Old 10-24-2005   #28
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what do you think gave you the 10whp gain in the hi end?
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Old 10-24-2005   #29
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well its some from exhaust and some from cam gear. thats all that changed. vafcII is set very low (+1) cause the a/f was pretty good already.
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Old 10-24-2005   #30
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did the vafcII really do any good? Ive heard that they arent worth the money unless you plan to use it for boosted apps
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