SlammedBlueEM2

iTrader: (2)

They came in yesterday. I don't want to go into the story of having to wait 40 days for them to ship, cancelling and reordering through another vendor (StreetLevelPerformance). Let's get down to business.

Installation/Uninstallation:

I had to uninstall my Hayame V2s and sadly enough I did not get a chance to see how they compare to the V1s since I was ordered by Hayame SPW to drilled the tapered tie rod hole. My best friend happened to stop by and help me with the installation which took roughly 2 hours. This included assembling the B+Gs with the stock 2002 uppermounts (THEY FIT FINE), lubing the spring contact areas (I only did the fronts) taking off the front Hayames as the rears were off the previous day and putting in the B+Gs, setting the height, fixing the camber in the rear left wheel, blah. My front wheels were misaligned.


Drive:

After rolling the car off of the bricks the first thing I noticed was that the Hayames were considerably softer as the front suspension compressed more. My friend and I went out and wow, it felt nice. Immediately I thought these performed better than the Hayames, but I wanted to see how they'd fair on the freeway on rougher roads and this is where B+Gs really proved their value over my Hayames. The ride is fantastic. Instead of bouncing up and down with the quickness with Hayame's Tokico valving, the B_G valving is FAR more refined... like stock. I love it... I was impressed how well the suspension handles itself over uneven pavement instead of following how the road changes. This was awesome. I'm not sure if my steering response dropped a bit as I did not get to throw it too hard into curves but I could not be more satisfied with how the car RIDES. The car is also more balanced in the handling department (I have the 25/22 anti sway bar set-up and Hayame promotes oversteer with that set-up.) It outclasses Hayame by far... very far. I don't think I had any noises but things like that can take time to develop.


Eye catching:

On other side notes, the welding job is also a lot better than Hayame's. It looks excellent - professional. Not cheap like some type of elementary school science project. After this experience, I can see why the Hayames are $650. Within this comparison, you get what you pay for. We'll see how they last in the long run. I've known at least two people personally who've had them for almost two years and have had no complains with them so I hope I can keep that tradition lasting. Heightwise, Hayames can go lower in the front (but you'll bottom out most likely). My fronts are almost at their lowest and the wheel gap is almost filled with 205/50-15s, but I've seen them fill the gap on my friend's ride with 195/50s and B+Gs. The rears will tuck, so if you've ever had Ground Controls, you know what I mean.

There still needs to be some tampering done, like fixing the ride height and camber. Need to retighten the lower bolts in the rear. <-Reminder to self!

For (near) entry level coilovers, these are worth the few hundred more over Hayame. Never buy a new product on the market. I can't cut my trust cards with companies that do not have a good track record or if they don't have much of a record to show about that part they produce. If you're having issues with them, ditch your Hayames and jump on the B+G bandwagon.


EDIT:

The bad:
I did not receive my spanner wrenches! Jeff, I need'em!

Update 8-19-04:

Alright, it's been some time now since I've had these and it's time to re-evaluate the B+Gs.

I've had time to lower the car as low as it would go on the front and to my surprise, it doesn't go as low as I expected it to go... or as low as my friend's car was. I asked him if he did anything different, like remove one of the locking nuts but he said he just lowered it all the way. The difference between my car and his is that he has no gap in the front and I do have some wheel gap (about 3/4 of an inch is my guess). We run the same tire size. Unfortunately he had a shop install his for him so he doesn't have any details on installation. I'm guessing he got his to go a bit lower in the front because the shop probably didn't install the uppermount with the bearing ring that goes inside it (02 uppermount). I already had my car aligned so I won't be daring to see if that part is necessary for installation... we'll see if I have the time. If it doesn't work, I could be looking into 01 uppermounts.

Details on 01 and 02+ uppermount differences can be seen here: http://www.gametrax.net/b+g/


With the fronts as low as they can go, the shocks tend to bottom out on very hard bumps, but bottoming out is not as bad as say being slammed on stock shocks. There is still enough travel in the shock to prevent unwanted bottoming out. This is where Hayame wins. It would be nice for B+G to have the 3-locking nut technology embedded in their front suspension to allow better lowering and shock travel, but like the traditional lowering ride height on a normal strut, the lower you go, the more you sacrafice. It's something I can deal with but if B+G ever redesign their front suspension to 3-locking nuts, I'll be all over it. I've also gotten some random front noise in the front suspension while turning the wheel. Sounds like the spring is trying to turn with the suspension. I'm not so sure but it will be looked at once I reinstall the front.

As for the rear suspension? Don't change it - the very design is what keeps the option of changing the height to where you want it, is also what makes these full coilovers an excellent choice. There's so much adjustability in the rear, you'll probably never run out of shock travel even if you tucked the entire tire down to the rim. (Okay, maybe not but with about an inch of wheel gap in the rear, I won't be bottoming out any time soon.) Haven't had any noises with the rear.

Last but not least, I still have not received the spanner wrenches.



UPDATE 9-26-04

Well, the suspension seems to be holding up good so far. I have a few notes to make.

On the 20th I finally received a package with the spanner wrench... that's right! I only received ONE WRENCH.

I experienced a squeaking noise from the rear suspension. Not sure where it came from but I believe it's gone.

There appears to be more bumpsteer, which is natural given the geometry of the tie rods is different from lowering so much. I have to say, this is something that's given Hayame's straight arm design for the tie rod a compromise. With the Hayame front suspension slammed, you will effectively eliminate the bumpsteer however you will encourage wheel spin/wheel hop. It's hard to tell which is worse than the other.

Last but not least, the lubricant used to keep the front springs from spinning as the wheels turn did not last long. It might be due to the fact that the spring contact area did not need the lubricant more than the ring in the upper 02 mount. This isn't much of a bother when you're driving the car at 10mph+ but it's noticable in the feel of steering when the wheel has to be turned for say, parking situations. Thus, I'm going to have to recommend the use of the 01 uppermounts to prevent this. Lubricant may still need to be used I'm sure.


Performance!

I'm enjoying the performance of these coilovers. Vs. Hayame, I'm going to have to say that Hayames are definintely more go kart-ish, however I feel like I have more control of the car with this suspension set-up with the throttle. The car is very balanced with the softer spring rates. There's a tad bit oversteer with my set-up... just enough to give you the ability to keep the car straight with the front wheels. It's definintely a fun street suspension.


Update: 10-11-04: Spanner Wrenches

Alright, like a few weeks ago, B+G sent me ONE spanner wrench. How does a person tighten two locking nuts together with ONE spanner wrench? It's impossible. For you guys that received B+Gs, how many Bilstein wrenches did you get? I'm being told through StreetLevel that the distributor is only supposed to give out one and if that's the case, why send it if I can only do so much with it?

Otherwise, the coilovers on my car seem to be fine.

indoyum

Dizzaaymn!! Slammedblue finally got it in! Sounds really exciting. Makes me wanna celebrate for you. I'm happy for you, all you need to do now is take some pictures and post

So the 2002 strut mounts work fine?

My wait is too long, I need to get mine soon!! argh, sucks being broke.

obguam

iTrader: (1)

Glad for you too, Slammed. I'm leaning towards B&G's now.

TeLLy

iTrader: (23)

Not a bad review at all. Goes to show, you gotta pay to play in the world of suspension.

ironcow

iTrader: (6)

congrats man.. i didnt want to take the chance with the 02 uppers but i hope that you have no problems..i love the feel of them, its like a soft pillow

post pics

StreetLevelPerformance

iTrader: (29)

Slammed check your PM

518

Im loving every minute that I drive my car

I made one mistake, I didnt lube the front upper mounts It's squeeking alright, but nothing that I cant ignore

Im going to try to lube it without taking the top mount off the car. Is it even possible? I dont know, I'll find out.

Slammed, I dont think it comes with spanner wrenches. Jeff sent me a Bilstein wrech, which has an awesome grip

Honda2k4

so for an 04 civic you would have to get 02 uppermounts?

518

Supposedly...supposedly, 02+ may need an 01 upper mount. There are several members here who kept their upper mount (put grease on) and have had no problems, yet.

02+ Fits fine but it is not as flushed as the 01 rubber bearing.

01 rubber bearing = Sits 'perfect' and no paranoia
02+ rubber bearing = Sits okay and is drivable

SlammedBlueEM2

iTrader: (2)

It's not necessary to get the 01 uppermount. I see it as completely optional. Once you put the nut on top it sits on top without any play, and that's what matters.

I don't think so. I am not sure but it should work. I really don't see why it shouldn't but it should.

The uppermount is compressed on top of the spring. You're gonna have to take it off and disassemble the coilover. I found the rears harder to put on the car because it has to be compressed. Instead of standing on the brake (which doesn't work... at least not for me) and easier way to compress the rear is to use a jack and set it under the perch (if your jack is small enough) and jack up the coilover once it's sat in place. You can easily get it in place through this method.

And yes, they do come with spanner wrenches as my friends have them when they got their B+Gs. Unfortunately, B+G ran out of wrenches which is what Jeff said. So they're giving out better wrenches.

Did you order from tunersports.com? I don't think distributors are taking tunersports.com seriously. When I cancelled on Friday, they said that they were ready to ship. If they're not shipping by now there are other options. I'm glad I went with StreetLevelPerformance.

SlammedBlueEM2

iTrader: (2)

I was watching tuner transformation earlier and I noticed that they were installing some B+G coilovers on this Chevy Cavalier... but they weren't B+G, they were "RK Sports" coilovers. Hmm...

Gonna do some research. :-D

SlammedBlueEM2

iTrader: (2)

RK sports deals mostly with domestic cars.

indoyum

looks similar.

SlammedBlueEM2

iTrader: (2)

Looks the same to the locking nuts. The only difference is that particular one is made for a different car. That one looks much like the ones they used in the show.

And I forgot to mention - on the show they don't come with uppermounts. The stock mounts have to be used.

rijowysock

iTrader: (21)

i love my B&G's


riley


i need to lube my front tho.. and im too lazy to do 2 hours worth of work to do it...

ironcow

iTrader: (6)

b+g = teh sex

but i need to raise my rears up...i hope its not that hard

rijowysock

iTrader: (21)

did i mention i love B&G customer service.. wow i called my friendly sales man and told him the problem i was having... my driver side spring went limp somehow someway and well their sending me a new spring free of charge. :-)


riley

ironcow

iTrader: (6)

i though u were sellin ur b+gs

jwsisme

I drove in 518's car with Hayame's and then with the B&G's.
The B&G's were much smoother, no real bounce to speak of.
The Hayame's were bouncy... way too bouncy for me.

SlammedBlueEM2

iTrader: (2)

I'll update you guys an update on about what I think about them over the last few days I've had them. Been quite busy lately.

TuffVietta

iTrader: (2)

im thinking about purchasing these and i was wondering where can i purchase the 01 uppermounts and how much do they cost? also, im an 02 civic and i was wondering if there is anything else i should need to get other than the uppermounts. thanks.

SlammedBlueEM2

iTrader: (2)

Update! Read first post!

Here you go, lazies! http://www.7thgencivic.com/forums/sh...62#post2214462

518

I'll lube or even replace the rubber ring when I get my 12V Impact Wrench Kit. With that wrench kit, everything's going to be easier from rotating wheels to engine work.

$65.00, I cant beat that

Great review slammed

VNlilMAN

iTrader: (7)

Thats the thing with the whole bearing issue. If the bearings aren't working smoothly, the springs are going to try and turn. maybe the 01 bearings would fix this?

SlammedBlueEM2

iTrader: (2)

A performance review coming soon.

I see... that's an issue I did not find when researching but it's good to know what it is.

Big Baller L

iTrader: (5)

Nice review! I just put my b+g's on today, but didnt have time to play with settings.
Slammed is you're helper spring in the back fully compressed. When my car is on the ground the lower spring looks like its fully compressed and not doing much. I think maybe i tightened the top strut bolt(middle one) too tight, and compressed the springs too much.
It looks like this
I dont see how that spring can do anything being so compressed...almost defeats the purpose of having it there.

SlammedBlueEM2

iTrader: (2)

That's very normal for a helper spring. What the helper spring does is allow full extension of the suspension during hard cornering. It does nothing when the car is stationary.

Big Baller L

iTrader: (5)

^alright i didnt know that. So how tight is you're upper strut bolt (middle one)? Mine is all the way untill it hits the end of the threads. Is that too tight, or normal? Thanks

518

Exactly.

In addition, this could be the reason why its smooth on uneven roads. The helper springs lengthens. Therefore, keeping the chassis/car moving straight instead of moving up and down on the uneven road.

I remember I owe somebody a picture after install. I forgot who. Anyway, I have my car lowered like this:

blouisgod

iTrader: (14)

Nice work.

I'm about 7 threads from the bottom on the front coilovers and with a kaminari front lip and 205/40/17's, i have about 1.5 inches of front ground clearance. i think they go low enough. Also, I scrape my midpipe like crazy but thats the price you pay when you lay low.