Rep Power: 0

I was hoping I can find some thread with a solution to this A/C issue. I've had my 2K2 Civic Si coupe for nearly 8 months, and I have never been satisfied with the air conditioning performance. Normally, in all other cars that I've driven or have been in to, the air conditioning will eventually get to the point of freezing after a few minutes of driving. In my Civic, I do get 'cold' air, but not the cold air that would normally require me to adjust the temperature gage in order to reduce the amount of cold air.

I also remember that my used '96 Civic Si coupe had a similar problem, it didn't cool at all. After recharging the A/C system, it work some what better, but nothing that I would call satisfactory. Has anyone found a similar issue with their Civic? Would this simply be an all Civic problem? I wanted to get some of your opinions before I b*tch to the dealership.

Thanks,

PiCASSO

 
Rep Power: 0

it might be because older cars use a different type of freon than newer cars. theirs is far less environmentally friendly than ours which i believe is 134. it's not as cold. if not, maybe there's a leak in your a/c?

 
Rep Power: 0

I hear this same complaint a lot, not just on our cars, but on almost all new cars. All of them say that their older cars had better AC.

Like dragon said, it's the new type of environmentally friendly CFC-free refrigerant they use these days ( and I don't think they even call it freon anymore).

 
Rep Power: 0

Its not hte problem with the refrigerant they use, its R-134a which works better than R-12, the problem is really a few things, 1. the compressors the new car makers use now are much smaller and more effecent which save gas and doesn't rob as much power, 2. Is that most new Civics are Black or have dark interiors which will "tax" the cooling effecency.

The best way to find out if your system is working properly is buy a thin dial style thermometer, kind of the type Chefs use that fit in thier pocket, you can get them from any good tool dealer or a restaurant supply outlet, there about $7. Put the themometer in the A/C duct vent in the center dash, with the system and fan on high, wait about 5 minutes and it should be reading about 60° any higher than 68° and you might have a problem

 
Rep Power: 0

I agree that it's not too cold, but I will hit the re-circulate button and let it run that way for a little bit, the air seems to be twice as cold because it cooloing the air that's already cold, but I turn it off after a while so I dont freeze to death, plus your not getting fresh air anymore.

 
Rep Power: 0

Yeah I get a stronger flow with outside air but yeah I get colder air with the recirculate button on. Same on my sisters 95 Civic

Nick

 
Rep Power: 0

Quite honestly, that's what I've though off earlier... and yes, it does make some difference, but not to the point where I'm comfortable... or in your case, freezing to death. On regular mornings, the A/C works decently as it should on a regular basis... but when I pick up my car that's been sitting in the parking lot for the 9 hours, no matter how fast and how much air I recirculate, not satisfatory.

My main concern will be when it gets to be extremely humid and hot, in those 35+ degrees Celcius...

 
Rep Power: 0

As mentioned to DrJEKYLL007's reply... it would also appear that my air conditioning is inconsistent. On 10-15 degree Celcius mornings, the A/C works adequately without any complaints. At 4 or 5 in the afternoon, it's a different situation. Yes, I know that it takes a few minutes for the system to work properly, but even after 10 minutes of highway driving at 130 km/h (80 mph) it's still no adequate (even with re-circulation).

The more I discuss this with you guys, the more I simply want to make an appointment with the dealership and take care of this situation. But I'm probably going to call the service manager of the dealership and discuss what they would do in the situation. Why? Because I work between 8 to 5pm, in Detroit, MI, while my dealership is in Windsor, ON... and their service hours overlap my work schedule. And unfortunately, Saturday's between 8-12 are only for oil changes.

In either case, I appreciate all of your ideas and thoughts on the matter...

 
Rep Power: 0

This is the correct answer. All of it. I am very impressed.

 
Rep Power: 0

Well, hopefully you can get something useful out of the manager, but I'm guessing the response to your AC issue is going to be the standard "... we don't see this as a warranty issue... the AC is like this on all the new Civics... "

If you do take your car in, try to do it on a really really hot day.

 
Rep Power: 0

.

As mentioned to DrJEKYLL007's reply... it would also appear that my air conditioning is inconsistent. On 10-15 degree Celcius mornings, the A/C works adequately without any complaints. At 4 or 5 in the afternoon, it's a different situation. Yes, I know that it takes a few minutes for the system to work properly, but even after 10 minutes of highway driving at 130 km/h (80 mph) it's still no adequate (even with re-circulation).

The more I discuss this with you guys, the more I simply want to make an appointment with the dealership and take care of this situation. But I'm probably going to call the service manager of the dealership and discuss what they would do in the situation. Why? Because I work between 8 to 5pm, in Detroit, MI, while my dealership is in Windsor, ON... and their service hours overlap my work schedule. And unfortunately, Saturday's between 8-12 are only for oil changes.

In either case, I appreciate all of your ideas and thoughts on the matter...[hr][/QUOTE]

At 5 in the afternoon it doesn't matter what type of car you have, at that time of day its the hottest. Do you have tinted windows? Do you use a "Windshield Sun Shade"? I'm not saying you don't have a problem, but have you checked the tempuature with a thermometer in the air vents?? Because I guarrenty that when you take it to the dealer this will be the first thing they do; and on top of that the dealer will check it inside a garage with no sunlight. I'm not flaming you here but I do know a little bit about car A/C systems (ASE certified in 1992).

Plus a cars A/C system will always run cooler with the reciculate button on because your only cooling the inside car air instead of trying to cool outside air temps which might be, for a example 88° F. Any system will be very "taxed" trying to pull a outside ambient temp @ 88° to a comfortable level. Anyhow I hope my 2¢ helps.

[IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG]

 
Rep Power: 0

Hey Solar, do you know why an A/C compressor engages and disengages a lot?? It happens while changing the modulation of the throttle, sometimes the A/C compressor engages for less than 3 seconds, then disengages, then after a few seconds engages again. It cools good but sometimes it gets hot because of the engaging/disengaging problem. the system has no leak...I'm guessing that it could be an electrical problem on the compressor...possibly a bad contact on the cables?? or very high pressure on the system??any ideas??

 
Rep Power: 0

At 5 in the afternoon it doesn't matter what type of car you have, at that time of day its the hottest. Do you have tinted windows? Do you use a "Windshield Sun Shade"? I'm not saying you don't have a problem, but have you checked the tempuature with a thermometer in the air vents?? Because I guarrenty that when you take it to the dealer this will be the first thing they do; and on top of that the dealer will check it inside a garage with no sunlight. I'm not flaming you here but I do know a little bit about car A/C systems (ASE certified in 1992).

Plus a cars A/C system will always run cooler with the reciculate button on because your only cooling the inside car air instead of trying to cool outside air temps which might be, for a example 88° F. Any system will be very "taxed" trying to pull a outside ambient temp @ 88° to a comfortable level. Anyhow I hope my 2¢ helps.

[IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG][hr][/QUOTE]

To answer your questions... I do have tinted windows, which are approximately 15% visibility from the outside (85% tint), but I don't use a windshield sunshade, and I think I should, considering the black interior does absorb plenty of heat during the day (like a greenhouse). I'm going to purchase the thermometer one of these days and determine exactly what temperature my Civic is cooling at.

You are right. At the dealership, it will probably be the scanario you've described and nothing will be done. It would probably be a good idea to log the time of day and temperature of the air-vents to determine if there is anything wrong with the A/C system.

The re-circulation is obviously something that we normally forget about, with respect to the average ambient temperature, versus re-cooling the air inside the vehicle. Quite honestly, I did not find a significant reduction in overall temperature in the vehicle when using the re-circulation. At the same time, I'm going to log the temperature of both regular and recirculation modes of my a/c system, along with time of day.

Cheers,

PiCASSO

 
Rep Power: 0

I hate the ac systems in our cars. I have a black sedan with the dark gray and black interior. Took the family out the other day about 3pm and it took a full 30mins for the car to cool off. Most days that I use it, the fan stays on full blast and the temperture **** is at the coldest position. It really pisses me off. I get tired of hearing the fan blowing as I am not always listening to loud music.

I don't know what the problem is but it shouldn't take an ac system that long to cool off a car no matter what the color or temperture is. Having to keep the ac running full blast in such a small car is ridiculous. I use a sunshade and have the windows tinted.

 
Rep Power: 0

If its clicking on and off quickly it sounds like you might be low on "Freon" (R-134a) or the low pressure switch could be defective. If the system pressure get to low from low Freon the system will shut down to protect the compressor from overheating and locking up, if its slightly low the pressure will go up and down resulting in a clicking compressor.

Also the electric clutch could be defective, causing the problem, but that very rare.

 
Rep Power: 0

Solar: when you cruise on the highway (say 70 mph), is it normal to feel a slight "movement" or "hesitation" in the car every 5-10 minutes, because of the AC turning on and off? This is what I'm feeling, but I'm assuming it's normal because of our small engines.

 
Rep Power: 0

Its possible to feel the compressor surge when the clutch kicks on and off, I've personally never felt this on the highway or anywhere else for that matter. I've noticed in the field when I was a mechanic that even though you had identical compressors some seemed to draw a little more power than another. If its just a slight surge and the system is blowing cold I'd say thats normal.

 
Rep Power: 0

Ok, thanks. And yea, it does blow cold, so it's probably due to what you said.

Funny thing is, I don't ever feel the compressor coming on when driving in the city, it's actually quite smooth. I only seem to feel this "surge" when I cruise on the highway. Maybe it's because with the cruise control on, you can feel any speed surges much more easily.

 
Rep Power: 0

Black cars take almost twice as long to cool off than a white one, my wifes white CRV cools off much quicker in the middle of the day than my Black Civic does with tinted windows. Plus the more people in the car results in more heat to cool down. Also believe it or not, if the fan is set at the highest speed, it pulls more cool air off the evaporator faster, which will make it feel not as cool, because all a A/C system really does is remove humidity out of the air. If the outside temp is hovering around 90° a Black cars exterior will be as high as 140°. Most car A/C systems aren't going to cool off a car that hot right away, it might take as long as 20 minutes to feel comfortable.

I always turn the A/C on and roll the windows down for 2 minutes, roll them back up, then switch the recirculate button on. I live in Tampa FL and right now its about 95° with a real high humidity. My car feels comfortable in about 5 minutes.

 
Rep Power: 0

I have it checked with a friend and he told me that the amount of gas is ok...was thinking on the clutch or can you tell me where the low pressure swith is located???

 
Rep Power: 0

Did your friend check the R-134a level with a set of gauges?? I don't think the Civcs have a site glass and if it did the system needs to be running for a few minutes. The low pressure gauge is located on the accumulator, its the long silver cylinder shaped tube about 10 inches long, its located in the left front of the engine bay very close to the lower part of the bumper.

A word of WARNING!!! The system is under high pressure even when shut off, if your not familar with the system, DON'T try to fix it yourself. Take it to the dealer, it could be a number of different things that may cause the problem. If I had a problem on my car I wouldn't try to fix it I'd take it straight to the dealer. (this is not a flame, but a serious concern for your saftey and your cars warrenty)

 
Rep Power: 0

Yes, I know what you mean...he checked it with a set of gauges, I just wanted to do a visual check, to see if everything is properly conected...I know how most of the system works, I know all the potential risks...not going to try to fix it myself....I'm trying to find out the reason why it does that...what about the compressor lubricant??? the system was drained and recharged because the condenser had to be removed to preform a job in something else...once installed back, it was recharged and discover that about the compressor...that's why I'm wondering...

 
Rep Power: 0

A/C systems are the most delecate systems, because they are designed to be a closed system; believe it or not, but one drop of water in a closed A/C system will bring it to its knees.

You removed the condenser? Okay thats a whole new ball game. When you open up or "crack open" a A/C system at the condenser you need a: Check list:

1. When the condenser was removed, was there any compressor oil lost.

2. When the condenser was replaced were new "O-rings" installed on the "re-installed" connections from the "High Pressure" lines to the condenser.

3. Was the system, "Evacuated", or "Vacuumed down" or "Pulled Down" to a -30psi for 30 minutes, and then let sit for 10 minutes without the pump to check for system leaks?, Before you re-charged the system with R-134a.

4. Was the correct amount of R-134a installed? ( The correct amount is between 1.1lbs. - 1.2 lbs.)

If the system is low on compressor oil you may be in for a big problem, if the system is over charged with R-134a you will have a problem, same for under charged.

I have a strong feeling its not anything but a over or under charged system. Try to find a good garage that does A/C and tell them you want the system evacuated and recharged. (If you didn't loose any compressor oil, you'll be fine) Let me know, PM me if you want.

 
Rep Power: 0

the condenser was removed but not sure if oil was lost...since I wasn't present at that time, how would I know if oil was lost??? and how much oil will be needed to restore to proper levels?? ...the condenser was properly installed back.,..the system was vacuumed but not for 30 minutes... I remember it was less time...and there's no leaks, and they told me it was the correct amount of gas recharged...but I'm not sure how you measure if it's the proper amount...the technician just had with him a set of gauges, a pump and a tank with the gas...

 
Rep Power: 0

I dought you lost any oil.

If the system was charged from a large tank of r-134a its impossible to know the amount added with just a set of standard gauges. Unless it was a Charging Station with a scale. Our systems basically take only 1 can of r-134a plus a touch more. Most systems in other cars take more than twice that, if your tech didn't know the proper amount the system requires, then its probably over or under charged, which would cause your clicking problem.

If you live in the Tampa area I'd be glad to take a look at it for you, but unless I could see it personally, its just speculation.

If you had a A/C tech do the work for you tham I'd take it back to him and let him know whats wrong, and tell him that the system only takes 1.1 to 1.2 lbs. of r-134a, he'll probably say that its not enough, but thats what the Honda Civic service manual calls for.

 
Rep Power: 0

Thanks man, I really appreciate your help, I was worried, I'll have it checked soon, I'm thinking is a bit overcharged...I knew the proper amount but wasn't sure how techs know the proper amount with just a set of gauge and a big tank...too bad I don't live in Fl.
will take it back to have properly recharged... thank you...

 
Rep Power: 0

No problem, was glad to help, let me know how it comes out.

 
Rep Power: 0

I will...Thanks...

 
Rep Power: 0

One more question...since I want to inspect closely the procedure(vacuum and recharge)...can you tell me what's the proper procedure to do...and proper equipement...and if they can reuse the same gas or have to use new gas...since I don't have any thrusty A/C technician near by, at least I want to know if what they're doing is correctly done...