Vee VS. In-Line cyl configuration
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 10,031
Likes: 0
From: Milwaukee, Wisconsin, US
Rep Power: 400 
Inline means all the cylinders are in a straight line next to each other.
A V means that half of the cylinders are on one side of the engine, and half are on the other side. They are also generally angled outward from where they connect with the rods to the crank.... thus forming a V... where the crank is the base of the V
A V means that half of the cylinders are on one side of the engine, and half are on the other side. They are also generally angled outward from where they connect with the rods to the crank.... thus forming a V... where the crank is the base of the V
companies use V's to save space in the engine bay....a straight 8 would take up way too much room...BMW sticks with the straight config for all their six cylinders....the dealer guy told me that they do this becuase it offers better power but i don't know how true that is since he was trying to sell my dad the car...
Registered!!
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 849
Likes: 0
From: South Jersey
Rep Power: 0 Inline engines typically produce more torque because of their configuration. Thus why wranglers still use inline six's and why, up until a few years ago, most 6 cylinder pickups used straight six's
Registered!!
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,806
Likes: 0
From: SF Bay Area, California, US
Rep Power: 0 recap:
S200man01: posts a correct statement
SatinSilver2k1: straight vs V motors have many pros and cons, one con of having a straight6 / straight8 is the tremendous torsional force on the crankshaft, thats really what killed the straight 8
4drcivic2k1: posts some bullshit about something... EVER HEARD OF SOHC?!?
Ashock: yeah the VR6 is a cool engine [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG]
Intruder: yep [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG]
MadWheel: WTF not even worth correcting you....
S200man01: posts a correct statement
SatinSilver2k1: straight vs V motors have many pros and cons, one con of having a straight6 / straight8 is the tremendous torsional force on the crankshaft, thats really what killed the straight 8
4drcivic2k1: posts some bullshit about something... EVER HEARD OF SOHC?!?
Ashock: yeah the VR6 is a cool engine [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG]
Intruder: yep [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG]
MadWheel: WTF not even worth correcting you....
Registered!!
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 6,202
Likes: 1
From: Car Audioville, Quebec, Canada
Rep Power: 0 Okay....a Straight 6 in Comparo with a V6 of the same displacement. The Straight 6 has more potential because the firing order of the pistons can be set to overlap it's tough to explain, but a V6 basically has 3 srts of 2 pistons that move in unison like so
so firing order is done in a tricky way. Look at the left bank only.. whe the front cylinder reaches TDC for example. Say it's at it's compression stroke just about to fire. The middle Cylinder would be at the end of it's intake stroke and the far cylinder would be at the end of it's exhaust stroke....a V6 configuration is basically 2 3cyl engines working in unison whith 2 cylinders firing at a time. This results in bigger bursts of power, but when you only have power at for every 1/3 of a stroke there's "gaps" in the middle...
For a straight six like BMW's, the Crank is offset for each individual cylinder. It;s setup in a way that there's power 2/3rd's of the time instead of 1/3. When 1 cylinder is halfway through it's power stroke, another cylinder is at TDC ready to fire. This gives a more constant power output.
Like a V6 Say it fires 3 times per 2 revoltuions. liek cyl 1and 6 at the same time, 2and 4, and 3 and 5 (not actual).
With a Straight 6 you'll have it fire 6 seperate times, say the order is like 1,3,5,2,4,6 (not actual) when 1 is halfway through it's power stroke, 3 is at TDC ready to fire, 2 would be at the end of it;s exhaust stroke, it's done in a way that it's like .5,1, 1.5,2,2.5,3 ...a V6, is more like 2,4,6...V6's generally have a little more torque lower down around 1200-1500rpms. because 2 cylinders fire at time. But above that the Striaght 6 just outdoes it in every way...
V6's however are better balanced by design and can usually have more rev potantial than a straight 6, which like a Striaght 4 vibrates a fair bit more...
Straight 8's and V8's work the exact same way. a Straight 8 and V8's have 2 cylinders fire every 1/2 revolution in pairs.. like 1and 8 at the same time, 2 and 7, 3 and 6, 4 and 5, so it's even more power than a straight or V6...But a Straight 8 is too long and causes way too much torsional force on the crank to be practicle and a V/8 does the same thing anyway so it's much more advantageeous...a V8 is basically 2 I4's mated and go through the same strokes x2 (1per bank)
a Straight 4 has 1 cylinder fire every 1/2 revolution while the front piston is at TDC of it;s comrpession stroke, the next will be at BDC of it's intake, the next will be at BDC of it's power, the last will be at TDC of it's exhaust stroke... a very unbalanced design which causes much vibration and needs as much balance tuning as it does anything else for it work relatively smoothly..
Boxer 4's are perfecly balanced because you have 2 banks of 2 cyl which are 180 degree'as apart which perfectly offset each other's moving masses It works in the exact same order as a striaght or I4.
so firing order is done in a tricky way. Look at the left bank only.. whe the front cylinder reaches TDC for example. Say it's at it's compression stroke just about to fire. The middle Cylinder would be at the end of it's intake stroke and the far cylinder would be at the end of it's exhaust stroke....a V6 configuration is basically 2 3cyl engines working in unison whith 2 cylinders firing at a time. This results in bigger bursts of power, but when you only have power at for every 1/3 of a stroke there's "gaps" in the middle...
For a straight six like BMW's, the Crank is offset for each individual cylinder. It;s setup in a way that there's power 2/3rd's of the time instead of 1/3. When 1 cylinder is halfway through it's power stroke, another cylinder is at TDC ready to fire. This gives a more constant power output.
Like a V6 Say it fires 3 times per 2 revoltuions. liek cyl 1and 6 at the same time, 2and 4, and 3 and 5 (not actual).
With a Straight 6 you'll have it fire 6 seperate times, say the order is like 1,3,5,2,4,6 (not actual) when 1 is halfway through it's power stroke, 3 is at TDC ready to fire, 2 would be at the end of it;s exhaust stroke, it's done in a way that it's like .5,1, 1.5,2,2.5,3 ...a V6, is more like 2,4,6...V6's generally have a little more torque lower down around 1200-1500rpms. because 2 cylinders fire at time. But above that the Striaght 6 just outdoes it in every way...
V6's however are better balanced by design and can usually have more rev potantial than a straight 6, which like a Striaght 4 vibrates a fair bit more...
Straight 8's and V8's work the exact same way. a Straight 8 and V8's have 2 cylinders fire every 1/2 revolution in pairs.. like 1and 8 at the same time, 2 and 7, 3 and 6, 4 and 5, so it's even more power than a straight or V6...But a Straight 8 is too long and causes way too much torsional force on the crank to be practicle and a V/8 does the same thing anyway so it's much more advantageeous...a V8 is basically 2 I4's mated and go through the same strokes x2 (1per bank)
a Straight 4 has 1 cylinder fire every 1/2 revolution while the front piston is at TDC of it;s comrpession stroke, the next will be at BDC of it's intake, the next will be at BDC of it's power, the last will be at TDC of it's exhaust stroke... a very unbalanced design which causes much vibration and needs as much balance tuning as it does anything else for it work relatively smoothly..
Boxer 4's are perfecly balanced because you have 2 banks of 2 cyl which are 180 degree'as apart which perfectly offset each other's moving masses It works in the exact same order as a striaght or I4.
Registered!!
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 6,202
Likes: 1
From: Car Audioville, Quebec, Canada
Rep Power: 0 Addendum..
a Stright 6 would work the same way as the I4, but imagine another set of cylinders and midpoint when 2 are at TDC, 2 are BDC, the other will be at dead center...
Sorry it might not come across as clearly as a text book but there's more than enough info to get the jist of it
edit again... with a V6 if you notice, ALL 6 cylinders cross dead center at the exact same time!
I6's would work like a 5ft tall stair case with 6 steps very smooth transition. 6 even steps
a V6 would be like a 5ft tall stair case with only 3 big steps..really choppy power in comparo
a Stright 6 would work the same way as the I4, but imagine another set of cylinders and midpoint when 2 are at TDC, 2 are BDC, the other will be at dead center...
Sorry it might not come across as clearly as a text book but there's more than enough info to get the jist of it
edit again... with a V6 if you notice, ALL 6 cylinders cross dead center at the exact same time!
I6's would work like a 5ft tall stair case with 6 steps very smooth transition. 6 even steps
a V6 would be like a 5ft tall stair case with only 3 big steps..really choppy power in comparo
Prowlin' with a Purpose
iTrader: (16)
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,239
Likes: 0
From: Minnesota
Rep Power: 339 i can tell u know... engines in the straight config usually offers better acceleration.....
the toyota supra is a straight 6...
also saves on weight... cause the v6 u need 2 separate heads and 2 drive cams and gears with belts or chains...
the toyota supra is a straight 6...
also saves on weight... cause the v6 u need 2 separate heads and 2 drive cams and gears with belts or chains...
dispensed around these forums... 
Registered!!
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 6,202
Likes: 1
From: Car Audioville, Quebec, Canada
Rep Power: 0
Quote
[hr]Originally posted by: CivicMexicano
what about a v6 v.s Inline 6 v.s. Boxer 6[hr]
[hr]Originally posted by: CivicMexicano
what about a v6 v.s Inline 6 v.s. Boxer 6[hr]
Boxer six works exacty like a V6 in it's firing order but offers less vibration for smoother running and possible higher revving.. that's aboot it..
Edit:
Also for V and Boxer 6's the flywheels have to be (relatively)heavy to keep enginee deliver smooth and balanced
Registered!!
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 6,202
Likes: 1
From: Car Audioville, Quebec, Canada
Rep Power: 0 Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 10,031
Likes: 0
From: Milwaukee, Wisconsin, US
Rep Power: 400 excellent post mohawkboom. I don't have much to add, and you summed it up pretty well. the pics only help. [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG]
rotary 6. lmao! [IMG]i/expressions/laugh2.gif[/IMG]
rotary 6. lmao! [IMG]i/expressions/laugh2.gif[/IMG]
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 13,151
Likes: 3
From: Washington DC
Rep Power: 424 I can't add too much more... but heres the VR6... It's more inline than V ...2 cams, Intakes on one side, exhausts on the other (it's asymmetric) the narrow angle simply allows the engine to fit 6 cylinders in the same space as 4.5, and it is very narrow.
Oh, btw... Boxer is another term for a Flat engine. The cylinders are at 180 degrees to eachother. WRX has one, so do Porsches. Some older Ferraris had Boxer V12's.
Oh, btw... Boxer is another term for a Flat engine. The cylinders are at 180 degrees to eachother. WRX has one, so do Porsches. Some older Ferraris had Boxer V12's.
Registered!!
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 6,202
Likes: 1
From: Car Audioville, Quebec, Canada
Rep Power: 0 Can you explain why the port for the intake narrows out at one point in the middle then gets larger [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG].. can ya...huh...huh...punk!!
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 13,151
Likes: 3
From: Washington DC
Rep Power: 424
Quote
[hr]Originally posted by: mohawkboom
Can you explain why the port for the intake narrows out at one point in the middle then gets larger [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG].. can ya...huh...huh...punk!![hr]
[hr]Originally posted by: mohawkboom
Can you explain why the port for the intake narrows out at one point in the middle then gets larger [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG].. can ya...huh...huh...punk!![hr]
Registered!!
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 6,202
Likes: 1
From: Car Audioville, Quebec, Canada
Rep Power: 0 Pretty close [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG]...
the distance from the valve to the bottleneck is precisely tuned so that when the valve opens it causes alot of turbulance in the intake system..it at first slows air down a tad...but causes the air to accelerate VERY fast and almost causes the same effect as boost because as the valve is closing air isn't being sucked in by the cylinder..it's being forced in by the accelerated air...it's how the VR6's make all their torque
the distance from the valve to the bottleneck is precisely tuned so that when the valve opens it causes alot of turbulance in the intake system..it at first slows air down a tad...but causes the air to accelerate VERY fast and almost causes the same effect as boost because as the valve is closing air isn't being sucked in by the cylinder..it's being forced in by the accelerated air...it's how the VR6's make all their torque
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 10,031
Likes: 0
From: Milwaukee, Wisconsin, US
Rep Power: 400 Well since we're on the topic...
Does anyone know what the term used for the effect that causes a "suction" removing exhaust fumes from the combustion chamber during exhaust stroke?
And the "weld" spots on aftermarket headers.... anyone know why those are there? (no it's not just a weld or joint)
Does anyone know what the term used for the effect that causes a "suction" removing exhaust fumes from the combustion chamber during exhaust stroke?
And the "weld" spots on aftermarket headers.... anyone know why those are there? (no it's not just a weld or joint)
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 10,031
Likes: 0
From: Milwaukee, Wisconsin, US
Rep Power: 400 Yup scavaging effect. damn, i dont think I spelled ut right. whatever. lol
The "weld" spots on headers are also used to create somewhat of a resonant pulse. On the inside of the header, those weld spots are the end of actual plenums in a sense. Since pistons fire at different times, these weld spots help keep the "pulse" timing on so the exhaust doesn't shoot back up another way and back into a cylinder. This also helps create a vaccuum at the precise moment the exhaust leaves the cylinder, helping with the scavaging effect.
The "weld" spots on headers are also used to create somewhat of a resonant pulse. On the inside of the header, those weld spots are the end of actual plenums in a sense. Since pistons fire at different times, these weld spots help keep the "pulse" timing on so the exhaust doesn't shoot back up another way and back into a cylinder. This also helps create a vaccuum at the precise moment the exhaust leaves the cylinder, helping with the scavaging effect.
Registered!!
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 2,150
Likes: 2
From: 4o8, California
Rep Power: 311
Quote
[hr]Originally posted by: Boilermaker1
Well, while I'm not totally sure, my educated guess is that it is like a nozzle. So it alters the velocity of the air in such a way that the air enters the cylinders on the far end of the block with the same velocity as the cylinders on the side closest to the intake.[hr]
[hr]Originally posted by: Boilermaker1
Quote
[hr]Originally posted by: mohawkboom
Can you explain why the port for the intake narrows out at one point in the middle then gets larger [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG].. can ya...huh...huh...punk!![hr]
[hr]Originally posted by: mohawkboom
Can you explain why the port for the intake narrows out at one point in the middle then gets larger [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG].. can ya...huh...huh...punk!![hr]
Thread
Thread Starter
Honda Civic Forum
Replies
Last Post
Styven Szastur
Fuel, Oil, Cleaners & Other Maintenance
4
Sep 23, 2015 05:26 PM
Touge
Canada East
0
Sep 18, 2015 12:13 AM
Dave Brabant
6th Generation Civic 1996 - 2000
12
Sep 12, 2015 08:39 PM
Touge
Canada East
0
Jul 28, 2015 09:46 PM
