Rep Power: 0

Hi All -

I reently was browsing through Crutchfield's site, and I noticed they had a live chat thing on there now. So I signed on and was talking to "Chad" about what he would recommend for my car. Below is the transcript of our conversation, and I was hoping you guys could let me know if he's right or not. Thanks in advance!

{Chad} Hi, Pat, my name is Chad. How may I help you today?
{Pat} Hi there Chad. I just need a little advice. There are so many different choices and opinions out there in regards to car speakers, and I'm hoping you can clear some up for me. I drive a 2002 Honda Civic EX. I've already replaced the HU and have an amp and subs in the trunk, but the stock Pioneer paper interior speakers just aren't cutting it anymore. I was wondering what you would suggest.
{Chad} Ok, let me take a look at the vehicle.
{Chad} Just a moment please.
{Pat} sure
{Chad} Is that the 2-door or the 4-door?
{Pat} 2-door
{Chad} I would suggest some Kenwood speakers. You are really limited on what will work in the back, and with Kenwood we can get 2 matching sets.
{Chad} Clicking on this link will open an additional "Internet Explorer" window for you so we won't lose our chat session.

To return to the session, just return to this window!
{Chad} Front doors: http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/P...p?i=113KFC1679
{Chad} Rear: http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/P...p?i=113KFC1669
{Chad} How do those sound to you?
{Pat} well, 3 things.
1. i have stock tweeters up front, and i like the effect they provide, so wouldn't I lose them by adding an "all-in-one" speaker to the doors?
2. I've heard mixed things about Kenwood. are they an OK product?
3. I know for a fact that the rear deck has 6x9s in it
{Chad} 1. Yes they will still work.
{Chad} 2. They are a really good product and are the best of what you have to choose from in your vehicle.
{Chad} 3. We will send you some free brackets to accommodate the speakers. There is only one pair of 6x9 speakers that work, so there were not really any options.
{Pat} got ya. now if I'm willing to spring the extra bucks, would it be worth my while to go for some component speakers up front and replace the stock tweeters too?
{Chad} If you want to add another amp into the system that would be great. Also, it would require that you fabricate a bracket to allow the new tweeter to mount into the existing location.
{Chad} Would you be ok with those factors?
{Pat} why would i need another amp? my sony HU puts out 52 watts per channel. not enough?
{Chad} That would be the peak power. The RMS power would be more around 20 watts per channel. That is not going to be enough to get the full benefit from components.
{Chad} Components are very power hungry. No matter what brand you go with.
{Pat} well what kind of amp would be cheap and enough to push them?
{Chad} So, you are ok with fabricating a bracket for the tweeter then?
{Pat} absolutely. installation is not a problem for me. i've done my own in 3 different cars already.
{Chad} Ok, first lets select the components.
{Chad} http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/P...sp?i=107DB6500
{Chad} How do those sound to you?
{Pat} look pretty good. i'll write that down.
{Chad} Ok, let me see what amp would be appropriate.
{Chad} http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/P...p?i=500MRPF240
{Chad} That one would be great. How does that sound?
{Pat} would you suggest running all 4 off of that, or just leaving the back 2 on the HU amp?
{Chad} Here is the wiring you will need:
http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/P...asp?i=211ps8ri
{Chad} I would run all 4 off of that personally.
{Chad} You'll need an additional length of RCA cables as well: http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/P...asp?i=211ln250
{Chad} We'll still go with those Kenwoods for the rear.
{Pat} ok, now that i have 43 Internet Explorers open.
{Chad} Sorry about that.
{Pat} it's ok. the information you've provided me is quite helpful
{Chad} Can we go ahead with this set up for you today?
{Pat} not today, but definitely soon. right now I only have the cash for speakers, and I'd rather do it all at once.
{Chad} I don't blame you there.
{Chad} Please put in my name as your product advisor as you go through the checkout process online. I'd really appreciate it.
{Chad} If you prefer to order by phone, my number is 1-800-388-2911 x4038.
{Chad} Thanks Pat!
{Pat} here in NJ, we had the first nice day in a while yesterday, and with the windows open the music had to be louder than normal and those poor stock speakers just couldn't take it. it was awful.
{Chad} Its was the same here in VA.
{Pat} and thank you Chad! you've been quite helpful.
{Chad} I went around with the sunroof open and music up loud.
{Chad} It was great.
{Chad} Have wonderful day Pat!
{Pat} but i'm sure working for Crutchfield, your system is a bit better than mine!
{Chad} Its pretty good.
{Chad} But yours will be really good here very shortly.
{Pat} thanks again, and when it comes to order time, I'll definitely call you or put your name in.
{Chad} Thanks!

 
Rep Power: 323

With 6 x 9's in the rear, your concerns will be of both speaker magnet depth and height (rear deck panel).

What type of amp are you currently running? I get the impression you are running with stock speakers. How did you connect the sub?

He's correct about power. You'll definitely want to go with a two or four channel (I'd suggest four) when you upgrade the speakers, deck RMS power just isn't enough. The Alpine amps are great, I just bought an Apline MVR-F340 from them.

Concerning your tweeters, I would think that replacements should fit into the stock sail panel (my bostons did). Not sure why he's suggesting otherwise.

Your front doors will be the biggest challenge. When you remove the stocks, all you have to work with is a speaker cutout. You may have to have to do some custom work to make them fit.

 
Rep Power: 0

heres the one thing he forgot to tell you.....

what kind of music do you listen to. also don't go with 6x9's if you are going to keep subs the only reason to have a 6x9 is bass, and if you have subs you want to install a bass blocker on the back of the 6x9. kenwood makes awsome interiors for rock music and alternative, but with rap and techno and stuff they lack a lot of the high end freq suport needed. jbl makes a better rock speaker than kenwod and usually cheaper. one of the best bets for a comp system are boston's they are almost as good as quarts and all the interiors usually run about 150-200. i run them and have had no problems and they sound amazing. i can't believe that "CHAD" didnt ask you what style of music you listened to first. thats like the numebr 1 question a seller should ask.

 
Rep Power: 313

The advisor was pretty much correct on all the info he gave you.

 
Rep Power: 0

you make a good point, but you must realize that chad had only a couple of selections to go with for our car. i guess he was recommending what he felt was an overall better choice.

 
Rep Power: 0

Everything he told you is correct.

The problem is everything is subjective. I can tell you that you need 12" subs, Chad can say you need 10" subs, Coop can say you need a single 15" sub, and IllusiveImports can say you need a pair of 15" subs. Everyone is right and wrong at the same time. Right for their tastes, but wrong for yours.

You need to talk w/ others about what you want to accomplish and make a subjective judgement call on what to get. If you talk to 15 people and 2/3 of them seem to agree ..... then that is probably the best route for you to take.

Also hang around some audio shops. Be a pain in the ***. Talk w/ random customers that come in. Ask to listen to their systems. You'll be amazed at the variety out there ... but it will help you determine what YOU want. Besides most stuff sounds night and day different installed in a vehicle .... and even vehicle to vehicle.

 
Rep Power: 315

Okay, let's break it down...suggestion by suggestion:

{Chad} I would suggest some Kenwood speakers. You are really limited on what will work in the back, and with Kenwood we can get 2 matching sets.
{Chad} Front doors: http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/P...p?i=113KFC1679
{Chad} Rear: http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/P...p?i=113KFC1669

He's correct from a salesman's point of view. He's obviously going to try to recommend something they currently sell. When you choose speakers, here's the specs:
Mounting specs for the coupe: The front doors have 6.5" speakers with 2 inches of depth. On the rear 6x9's, you have 3- 7/16" depth, and the top mounting height is 7/16".
As long as they fall within those measurements, they should fit without having to cut or remove anything.

Using 6.5's in the rear is an excellent idea if you already use a subwoofer. If you didn't have a sub, I'd recommend using a good 6x9 in the rear for bass. In your case, you don't need 6x9s and when you use 6.5s back there, you can use almost anything. All you need is an adapter plate. You can buy one or make one yourself out of metal if you have the tools.

{Pat} well, 3 things.
1. i have stock tweeters up front, and i like the effect they provide, so wouldn't I lose them by adding an "all-in-one" speaker to the doors?
2. I've heard mixed things about Kenwood. are they an OK product?
3. I know for a fact that the rear deck has 6x9s in it
{Chad} 1. Yes they will still work.
{Chad} 2. They are a really good product and are the best of what you have to choose from in your vehicle.
{Chad} 3. We will send you some free brackets to accommodate the speakers. There is only one pair of 6x9 speakers that work, so there were not really any options.

1.True, you won't loose the tweeters, but like he said, you may need to modify the sail panels, depending on which components you get. Another option is to get the sail panels from an LX (no tweeters) and mount the component tweeter in the door panel. This requires you to cut on your door panel. Some people don't like this idea, but it looks good when it's done right.
2. Brand quality is subjective. Again, he's going to sell you on something they stock. Listen to as many 6.5s at local audio shops as you can and decide which ones you like the best, then order them cheaper online.
3. There are some 6x9s that fit, or you can buy/make adapters. If you order rear speakers from Crutchfield, they'll include plastic adapters for free. If you order elsewhere, you can buy the adapters at sounddomain.com pretty cheap.


{Pat} got ya. now if I'm willing to spring the extra bucks, would it be worth my while to go for some component speakers up front and replace the stock tweeters too?
{Chad} If you want to add another amp into the system that would be great. Also, it would require that you fabricate a bracket to allow the new tweeter to mount into the existing location.
{Chad} Would you be ok with those factors?
{Pat} why would i need another amp? my sony HU puts out 52 watts per channel. not enough?
{Chad} That would be the peak power. The RMS power would be more around 20 watts per channel. That is not going to be enough to get the full benefit from components.
{Chad} Components are very power hungry. No matter what brand you go with.

Component speakers usually sound better than coaxials. They cost more and require a mounting point for the tweeter. They also come with crossovers that you'll need to wire up and mount.
To have more control over the volume of your system, it would be beneficial to have a 4-channel amp. This would allow you to use your fader and adjust the volume of the fronts vs the rears. If you run all four speakers off a 2 channel amp, the rears are noticably louder and tend to drown out the fronts. Trust me...I'm currently using a 2 channel for all 4 speakers and I'm getting a 4-channel amp myself soon to fix this annoying problem.
If you run the rear speakers off of the headunit, you won't have the ability to block the bass with the amp's built in electronic crossover. You'll be running high power and full frequencies to the rears and when you jam it they'll sound muddy. You really need to block the bass on all the front speakers if you're using a sub.
Power ratings...Go by the RMS rating for the amp and the speakers. Components do tend to be power hungry, so that's true.

{Pat} well what kind of amp would be cheap and enough to push them?
{Chad} http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/P...sp?i=107DB6500
{Chad} How do those sound to you?
{Pat} look pretty good. i'll write that down.
{Chad} Ok, let me see what amp would be appropriate.
{Chad} http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/P...p?i=500MRPF240
{Chad} That one would be great. How does that sound?

Again he's suggesting their brand names. Check around for comparable amps and check prices. Crutchfield is NOT the cheapest place to buy online.

{Pat} would you suggest running all 4 off of that, or just leaving the back 2 on the HU amp?
{Chad} Here is the wiring you will need:
http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/P...asp?i=211ps8ri
{Chad} I would run all 4 off of that personally.
{Chad} You'll need an additional length of RCA cables as well: http://www.crutchfield.com/cgi-bin/P...asp?i=211ln250
{Chad} We'll still go with those Kenwoods for the rear.

With a 4-channel amp, you have 2-channels for the front and 2 for the rear speakers. If you ran the rears off the HU, you'd only need a 2-channel amp for the front components.
He's upselling you now. A wiring kit and RCA cables. Again, look around and compare prices. Be sure to get the proper gauge wiring kit for your TWO AMPS!!


{Pat} ok, now that i have 43 Internet Explorers open.
{Chad} Sorry about that.
{Pat} it's ok. the information you've provided me is quite helpful
{Chad} Can we go ahead with this set up for you today?

Sales pressure!

{Pat} not today, but definitely soon. right now I only have the cash for speakers, and I'd rather do it all at once.

Good Job! Don't give in to sales pressure!

{Chad} I don't blame you there.
{Chad} Please put in my name as your product advisor as you go through the checkout process online. I'd really appreciate it.
{Chad} If you prefer to order by phone, my number is 1-800-388-2911 x4038.

He gets a commission!

I hope this helps!!

 
Rep Power: 0

WOW! Thank you everyone for your replies! Let me just clear a few things up and see if that can help with some of your suggestions. I'm currently running a Sony XPLOD 1000W Amp pushing 2 12s. I know, Sony sucks, but the price was right at the time. Also, in regards to crossovers and whatnot, my HU has a built-in crossover so that wasn't one of my concerns. The max output is 52W per channel. Would I be able to see if it can handle pushing two components with the low freqs. taken out in the front and two coaxials with the low freqs. taken out in the back? I'm liking the idea of 6 1/2s all the way around since they're not too expensive. Keep those recommendations coming. I greatly appreciate it. This'll be a great summer for driving if I can pull this off!

-Pat

 
Rep Power: 0

IMO get the best set of speakers you can up front, although even a good set of coax's will do, amp those with a good amp of about 50x2 or more, and then disconnect the factory rears. You will be amazed at what it would sound like compared w/ stock. Many members here don't run rears, self included in both my vehicles.

PS. That 52 watts your deck puts out won't even compare to the 50 watts an external amplifier will put out. I can explain why if you want.