Rep Power: 0

Hey guys, I registered on this forum just so I can get some advice about a specific problem I have. Hopefully some of you can help.
So I took my 2001 honda civic lx 4 door to a auto shop for a engine oil and transmission oil change because it hadn't been done in a while. Keep in mind this car has 55,000 miles on it and it had been driven very easily as it was my grandmas car until now. Nothing major has been wrong with this car mechanically (only regular maintenance and problems) and definitely nothing has ever been wrong with the transmission. I get my car back from the auto shop and I drive it about 10 city miles that day. Next day I maybe drive 2-3 miles, next day 3 miles into driving it I know the transmission is not working right because I hear a little bit of grinding, and when I accelerate the motor revvs but I dont go anywhere for about 5 sec. Basically the transmission is not catching as I give it gas right away like it always has. It eventually catches but it just takes a few sec.
I drive the car home and I notice 2 small and 2 large spots that I know is transmission fluid in different locations on the street where I park. -so the tranny oil has been leaking for a few days because I don't park in the exact same spot every day.
I then drive straight down to the auto shop where I had it changed that same day assuming that they just didn't tighten down the drain plug enough and it started leaking out that. Well they call me later that day and say, "The drain plug was tight, You have a crack in your transmission case". They said they would try to fix it with JB weld and let me know later that day if it holds. They notify me that they fixed it and the jb weld held. They also ask me for $60 for new transmission oil and labor fees. I said no, because I think that they could have done something to cause the crack.
So anyway, they agree not to charge me and I drive home, but, I was curious to see what the crack exactly looks like and if it is leaking at all. So I jack the car up and see their jb weld job -All over the drain plug bolt and in the surrounding area! Sure seems like this wasn't just some random crack, but something they may have done tightening the bolt back down, like over tighten the bolt, strip the threads etc.
Here are some pics of what the drain plug looks like. I have the pics as attachments.



So what should I do? Take these guys to small claims court? I'm not sure if I should take it to another auto shop to verify what the crack actually was caused by. Also removing the drain bolt will most certainly cause the leak to restart considering the amount of jb weld that was put all over that drain bolt. And it is still leaking very slowly as you can see the red tranny oil near the bolt. Another thing is, can a crack like this possibly not be their fault and just something that can happen right next to the drain bolt?
Thanks everyone for all their thoughts and advice, thanks a lot!!!!

 
Rep Power: 216

Hmmm. It may be hard to catch them with it, but it's worth a shot. They can easily say it wasn't leaking when they got done doing the job. I really don't know what to tell you, sadly. I had an incident where a shop didn't properly bleed my brakes and they tried to call BS. I called another one of their shops and that shop did the job for free. Businesses don't want bad rep, so that may be your saving grace. If you went to a chain, I'd try calling around to their other shops after you call the original shop that did your work back

 
Rep Power: 312

Holy **** man I'd go in there kicking and screaming if they did that.. Not only that but they tried to cover it up.. NASTY

 
Rep Power: 811

wow just wow. another reason i change all my own fluids. i couldnt sleep at night knowing someone else did it and wondering what they screwed up. very likely they cracked your case by overtorquing the drain bolt when it was hot. i have to let the car cool down several hrs at LEAST before i feel comfortable tightening that bolt. im guessing you only waited 30 mins if that before they were done. i keep telling people a 15min oil change is impossible and nobody believes me. you cannot torque bolts into hot metal! period.

anyway back to your situation, id say you're effed. the car will never be the same, esp if the trans was slipping. that means you lost enough fluid that permanent damage was done due to the leaking. and jb weld is not a repair for that messup. the whole trans needs to be replaced. so yeah i would say get a lawyer and take it to some other shops to get opinions on what they think could cause the case to crack like that, surprisingly right at the drain bolt extending outwards. the silicone they smeared all over the bolt may hold for a month or so, but i doubt the jb weld has any chance at all esp once the trans heats up and cools down a few times. good luck with everything, i would sue the shop for $5k in small claims for a new transmission because any sane mechanic will tell you the trans needs to be replaced now.

 
Rep Power: 199

Have to say I am with Gearbox on this one. Make em pay. You may be in for a fight though. Aside from all that. If you caught it soon it should probably be ok. 2 problems with that though. (If you have an EX this one is certain), these cars DO NOT have good autos, read the reviews.... The other problem is that when it started acting funny you drove it back instead of checking it out and refilling it right then, SO it had lower than needed fluid for an extended amount of time

Aside from all that that crap needs knocked off now and a REPUTABLE welder with TIG capability needs to try to weld the crack. You can't get fully to the crack without taking it out, then you are talking enough labor it wouldn't make sense to do anything except another trans probably.... You may have some luck finding someone to "v" the crack out and weld it up in the car, and throw that drain plug away and get a new one. You won't get that crap off that thing. They have to have a place to put it for a couple days to drain the fluid good though. I would jack it up on the opposite side and let it drain for a day or two anyway before even attempting to weld it. An experienced welder will go back and forth from one end of the crack to other to keep the area from getting very hot. It probably doesn't have to be structural anyway. I've had a BMXA in an EX out before and Honda puts tons of bracing in this area. (My 90 Integra with a 5spd was the same way.)

Fight them if you think they did it. Chances are in the not to distant future you will loose the tranny.

JB is good stuff when its used right. Obviously that is a shadetree repair at the very best and looks like crap too. The least they could have done is smoothed it out!

 
Rep Power: 197

Somewhere there is a lone employee shitting his pants right now because he was realllllly hoping that the customer wouldn't come back and instead go to Honda. Imagine his face when it went snap and he saw the crack while putting the bolt in.

Fight it to the end...

 
Rep Power: 0

Hey guys thanks for the replies, keep them coming! Question: So tightening the drain bolt when the case is hot can make it crack? So then this is a common occurrence and well known ****up that has happened to many people?

 
Rep Power: 284

Over torquing a bolt, whether it's threaded into a hot or cold oil pan can cause a crack, it's just more prone to cracking on a hot engine. I wouldn't say it's a common occurrence to crack an oil pan just because most people are intelligent enough not to torque a drain bolt that high, but over torquing bolts and causing cracks isn't unheard of. Recently we had someone with a cracked engine block as a result of over torqued engine mounts.

 
Rep Power: 811

its well known at places like jiffy lube where hi school dropouts usually work. most mechanics with half a brain would know better. and if they did not cause it and the crack was there with fluid spilling out when you brought it in, no shop in their right mind would even touch the car without first running back with $$ signs in their eyes and telling you your trans case is messed. not only for that, but also they do not want to be held liable if the problem was there. the only reason they would not tell you is if they caused the problem in the first place. ive had the same thing happen at another quickie oil change place where they stripped the oil pan threads and blamed it on "the car was old" so it broke mentality. and ofcourse would not pay for a new pan even tho it was their fail that caused it.

i must say i am guilty of this too, my engine light came on when i was having vtec solenoid problems and it was hot as hell outside. i thought i could make the rest of the 200 mile trip if i got out and tightened the bolts some more. big mistake cause one of em snapped right off. luckily the other two held it in place well enough not to leak and i bought all new hardware at home. torque specs are extremely important and a bolt can only be tightened properly when everything is cold.

 
Rep Power: 220

That bolt got gorillad!!!

 
Rep Power: 216

My chassis teacher used to work at a Jeep shop and he hired this young guy. Dude overtorqued the snot out of the drain plug and messed up the pan. Needless to say, he ended up having to replace the pan and now uses a torque wrench every damn time. I understand time is money, but taking an extra minute or so to break out a torque wrench just to be safe is much better than having someone come back, or worse, having a situation like you have, OP. Best of luck trying to get things in your favor. Keep us posted.

 
Rep Power: 199

"Any mechanic that has half a brain" doesn't need a torque wrench to tighten a drain bolt. If you do that to a drain bolt it is probably because you are a moron, with or without a torque wrench. To do that he either completely cross threaded it or grossly overtorqued it. I have changed my own oil and oil in customer's vehicles probably a thousand times or more and have never done anything like that. My pan on my 4.6 F150 only has about 1/2 the threads left in it (previous owner) and I have changed it 5 or 6 times sense owning it and haven't made it any worse. Common sense prevails on this kind of screw up.....

 
Rep Power: 216

 
Rep Power: 811

lol, i do the same thing. if you work on cars long enough you shouldnt really need a torque wrench for stupid crap like drain bolts. for wheel lug nuts okay, its important to be exact. but drain bolts like the trans one actually do need to be tightened down quite a bit not to leak, since you have to crush the metal washer. im an average guy and i use most of my one arm strength to get it tight to my liking. i can't imagine how it would be possible to overtighten it unless i was 300lbs or i used both hands or a breaker bar on it. or like skippy lube (did you get that?), an impact gun. the key work here is

GROSS NEGLIGENCE

 
Rep Power: 216

I think my issue for torque ocd is because I had to torque every damn bolt in my engines lab. I have become pretty good on the drain bolts though. I just the wrench to see how accurate I am. One or two ft. lbs off. And let's not get started on impacts on lug nuts......

 
Rep Power: 199

I zip mine on on all my vehicles AFTER I am sure they are started by hand. I do not torque them, mine or any customer's lugnuts that is what tourqe wrenches are for. Tighten down bolts with an impact and one might be 50 ft lbs and the next one might be 150 ft lbs. That equals warped rotors and loose lug nuts....

 
Rep Power: 0

ya id be grabbing some jiffy lube NECKS but meanwhile id look for a new transmission and if the money is there buy it and replace it and go to court to get your money back.mostly because if that thing goes out fully you wont have a car at all and who knows how long it can take in court before you even see a dime.and with my luck court day that tranny will just burst and id be sitting there with my rpms high with a dumb look on my face.(fml well fyl)that sucks good luck though.