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there is no argument to have. I stated that the S2000 outhanldes the EVO, and the vettes that have dominated A-stock are being given a run for their money by the S2000's. Nothing about this statement is untrue, but somehow he thinks there is.

I'm annoyed because this is the 2nd thread he's posted such misinformation today.

 
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right, cuz no one could ever get better, not to mention the advent of the ap2 in 2004 (which is easier to drive to its limits).

it dominated B-stock in 2003 and 2004, so they moved it to A-stock for 2005, where it's giving the vettes a run for their money. how hard is this to comprehend?

 
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This is what you said that was incorrect, this entire statment, plus at the time I was under the impression that you thought newer vetts ran A-stock (your previous posts)

 
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hey read my sig man. hondas rule all.

 
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nothing about my statement is untrue. given equal drivers the S2000 is faster. again, please tell me the magic that occurs where car A is faster than car B with good drivers, but suddenly car B is faster than car A with average drivers. especially considering the new S2000 is much easier to drive at its limits.

 
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It is NOT faster, and yes it would be easier for a average driver to drive a EVO in a tight autox course than a S2k. However a Very good driver who can take corners in a exceptionally smooth manner keeping the S2k at its 2nd gear peak power rpms can maximize its exceptional handling abilities. A average driver would not do this and likley get to points where the rpms would be to low out of corners. This problem would not be as bad with an EVO because it does not run near the rpms as the S2k and it would have far better acceleration in this situation. Plus Stock for Stock it is faster. So I guess in that sense the S2k does handle better becuase it can compete (not dominate) with a faster car

 
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My bad I scrolled down out of A stock into B stock and saw the S2k and thought I was still in A-stock so disreguard It still does not change the fact that it is give and take in all other national events.

 
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i give up. i can only repeat myself so many times. if you really think the S2000 is not faster than the EVO in auto-x and short tight tracks, you're severely uneducated.

even zzyzx said the S2k is giving the vette a run for its money in A-stock. and last i checked, he knows a **** ton more about auto-x than you do.

but, my uneducated friend, the EVO is not. so if the EVO can outhandle the S2000, then why haven't they been able to make a run at the vettes?? riiiiight.

 
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The thing is you have some how changed this entire argument. All I argued is that

A.)newer vetts don't run A-stock (you don't make to many typos like that)

B.)the S2k does not DOMINATE A-stock with the vett any car in that class can win on any given day that is why it is a class. The EVO places better than the S2k and S2k better than the EVO not one dominates the other.

C.) As far as what car handles better there are way to many variables and various definitions of handling to speculate.

BTW road holding while only one aspect of handling (very important one) for the S2k is ~.88g, for the EVO ~.94g.

I guess until someone more knowledgable chimes in with an opinion there will be no real conclusion.

 
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A. jesus christ, for the last time. i never said newer vettes run A-stock. other than the one time I typed C5 instead of C4 which was a typo! (and C5's aren't even newer vettes anyways!!!)

B. first, I said the vettes and S2000's dominate A-stock. (the vette more than the S2000, but they're moving up). And no, sorry, the S2000 will place ahead of the EVO more often. And put the best drivers of both behind the wheel and the EVO comes in behind all day. Again, this does NOT mean the EVO won't ever beat the S2000, but more often than not, it will not.

You still apparently have very little comprehension regarding that fact. Ok, let me try to use basic reasoning skills to explain this to you.

1. we have car A, B, and C.

2. car C cannot keep up with car A more times than not.

3. car B can keep up or beat car A about half the time.

4. Therefore, car A is faster than car B is faster than car C.

Do you get it now? In other words, the vette has remained unchallenged for the last few years in A-stock. The EVO did not bring enough of a challenge, and the EVOs find themselves finishing behind the vette more often than not, particularly at national levels. The S2000, on the other hand, can give the vette a run for its money, and tends to finish similarly with the vette, thus offering a challenge to the vette. Am I getting through to you yet?

C. this is why we use the best scenarios for each car to determine the superior vehicle.

D. yay skidpad numbers mean very little, not to mention I've seen numbers be the exact opposite for the two.

E. someone more knowledgeable already HAS stated the same things I have been saying. You are apparently just in denial and for whatever reason, cannot admit you are wrong.

 
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here. maybe this will get through your friggin head. unless of course you proclaim to know more than zzyzx about auto-x.

http://www.7thgencivic.com/forums/sh...ck#post2844024

 
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I don't know about yall, but on the touge im taking the evo over the s2k. If were talking about the 'touge monster s2k', than im taking the MCR R34 Skyline GT-R or Spirits MR-S!!!

and my secret weapon... The Yashio Factory S15 Silvia

Who wanna meet on the mountain

EDIT... my secret, secret, secret weapn is the Spoon S2k... now that is one car I wouldnt mind having!

 
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what is the touge? (spoon S2000... highest skidpad for a production car tested by any magazine. hehe)

 
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wrong, 2005 Porsche boxer S than in secound place is the Ferrari Enzo!
yes the boxer ousted the Enzo

 
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I like s2000mans final drive ratio

Also I like the evos cool looks.

And I think the s2000 is a chill car and the evo is a bomb looking rally car.

Third STOP THE DISCUSSION. Cant we all just be friends?

Hurry someone lock it now!! I know s2000man won't

 
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Woah woah woah woah!!!

****...didn't I just hear WHAT IS TOUGE?!

LoL...man s2000man remember how u posted that video about running through that dragon whatevers place?

Well touge is basically what you did, but late at night with a lot of cars. Ppl race up and down mountains. Down here in so cal there a bunch of places ppl do that. I know a few of them personally. Its quite an experience.

Heres check out this vid. Honda Dx Stock with Rcompunds in the front and balding Azenis in the back, vs Corolla 20 Valve with ITBS and Azenis all round and a bunch of suspension stuff.
http://www.goldentreasuresantiques.c...Mt_Wilson.rmvb

 
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.... this is not regarding stock cars. it's modified cars. the S2000 pulled a 1.17g record on the skidpad. I think one car got higher, but barely (1.176 i think).

 
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ah ok. cool

 
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Togue - n (too-gay);
From the Latin root “verius gheyus”
def. (1) A style of racing* in which 99% of the people participating are know nothing ricer tards. (2) very lame
also see: (1) mystery guard rail damage (2) puiblic safety hazard (3) ricer fads (4) shiny side down

* usage of this term when referring to togue is not in accordance to the actual definition

 
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S2kman You never heard of the TOUGE??? Have you heard of the "Touge Monster S2000" It's the amuse R1 s2k. BMI fans, correct me if im wrong people, but besides the Spirits MR-S, the R1 S2k is the only car to beat the hachiroku? Anyways, here is a pic:



Anyways, im shock... you probably seen or heard of it. Thou, here is a reminder video:

http://videos.streetfire.net/Player....term=touge&p=0

You never heard of Intial D? Anyways, I did some touging w/ some friends in the OC a few months back (i got it on vid), it was fun... but deadly. Unless your suspension is up to par, DO NOT DO IT!!!, like my friend... ull learn the hard way!

 
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I say touge to ur own limits. As long as you play it safe then ur fine. Only test ur limits on a track.

BTW where u from Horroskopes? Ever heard of the vid dvd coming out Chasing the Touge? I know the guys that did that.

 
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Multiple cars drifting after one another on very narrow curvy roads with the definite possibility of not seeing coming traffic around blind curves is idiotic.

This "sport" was started in Japan when drivers would use closed courses and then eventually rally road courses which were shut down for events. It was large, sponsored and run/participated in by professionals. One car would go down the track and after a set time a 2nd would go. If the time between the finish for the first and 2nd car increases the 1st car wins. If its shorter amount of time, the 2nd car wins. At no one point in time though, are either car ever in danger of running into each other and especially other cars not in the race, thanks to cooperation for the local authorities and properly sanctioned events. On top of that the drivers would run racing lines, they wouldnt "drift" around turns all the time in order to look cool.

This caught on rather quickly due to the popularity of rally racing already in japan. Of course there were movies and Manga/Anime that were made about it. But just as F&F was a bunch of BS compared to what really goes on here, the same is to be said about their media. Of course hey are going to make it more dangerous and interesting to get people to watch/read by adding stuff like the cars being closer together, more then 2 cars running at once and of course... drifting (sigh).

The downside is that retarded kids see this stuff and think "oh hey I have a car why cant I do that?"

Now high school kids watch Initial D videos and try to do this crap on public roads with their civics and accords (see the video I posted of the morons playing the initial D video game on film then taping him self running his miata into the guard rail when trying to do it in real life for an example of this).

edit:
Regardless, why anyone would prefer an AWD car over a RWD car for this... drifting or not... i have no clue.

 
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Yea...its really unsafe, and the possiblities of danger are endless. But ppl still got and you can't stop them.

True Story:

Where I live theres a road. Im going to abbreviate it, but those who know it will know exactly what road i'm talking off. The road is called GMR. Up at GMR tons of ppl go up there to race. You see STIs, EVOs, Rx7, Corollas everything...ppl race all nite and yes there are crashes but ppl try to keep it as safe as they can. You can't stop ppl like this, the local cops know it too. The cops actually use to come up and check and make sure everyone was ok even ask how the runs were. That was 2-3 years ago, now they actually sit on a higher road parallel to the road ppl run on. If ppl complain they come and give out tickets, if ppl don't they sit there until the racers leave making sure that they are ok.

I honestly wish tracks were more accessable and cheap and less crowded. But until that problem is solved you will always have ppl racing on streets and in the mountains.

CAN WE SAY HIGHJACKED?

 
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ok, couple of things need to be made clear.

1. NEVER QUOTE REGIONAL RESULTS IN AN ATTEMPT TO SHOW THAT CAR A IS BETTER THEN CAR B, this goes for tires and suspensions ect ect too. If you want to quote Solo 2 results to help your argument, please at the very least use the Natioal tour, preferably the National Championship.

2. THe C4 Corvettes have historically dominated A-Stock, the EVO and STi have proven them selves to me midiocar A-Stock cars (this is also why most of the national level EVO drivers I've met have decided to run ESP).... except when its wet out, and so far the S2000 has been doing pretty damn well in A-Stock winning and placeing quite well against the C4 Corvettes, we'll see how they fair at the National Championship.

3. Just because a car is AWD does not mean it handles well. All cars weather FWD, RWD or AWD all have to deal with the same physics while navigating a turn, the differences in drive train really only determin when where and how much power the car can put down coming out of a turn. (an improperly tuned AWD car can have all the worst propertys of both FWD and RWD....)

 
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^^ thank you.

 
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Nice racing thought... I like racing with my top down too so they can take a good look who I am

 
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This is pertty good driving
CLICKY

 
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yes and not once did he say that the S2k dominates. He also said C4 corvett. Those were my only arguments

 
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I don't think there's enough love going around in this thread! lmfao

 
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and I also saw in the thread that you posted where Zzyzx said that driving the EVO was idiot proof, which is what I was getting at when I said that the results from two good drivers to two average drivers would be different. The S2k takes more skill, but given the proper skill I would agree that it has more potential and I never argued that fact with you. But enough of this........good kills