Hayame or D2?
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 232
Likes: 0
From: Atlanta
Rep Power: 0 
Hayame or D2?
I ordered the Hayame coilovers over a month ago. They have been on back order for probably 6 weeks or so. Today I got an e-mail from the shop I ordered from saying that the Hayames will not be in for another 2-3 weeks. It continued to say that they are now offering anothe full coilover set up made by D2. I have never heard of this company. They are supposed to be popular in Asia and Europe and they have more adujustment options than the Hayames. They are $200 more. Has anyone heard anything of this company...good or bad?
Originally posted by CIVIC808
thats where he probably ordered from.i got that same message from urbanimports.i just wanna know if goes low as the hayames and not have to rough of a ride.
thats where he probably ordered from.i got that same message from urbanimports.i just wanna know if goes low as the hayames and not have to rough of a ride.
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 232
Likes: 0
From: Atlanta
Rep Power: 0 Originally posted by JCiv03
Urbanimport is selling these as well. Maybe u can ask him for more info.
Urbanimport is selling these as well. Maybe u can ask him for more info.
Registered!!
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 303
Likes: 0
From: , Other, ZEBRA
Rep Power: 0 From the picture you attached, it seems the D2 doesn't have the 3rd lock nut which is quite important in adjusting the spring load as well as damping stroke length retention. On the plus side, in the picture the D2 seems to come with a top camber plate. Also, the arm which facilitates the tie rod end mounting is very identical to stock which is similar to a Tein coilover design. This should reduce bumpsteer compared to the Hayame's which come as a straight piece going perpendicular from the strut. On the contrary, the Hayames will allow you to lower your car alot without much change in the tie rod angle. The D2 comes wth damping adjustability as well, but the Hayames do not. End of the day, it's about being satisfied with the choice of your suspension. Perhaps Vnilman or some other Hayame users can give you some advise here.
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,857
Likes: 0
From: Gaithersburg, MD
Rep Power: 412 
Spring rates? Is it a pillowball?
also I have to go along with Gary said. They only have 2 locking nuts, not 3 which makes adjusting the height/preload very difficult and probably time consuming to get it right. The base looks better made than the Hayames. They also have a camber plate, which will probably not be too useful since it changes the toe so severely.
also I have to go along with Gary said. They only have 2 locking nuts, not 3 which makes adjusting the height/preload very difficult and probably time consuming to get it right. The base looks better made than the Hayames. They also have a camber plate, which will probably not be too useful since it changes the toe so severely.
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,857
Likes: 0
From: Gaithersburg, MD
Rep Power: 412 Originally posted by PunkingCivic
those are hella nice. Id get those. that $200 more is for those camber/catser plates.
sweet.
those are hella nice. Id get those. that $200 more is for those camber/catser plates.
sweet.
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 13,151
Likes: 3
From: Washington DC
Rep Power: 424 I'm sorry, but those things just look so cheap. There's no beef to those things at all. I'm gonna go to the getting what you pay for argument... JIC, Tein, Buddy Club, Zeal, Apexi, Tanabe, and HKS dampers all cost what they do for a pretty good reason. A good set of camber plates is $400. A good set of race springs is about $300. A decient set of dampers (not awesome ones like Motons or Penskes), is at least $500-$1000. Do the math.
Originally posted by Boilermaker1
I'm sorry, but those things just look so cheap. There's no beef to those things at all. I'm gonna go to the getting what you pay for argument... JIC, Tein, Buddy Club, Zeal, Apexi, Tanabe, and HKS dampers all cost what they do for a pretty good reason. A good set of camber plates is $400. A good set of race springs is about $300. A decient set of dampers (not awesome ones like Motons or Penskes), is at least $500-$1000. Do the math.
I'm sorry, but those things just look so cheap. There's no beef to those things at all. I'm gonna go to the getting what you pay for argument... JIC, Tein, Buddy Club, Zeal, Apexi, Tanabe, and HKS dampers all cost what they do for a pretty good reason. A good set of camber plates is $400. A good set of race springs is about $300. A decient set of dampers (not awesome ones like Motons or Penskes), is at least $500-$1000. Do the math.
Spring rates are the same as Hayame. The D2 is also 36 way dampner adjustable.
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 13,151
Likes: 3
From: Washington DC
Rep Power: 424 Compare that casing to this....
JIC brackets and cases are at least double wall thick, triple in some places, the lower rear bushing is integrated right into the shock cup (which is 1/4" walled) rather than welded on like an afterthought, the front bracket is welded on, Jic wraps it around then seamwelds the whole thing, the second layer of the the bracket is then welded in from the other side, so the lower front bracket actually goes all the way around. All the bracketing on those looks like crap. It looks wimpy and looks pretty easy to bust off. The only thing that looks decient is the steering arm, which looks very robust, especially compared to the little stick that Hayame decided was good enough. Spring rates can be whatever they want them to be. That all comes down to how they're made, what kind of tolerance they're held to, and whether or not they're consistent enough to hold their length. 36 way dampers? Who needs that. No one is adjusting them between 36 settings, thats overkill and advertising bling. You can't sell something for $750 or $800 with decient damper internals. These things got cheaped somewhere, there's no way to really deny that. I don't question the fact that the high end JDM **** is marked up, but when you get right down to it, you can't offer similar features for less than 1/2 the price and expect it to be the same quality. Tein Basics are the same price, you can look at what they offer on them, I consider them to be a quality item. Tein has a reputation of making good stuff, and Basic is as run of the mill as they get. These are offering the same price, but nearly twice the features. Some people I guess think its a good deal, but I smell fish. Something gets skimped. Even Ground Control camber plates are 300 some odd dollars, thats half the price of these things. I'm not going to start a war here. I'm gonna be done now, I've justified my reasons. All I'm saying is those things do not look all that strong.
JIC brackets and cases are at least double wall thick, triple in some places, the lower rear bushing is integrated right into the shock cup (which is 1/4" walled) rather than welded on like an afterthought, the front bracket is welded on, Jic wraps it around then seamwelds the whole thing, the second layer of the the bracket is then welded in from the other side, so the lower front bracket actually goes all the way around. All the bracketing on those looks like crap. It looks wimpy and looks pretty easy to bust off. The only thing that looks decient is the steering arm, which looks very robust, especially compared to the little stick that Hayame decided was good enough. Spring rates can be whatever they want them to be. That all comes down to how they're made, what kind of tolerance they're held to, and whether or not they're consistent enough to hold their length. 36 way dampers? Who needs that. No one is adjusting them between 36 settings, thats overkill and advertising bling. You can't sell something for $750 or $800 with decient damper internals. These things got cheaped somewhere, there's no way to really deny that. I don't question the fact that the high end JDM **** is marked up, but when you get right down to it, you can't offer similar features for less than 1/2 the price and expect it to be the same quality. Tein Basics are the same price, you can look at what they offer on them, I consider them to be a quality item. Tein has a reputation of making good stuff, and Basic is as run of the mill as they get. These are offering the same price, but nearly twice the features. Some people I guess think its a good deal, but I smell fish. Something gets skimped. Even Ground Control camber plates are 300 some odd dollars, thats half the price of these things. I'm not going to start a war here. I'm gonna be done now, I've justified my reasons. All I'm saying is those things do not look all that strong.
Last edited by Boilermaker1; Apr 12, 2004 at 02:43 PM.
I still don't get your point. You think they are going to snap in half or something? I don't see how the JIC bracketing looks much different. We did a buy-in to become the US distributor, we are trying to move our inventory. Think about it..... how much do you think it actually costs to manufacture a camber plate. Do you think Ground Control can afford to do as much advertising as they do without a huge markup? Why do Ground Control camber plates cost $300? BECAUSE PEOPLE WILL PAY THAT MUCH.
The truth is you are basing your opinion on a few snap-shots, there is no way you can judge the product from that. Why don't you let someone try out the product before you put it down?
The truth is you are basing your opinion on a few snap-shots, there is no way you can judge the product from that. Why don't you let someone try out the product before you put it down?
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 13,151
Likes: 3
From: Washington DC
Rep Power: 424
The truth is you are basing your opinion on a few snap-shots, there is no way you can judge the product from that. Why don't you let someone try out the product before you put it down?
Most people like more than pictures when buying something that their life in a car depends on. Track records or a reputation for building good stuff and standing behind it is typically helpful when people are trying to buy suspension parts. Thats why people continue to buy (and pay for) Konis, Hypercoils, Eibachs, H&Rs, JICs, Teins, Buddy Clubs etc....
So prove they're the real deal. Put em on someone's car then beat the hell out of them. Make your own track record if you have to. Show that they won't break down in a few months and they can take a street and track pounding. Because thats what we're all looking for... something that can take the punishment and something that will hold its specs (they dont sag or pop or worse). And if they work, so be it, someone's getting a real good deal.
Autocross Junky
Hey! Look At Me!! I'm a Supporting Member!!
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,211
Likes: 0
From: Las Vegas, Nevada, US
Rep Power: 380 Originally posted by UrbanImport
What do you mean "no beef"?
Spring rates are the same as Hayame. The D2 is also 36 way dampner adjustable.
What do you mean "no beef"?
Spring rates are the same as Hayame. The D2 is also 36 way dampner adjustable.
also, What is the % change in Damping from the 0 setting to 36? as in How much stiffer is the 36th setting Vs the 1st setting? also, wich setting are you changing, Bump, rebound, Both???
Registered!!
iTrader: (8)
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,555
Likes: 0
From: familycar's Moms Room
Rep Power: 299 Originally posted by Boilermaker1
Well then why don't you provide something more than a few snapshots to go by. These things wouldn't go to market untested. Someone's got dyno data or track time on these things unless they're somehow exempt from all governing bodies. Either that or no R&D went into them.
Most people like more than pictures when buying something that their life in a car depends on. Track records or a reputation for building good stuff and standing behind it is typically helpful when people are trying to buy suspension parts. Thats why people continue to buy (and pay for) Konis, Hypercoils, Eibachs, H&Rs, JICs, Teins, Buddy Clubs etc....
So prove they're the real deal. Put em on someone's car then beat the hell out of them. Make your own track record if you have to. Show that they won't break down in a few months and they can take a street and track pounding. Because thats what we're all looking for... something that can take the punishment and something that will hold its specs (they dont sag or pop or worse). And if they work, so be it, someone's getting a real good deal.
Well then why don't you provide something more than a few snapshots to go by. These things wouldn't go to market untested. Someone's got dyno data or track time on these things unless they're somehow exempt from all governing bodies. Either that or no R&D went into them.
Most people like more than pictures when buying something that their life in a car depends on. Track records or a reputation for building good stuff and standing behind it is typically helpful when people are trying to buy suspension parts. Thats why people continue to buy (and pay for) Konis, Hypercoils, Eibachs, H&Rs, JICs, Teins, Buddy Clubs etc....
So prove they're the real deal. Put em on someone's car then beat the hell out of them. Make your own track record if you have to. Show that they won't break down in a few months and they can take a street and track pounding. Because thats what we're all looking for... something that can take the punishment and something that will hold its specs (they dont sag or pop or worse). And if they work, so be it, someone's getting a real good deal.
For you to say that these "look" like **** is total BS.
The Standard One
iTrader: (7)
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 11,659
Likes: 1
From: City of Angels, California, US
Rep Power: 417 Woah woah.. as I always say, dont knock it till you try it... I've done my researching and they sound really promising. Every company has to start somewhere and this is where D2 is starting... A lot of people should be getting them by this week so expect a review real soon 
and the weld on the front JIC looks like *** compared to the D2. Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 232
Likes: 0
From: Atlanta
Rep Power: 0 I'm down to try them out. As long as they are under a good warrenty in case something breaks. Some places on the Autobahn will bounce the f uck out you.
Registered!!
iTrader: (8)
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,555
Likes: 0
From: familycar's Moms Room
Rep Power: 299 These are really nice. I Have a feeling people are going to like these. And dont expect EVERY set to be perfect, my local parts dealer said that for every 20 tein coilovers he sells, atleast 2 are in to be replace because of leaking valves, yet they are still his favorite coilovers out, just make sure that they offer a good warrenty like tein.
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,857
Likes: 0
From: Gaithersburg, MD
Rep Power: 412 Autocross Junky
Hey! Look At Me!! I'm a Supporting Member!!
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,211
Likes: 0
From: Las Vegas, Nevada, US
Rep Power: 380 Went buzzing through the site.... Not very informative at all. No spring rates, No Damper % nothing... I dont like companys that don't tell you things like that.
So, we need to know a few things here
1. Spring rate, and is it possible to get a custom spring rate (and how stiff can the dampers take)
2. Damper settings, what is the % of change between the settings 1 and 32?
So, we need to know a few things here
1. Spring rate, and is it possible to get a custom spring rate (and how stiff can the dampers take)
2. Damper settings, what is the % of change between the settings 1 and 32?
Spring rate on the 01 Civic is 6KG/8GK. Custom spring rates are available, we have 3.5-13kg in stock. The dampners are designed for 6/8 so I wouldn't reccomend putting a 13 spring on it but you can do it if you would like. I will try and find more info on the dampner settings.
Autocross Junky
Hey! Look At Me!! I'm a Supporting Member!!
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,211
Likes: 0
From: Las Vegas, Nevada, US
Rep Power: 380 now I have to do conversions??.... grrr...
so that would make them.....336 lb/in Front and 448 lb/in rear.. Kinda soft sprung for my application.
So from the looks of it, these are basically Tein SS with Camber plates and damper adjustments. Not bad compititon for the SS though, but for more Demanding applications you'll probably want something with stiffer springs.
so that would make them.....336 lb/in Front and 448 lb/in rear.. Kinda soft sprung for my application.
So from the looks of it, these are basically Tein SS with Camber plates and damper adjustments. Not bad compititon for the SS though, but for more Demanding applications you'll probably want something with stiffer springs.
