Cleft_Asunder

iTrader: (1)

Thought I would give you guys the heads up that I'm putting it back in my car to run some tests. My recent car issues have been worked out (*cross my fingers. Holy water and happy thoughts*) which was the main issue holding me back. You can't trouble shoot anything if you've got that thing in there. Also, the second thing holding me backk was the shutoff of the whole system. I may be wrong here, but when you turn off the car the HHO is still being pumped into the engine due to vacuum. So I figure that the left over HHO in the engine turns back into water. Therefore, I'm going to hook up an on/off switch next to the steering wheel onto the 12v going to the cell. Also, I may put an open/close valve on the HHO feed line. But then again, that's what the bubbler is supposed to do...

I will let you know if I get any boost in MPG in a week or two, or if my engine explodes.

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

yeah just turn the device off before turning the engine off? you gotta figure out the time frame to get it so that you can still run off the extra, but shouldnt be too hard.

Cleft_Asunder

iTrader: (1)

I'm just trying to avoid popping the hood every time. Not really an issue but I'm a perfectionist. For now, I'll just keep it as-is and see if I get any MPG gain. No point putting in more work without knowing that it works. I'll hook it up tomorrow.

DX5spd

what is HHO and how does it work?

Cleft_Asunder

iTrader: (1)

HHO is 2 hydrogen molecules + 1 oxygen, which is hydrogen for short. Using a cell that you make, you can supply HHO into the engine on demand.

2005EM2

iTrader: (7)

Good luck. I'd like to see how it all comes out

Cleft_Asunder

iTrader: (1)

Thank's mate. I just took her on a 90 mile trip. It's burning the HHO but we will see if any gain.

drunkenmagnum

iTrader: (5)

Your wasting your time and effort with this. It has been proven time and time to not work and there have been numerious studies showing scientific results.

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

it does work, if you tune the engine and related components to work with it. just installing the unit and expecting results wont work true. scientific results are rarely to be taken as fact, actually in most cases science seems to continually prove itself wrong over time.

drunkenmagnum

iTrader: (5)

Well I repect your opinion, but when both university testing and independent studies can not replicate the results promised, I am a little weary. After all they have access to much more advanced testing equipment than you and I could hope for. But it is your car and if you feel it works, go for it.

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

well i would not do it to my car, but i believe in the future it may be implemented in some way by auto companies. i believe the idea works, but only if the car is made specifically for it and tuned to take advantage of that different kind of fuel. too many people these days have the mentality of throwing parts at a car and expecting results with no effort on their end.

JrBK

Cleft_Asunder are you using a MAP Sensor Enhansor? I found the MAP sensor on my Honda but am not sure where the 02 sensors are.

http://www.hondapartsunlimited.com/ is a great resource. It helped me find it right away.

What' is your set-up like?

Thanks & LMK

Cleft_Asunder

iTrader: (1)

What, Myth Busters? I don't trust their studies of a second. Many things on t.v. should be taken as a grain of salt. And also, there are many people with MPG gain using HHO gens. I've got a map in my car regulating fuel delivery. In my current setting, I can only keep the car running while HHO is flowing in the intake. In the morning, before the generator has had time to generate HHO, I will start the car and the pre-existing gas (and hho?) in the block WILL burn allowing me to start the car, but it dies right after and I can't start it again. I flip the switch to stock config, and the car starts right up.

But, I have no results yet. I sure the hell hope it works, because this is a technology that is respectable. Conversely, you guys probably read about turbo diesel owners creating their own biodiesel fuel out of oils and other components, right? It works, but it's totally destroying our way of life, just like ethonol. Instead of feeding ourselves, we're feeding our cars. It's another factor for the big spike in food prices.

Cleft_Asunder

iTrader: (1)

The result of the experiment is based on the conjecture or pre-conceived ideas of the experimenters.

Cleft_Asunder

iTrader: (1)

Mmm, I'll post some pics this weekend. Yeah I've got a map enhancer but no 02 sensor enhancer. I built everything myself. It wasn't too difficult, but it was more difficult for me because I didn't know jack about electronics (for the map enhansor). Worst comes to worse, if it doesn't work I'll sell it on ebay and make a good profit.

Cleft_Asunder

iTrader: (1)

I checked out that site and it's got a great reference tool, but majestic honda which uses a similar search has better prices. For example, 350 vs. 395 for a throttle body.

civicsrcool

kind of random but you said HHO means hydrogen hydrogen oxygen right? isnt that water? H2O lol.... putting water in your engine doesn't sound very smart :/

bakertime

iTrader: (7)

^Yeah, fancy way to describe it right? haha... Hope you don't hydrolock your motor. I know this is a huge debate and everything...but I can't possible understand how you're justifying the risk involved installing something like this for a few mpg, if that. All at the risk of blowing your motor. I also really don't understand how water even lets your motor still run, because water doesn't compress very well. Anywho, I hope I'm wrong, and I hope it works out for you...good luck.

And dude, diesel owners who make biodiesel usually use used cooking oil that's previously been used for frying food. That isn't anything like ethanol, which has a large economic inpact. Off topic, sorry, but I couldn't let that one go...

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

its HHO gas, not H2O water

civicsrcool

then it really isnt HHO. because water has no gas form right? lol

Cleft_Asunder

iTrader: (1)

Usually use? How do you know? I bet most of them use cheap oil from the store. Most people don't want to go to a restaurant and ask for their oil. But this is all conjecture, I don't know for certain.

Cleft_Asunder

iTrader: (1)

It's hydrogen you make dude which is flammable. Come on. And I doubt I'm risking anything. I was joking about the engine exploding. I think it's supposed to explode regularly, since that's what an internal combustian engine does.

bakertime

iTrader: (7)

Used cooking oil is used for biodiesel because it's free...most restaurants that fry things pay to have their used oil taken away. They're usually willing to give it away for free.

Just a thought, maybe a wideband would be a good idea to see what kind of a/f ratios you're getting. If this thing actually puts any amount in the engine, it could lean it out.

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

water does have a gas form its called water vapor lol. and the gas being made by the device is hydrogen and oxygen. no water in it, the molecules are split up.

civicsrcool

oh god im dumb. ROFL.

drunkenmagnum

iTrader: (5)

Who said anything about myth busters?

There is a good write up in last Months Sport Compact Car about this technology. It's a good read and discusses the technology and why its wont work. But as I said before, if you think it works, it's your car, do what you want.

Edit: It's online now

http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/ed...uel/index.html

JrBK

A little info on Brown's Gas (HHO Production from water)

http://pacenet.homestead.com/files/waterasfuel.htm


http://www.brownsgas.com/brownsgashistory.html

Hope this helps.

JrBK

Cleft_Asunder,

I know you said you would get some pictures up this weekend. That'a Great!

I was wondering if you could tell which wire you connected your MAP Sensor Enhancer to. Of the three I am pretty sure that the middle one is the positive one. But I am not sure which one is the negative and which one is the MAP sensor wire. I suspect that tjhe MAP wire could be the one that is towards the front of the engine but I am not too sure. I looked at some pictures here (http://www.autozone.com/shopping/rep...00c1528018f5be) and they were somewhat helpful. Doesn't look like the same location as mine through. A picture of your connection would be great.

Also, where did you tap into the vacuum? I am not too familiar with the vacuum system so I am not sure where to put my T. If you could get a picture of that too it would helpful as well.

I appreciate your help on this. Once I get my test kit installed and running I will post some comments and pictures letting you know how I did. I was hoping to get it done today but I am pretty hesitant to mess with the electrical unless I know for sure what I am doing. Also I would prefer going through the firewall but can't find a hole, and I won't make one. I may just have to run wires out the passanger door. I want to hook up a toggle switch so that I can turn it off when I want to.

Thanks.

Cleft_Asunder

iTrader: (1)

I can't help you with the first part. The person who sold it to you is the one who knows which color represents which.

Download the 96-98 manual from here: http://hondatech.info/downloads/Auto/Manuals/Civic/

Then go to section 11-52 and look at the chart. Make sure the harness you pull out is consistent with the drawing depicting the harness. The key wires are:
3, red/grn, which is MAP.
4, yel/red, which is MAP power source (the ECU).
12, grn/white, ground for map. (this should be redirected to a screw in the dash to re-ground it)

You want to attach plastic connectors to the wires which makes removal/install easy. The type that come with crimps. The outer crimp is crimped around the plastic coating around the wire, while the inner crimp crimps around the wire. You don't need crimpers just plyers to do this.

If you are looking at your engine, at the right upper side you will see a circular piece of plastic in the firewall that's perfect for running a wire through. Remove it with plyers and drill a hole through it about the same size as the wire you're feeding through. The wire will be right under the steering wheel.
In your fuse box, there is a fuse for the windshield washer motor. You can replace this fuse with this fuse holder (forgot the name) which holds 2 fuses instead of one. It also has a "tap in" wire coming out of it, which is the point of the whole thing. So with that installed, you've got a 12v signal you hook up to your extension wire going to the HHO generator in the bay. For some retarded reason, I can only find those with a max 10amp. Are they full of ****? I think I've got like 2-20's in there. The washer uses a 20amp. I haven't had any problems yet but...

Another option if you want to tap into an existing line without cutting it is a positap connector. A small needle is pressed into the 12v wire and magic happends. Those are the best but you can't find them anywhere. Check your wal-mart and if they don't have them then you have to order it. Most wal-marts don't seem to stock it.

I only ran a single hose to the intake taping in past the evap system using a universal T. The EVAP feed ends up in between the "thighs" of the intake manifold, a great spot to inject HHO. I didn't use a secondary hose to run into the air cleaner housing. I still don't understand the logic behind that, and the gain would be small any way. My device has a secondary valve for that option though, but I will use it for a second HHO generator feed if the device proves to increase MPG.

Cleft_Asunder

iTrader: (1)