Rep Power: 0

OK, I finally decided which BRAND I want, now come the little things. I found a site that has the eclipse aluminum 12's (88120.4 or 88120DVC) for 269.99 each. (I can probably get them cheaper on Ebay, but I'd rather buy them brand new, with warrenty). "I have a dream. . ." that one day MY 7th Gen Civic will bump above all eternal, that young children and soccer moms will find themselves covering their ears as I pass by with 3 Eclipse Aluminum 12's. . .so the questions are as follows:
-Is 269.99 each a decent price?
-Should I go with the 88120.4 or the 88120DVC?
-Will I be able to find one amp to push all three properly (I know they're power hungry)?
-If so/not, can you suggest an amp/some amps? Brand? Size? Price?
-Finally, could it be I'm overdoing it a little? 3 12's (especially Eclipse alums) is kinda heavy in a Civic, but I want THUMP! TIGHT, DEEP, THUMP!!! I listen to NOTHING but RAP, R&B, SOUL, and Maxwell (he's just in a category all his own, y'all). Thoughts?

P.S. My head unit will be the Kenwood KVT911DVD with touchscreen. I found it for $1738. RIOT!

SO. . .all you knowledgeable folks (read: MOHAWKBOOM et. al), what's the consensus?

 
Rep Power: 0

Kenwood KVT911DVD touch screen for 178?? that seems alot. go for the new clarion it is a dvd/mp3/cd with touch screen for like $400 cheaper

 
Rep Power: 0

True, but does it have the TV tuner built in? Also, I chose the Kenwood because I'll be purchasing the digital music Keg as well, so I figured it would be better to stick with the same brand to ensure compatibility (2500 skip-free MP3's is well worth it, especially after that stolen CD's incident. . .[IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-mad.gif[/IMG]) But thanks for the opinion!

 
Rep Power: 0

get the DVC 4ohm versions.. an Earthquake PHD2 2000Wrms@2ohm mono.. and wire them as following


Just a note though.. You will Most definately without a doubt need a high output alternator with that setup..

Cheers
Mohawk

 
Rep Power: 0

Count on Mohawk to drop the science. With diagrams, even! OK, so I need a high output alternator. . .[IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/IMG]. . .Any ideas as to where I might find one for a decent price?[IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/IMG]

 
Rep Power: 0

Never mind, did a search. Thanks for the info! I'm looking at ampmanaudio.com now. OK, now I just gotta find the amp for a decent price. . .

 
Rep Power: 0

Bang! Found one! Found several! MSRP $1098, found several under $700!! Some under $600! My dream will come true!!!!

 
Rep Power: 336

<<

>>



you can not take three 4 ohm DVC subs and get a 2 ohm load, and especially not like that.

that is a 2.6 ohm load, and is definitely not idea for that amp, unless you dont mind paying up the wazoo and not pulling its full power.

I would look into getting two smaller sized amps and running them to one of each's coils. you will need a multimeter to set this up properly, but it will allow for some trick wiring, and can potentially save money depending on amp choice.

surely you will save on a crossover, because the crossover that comes with the PHD2 is pathetic. great power, great price, but for best sound your gonna want a crossover with it.

something that puts out 800-1000 watts and is 1 ohm stable might be a better investment. you can wire each side of the subs in parallel, for a load of 1.3 ohms. for a JBL or a JL amp (and MANY others) there is no power difference betwen 2 and 1 ohm, so you do not have to guess or measure how much power your subs are really recieving.

the only bad thing about earthquake in THIS application is that the amplifier is completely unregulated. this menas great things for SPL, but unfortunately, this also means that the lower the voltage, or teh higher the resistance, the less power the amp makes. .6 ohms may not seem like alot, but if you follow the laws of physics (unlike Matt Overpeck here) P=V^2/R means you lose 256 watts at 12.4 volts, and over 300 watts when you pass the 14 volt mark! furthermore, while some people have made several claims to the power that this earthquake amp makes, many other have said it doesnt do more than 1600 at low levels of distortion (this is the pre 2001 D2, i dont know to which model you are looking at)

now take for example the JBL 1200.1 (not by any means the best amp, in fact, i would worry that 800 watts is WAY too much power for those guys, but this is just an example) you get 2 JBL amps, which can potentially cost as little as $450, depending on where you shop, anyways, you get 2400 watts RMS, total. the crossover is very nice considering that teh 1200.1, like the D2, is just a workhorse amp, but you have no more investment to make nonetheless. anyways, at the loads you will present to it, (1.3 ohms per) that amp will put out 1200 watts, for a sum total of 2400 watts RMS, and that is rock stable power. unlike the D2, where you will be putting out less than 2000 watts, even less as your voltage drops, and may desire a crossover when you hear the one it came with.

a PHD2 would certainly make wiring everything MUCH simpler than using two amps, but for the money you will be paying for that setup, you can do better. alot better.

 
Rep Power: 336

I'd like to tell you al a story about when i went into cuircut city one day. the floor person was a punk highschool kid, and after talking for a short while, he told me that four 4 ohm SVC subs (or two 4 ohm DVC subs) could be wired for a 2 ohm load. i supressed a laugh tho a big smile crept on my face. i chucked and asked if he could explain exactly how to do it. later i learned that he was taking chemistry, and had never taken physics, so you cant really blame him for the next part.

he took a piece of paper, and drew four circles on it, to represent four subs. he said to imagine that we are wiring in parallel. then he points to teh first circle and says "4 ohms". points to teh second circle "2 ohms", points to teh third and says "1 ohm" to the fourth he said "half ohm"

I interrupted him at this point, and asked him what happens if we start from teh other side. he doesnt understand. i start from teh opposite, and say four ohms, two ohms. (of course i dont go on.) then i start from both sides and say four ohms, two ohms, then you take the two 2 ohm configurations, and in parralell, that makes one ohm. he looks stupified.

he then tells me that in his system he has a pair of 12" 4 ohm DVC subs and that he has them wired to 2 ohms. finally I say "You DO know that you are breaking the laws pf physics here, right?" no answer.

this story really doesnt apply to anything in this thread, but I thought you migh tlike to know, that it is ALWAYS best to get a second, third, or tenth opinion about something before going ahead with it. in the end you will save time, money, stress, and you will learn more than you ever thought you could.

 
Rep Power: 0

Good information. So. . .I should look into a set of amps that will sum 1500 to 2000 watts in output and have a nice crossover (makes sense, considering each sub is rated at 500Watts RMS, 1000 peak). Also, best bet is the DVC's for more options in wiring. That part I get. However, considering I never took physics (I was really into Life Sciences, plus in anatomy we got to dissect a cat!), I'm not quite understanding the "ohm load" concept. Anyone care to explain without going into a "here's the SLOW PERSON explaination"? My SAT scores were well over 1300. Please don't insult me[IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-disgusted.gif[/IMG]. Also, is the general consensus in agreement that I will be needing the high output alternator? I don't mind buying it, but if I don't have to I'll save my money for my tweed interior.

 
Rep Power: 0

for eclipse products to retain warrenty they have to be installed by an authorized dealer

 
Rep Power: 0

Just to emphasize a little on what mohawk said, "Get an upgraded alternator". You are looking to run some serious power, and I'm sorry to break it to you, but our little civics start dimming headlights and the interior console at just 200-300 watts. So be sure to set aside alot of money to upgrade your electrical system. Otherwise you will have all of this really cool s#$t, bump it for a day, then not be able to start your car the net morning. Your system sounds like it will whoop [IMG]i/expressions/moon.gif[/IMG]. Good luck.[IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG]

 
Rep Power: 0

Cool Beans! H.O. alternator, 3 eclipse 12" DVC's, at least 1500watts of ampage. . .sounds like a plan! I'll check back w/ you guys once I have everything. Anyone know where I can buy some RAAMmat? Is the deal still going on, or is it over?

 
Rep Power: 0

BTW, I'm guessing I'll be needing a cap or two, but what about another battery? Does that even help? Can anyone recommend one?

*edited for spelling*

 
Rep Power: 336

read the alternator post. well worth the 3 hours of your life you will spend reading it [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG]

 
Rep Power: 0

yeah the Aleternator post was rabbit and mine's equivalent of a Bachelors degree term paper lol..it's a work of scrambled art...

But with 4 DVC 4phm subs that's in fact a 2.66ohm load. However the Eclipse 88120's have 3.1 ohm Voice coils so it's really close to the 2ohm mark.....And checking stuff allready a member with a SEDAN by the name of OUTLAW has this setup... He has a Shredder, and 2.5(yup..doubled checked things) and 3 Eclipse 88120 DVC's..

 
Rep Power: 0

Got Damn Mohawk brings RESEARCH with FOOTNOTES and sh%t. I'll definitely read up on the alternators. Also check out Outlaw's ride, maybe PM him. Thanx!

 
Rep Power: 336

no, 4 4ohm DVC subs can be 1/2 ohm, or 2 ohm, or 8 ohm. period. as far as eclipse subs being 3.1 ohms, that isnt 4 ohms, now is it? [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/IMG]

but yeah, a 2.5 is a very solid amp. only reason i chose the 4.3 over it was due to the increased freedom wiring up the stage. im not surprised that this is teh case. didnt i predict it, even?

a work of scrambled art..... hehe *sigh* its so true, so true... did i get an "A"?[IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG]

 
Rep Power: 0

Most subs with 4phm nominal impedences are not true 4ohm subs.. Most have resistances between 3.1 and 4.3 ohms... JL 12W3D4 rates at 3.9ohms.. but they sell am as 4ohm.. Read tech papers they have the "actual" impedences of the subs.

Cheers
Mohawk

 
Rep Power: 336

well, if you want to be technical like that, then you could say that every single sub, like every single engine, is slightly different....

of course, a difference of .1 ohms equals a difference in 1 watt of power according to ohms law at 12 volts..... =/

 
Rep Power: 0

but the diff of .9 ohms is pretty damn significant dude

 
Rep Power: 0

Just received my reply from Outlaw:

"Well I was not involved in any of the installation. But I can tell you this:
I am using a Rockford Fosgate capacitor, stock alternator, bigger dry cell
battery, and the basic 0 gauge monster cable wiring.
It sounds good, the DVC subs hit great. I installed Diamond Audio 6.5"
Components for the highs. To me it sounds good enough.
The box for my 3 subs was customed made, I had the car in the shop for a day
and a half, but the dimensions I dont know."

Thoughts? [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/IMG]

 
Rep Power: 0

I just realized he said he doesn't have a H.O. alternator. Should he? [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/IMG]

 
Rep Power: 336

emailed him a couple days ago to comfirm this. if THAT doesnt prove to you that it CAN be done with NO problems, then nothing will ^.^

need? nope, you absolutely do NOT "need"

 
Rep Power: 0

He also has two amps. I guess one of them is pushing his components. . . so two of them and still no new alternator, but he does have a capacitor and upgraded battery. . . [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/IMG]

 
Rep Power: 336

the funny thing is that a bigger battery and a cap only INCREASE the strain on the alternator, not decrease.

its so nice to have like 12 pages or argument over 2 or 3 threads all come together in teh end to physically prove me right in the real world [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-cool.gif[/IMG]

and especially good cause i can handle arguing about shortshifters and alternators at teh same time lol

[IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG] for all, its the weekend!

 
Rep Power: 0

yeah...no problems because he's not cranking it too hard. 3 ohm them subs will be loud as well feeding all 3 a total 800 watts. Any more power he'll rupture his ears so he's not using the amp to full potential..... Running on a stock alternator can be done with any amp. The whole matter though is if you like cranking it [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG] that's where power draw becomes VERY high on a system.

Cheers
Mohawk

 
Rep Power: 0

Well, chances are, I'm going to CRANK IT. I want some BASS!!! BASS!!! BASS!!! I need some thump for my PETEY PABLO! "NORTH CAROLINAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!" So I think I'll go ahead and get the new alternator. Besides, with all the audio, neon, and accessories I'm adding, I think I'll need it.

 
Rep Power: 0

<< Well, chances are, I'm going to CRANK IT. I want some BASS!!! BASS!!! BASS!!! I need some thump for my PETEY PABLO! "NORTH CAROLINAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!" So I think I'll go ahead and get the new alternator. Besides, with all the audio, neon, and accessories I'm adding, I think I'll need it. >>



Well with 2 of them subs and 850ish WRMS a guy than competes here locally is hitting mid 140's.. and at tha volume your ear drums will not be happy. Your vision will almost surely be blurred.. so more power may cause you to pee your pants (seen it happen once at a local comp. guy hit 153 at 37hz while sitting in his car (rules were you can be in the car with ear protectiona nd rev your engine to 3kRPMS for the comp) Dude passed out and wet himself.).. so think about that one [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG]

 
Rep Power: 0

Note to self: invest in plastic underseat covers. INTEGRAL. . .OK, so I'm looking at serious bass. Can anyone suggest an amp. for my components? I found some MB Quart RSC's for my front doors, and I think I'll just get some 2-way 6.5's for the rear deck. Outlaw was using a 2nd earthquake amp to push his components. Would that be overkill, or just powerful for my components? Should I run the amp to all four interior speakers, or just run the components off the amp and the 2 ways off HU ( I think the Kenwood PVT911DVD has 45 watt preouts or something. Help?)[IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/IMG]