midwaymonsters

I have a 2001 Civic that I recently purchased from a private owner. After doing a self-diagnostic on the SRS light, it shows a 9-3 code (9 long flashes followed by 3 quick blinks) Faulty Driver's Seat Belt Buckle Switch. However, it also has additional flashes and blinks after the 9-3 code. It appears to be 2 fulls sets of 4 quick blinks (2 sets) and 3 long flashes (1 set) "---- ---- - - -, ---- ---- - - -" Any idea what that code is?

FYI...I just had both airbags replaced due to Honda recall.

ezone

As you wrote it I'd call it code 23, but it doesn't seem to relate to anything on the code chart like that.

https://honda-tech.com/forums/tech-m...-list-3111979/

I'd suggest you either need a scanner to read it, or erase the codes and see if it returns.

Go back and say "Ever since you....." Maybe they will scan the codes just to make sure it wasn't something they caused. (If the warning light was already on when they received the car, maybe they already read the code just to cover their butt) Maybe they will tell you what the unknown code is.

midwaymonsters

Thanks, I appreciate it!

midwaymonsters

Thanks for the suggestions. I had looked at that same list that you had posted earlier. Isn't the first number always the longer flash and the second number always the short blinks? If so, then I have no clue why there's 4 short blinks first followed by 3 long flashes. Anyways, I might take it to O'Reilly's since I believe they do SRS checks for free, especially since today is Sunday. When I find out, I'll give an update. Thanks again.

midwaymonsters

O'Reilly's did an SRS scan and besides the 9-3 code, a 3-6 and 4-6 code popped up, in addition to another code beginning with "P", but the 3-6 and 4-6 are not listed on the Code List.

ezone

Posts unghosted.

Hondas SRS system used 4 rapid blinks to represent 10, so two sets of those should be 20. Add 3 to make 23....or if you didn't pay close attention to the gap between the blinks it could have been something like 21-2, or 22-1 which ARE both valid and real codes.


I rely on a factory scanner for my work....I can only guess the Oreallys scanner isn't quite accurate here, and accuracy is pretty effin important when it comes to figuring this stuff out..

P code is powertrain related, either engine or transmission. Shoulda got the number.

midwaymonsters

Thanks for the info. Yes, I shoulda got the P number code. The guy at O'rielly's did say that cylinder 2 is misfiring (according to his scanner/computer look-up)...the car is a 4 cylinder. I'm planning on taking it to our local Honda dealership to get this figured out. I know for sure the 2 sets of the 4 blinks is 20 like you had mentioned, but the time interval between the 4 rapid blinks and between each flash are different, anywhere from 1.2 S to 2.8 S...strange. I'll let you know what I find out.

ezone

P0302. Got freeze frame data to go along with that code? Try to get it next time, if possible.

midwaymonsters

I thought there was an "N" in that P code, not for sure. If I remember correctly, he said it could be caused by a bad plug wire or the coilpack??? something like that.

ezone

Code containing N? No.
The engine doesn't use plug wires.

There's a whole bunch of "could be" but usually just ONE "really is".

A bad coil (and most secondary ignition components) usually give consistent and easily repeatable misses.
Other stuff might not give easily repeatable faults, and people don't always realize anything happened other than a warning light came on. That Freeze Frame data is a snapshot of some engine conditions taken at the time the code set, so I can tell if it was cold or hot, idling or driving down the road, things like that that can make a huge difference in determining a diagnostic approach.

midwaymonsters

UPDATE: I went back today and had O'Reilly scan for the SRS codes, and they determined the following: 9-3 (driver's seat belt faulty switch) and P0302 (cylinder #2 misfire).

ezone

Typical buckle switch failure.

Still no Freeze Frame data?



If you want accurate answers, you're gonna need to go to the place that can do it.


Unless you want to keep on with wrong answers instead.....that can get expensive in a hurry.

midwaymonsters

I appreciate your response. The reason I went to O'Reilly's in the first place is that they do these SRS checks for free. If I went to any Honda service center or to my local Honda shop that I take all my Hondas to, they both charge anywhere from $75-$100 just to check it, but then that amount goes towards the repair costs IF I take it in for them to do the repair. As far as the Freeze Frame Data, no, I forgot to get that. However, when I had them do the initial SRS check last week, they said the cause of the P0302 could be a couple of things, so right there that told me that their OBDII scanner/computer software they use did not give a specific cause to the misfiring of cylinder #2. I assume it's either a bad spark plug, ignition coil, or exhaust valve (low compression). Fortunately, this is not a daily driver right now, and once the car repair fund builds up, I'll take it in and get it properly diagnosed and repaired. Thanks for the info!

ezone

Don't kid yourself. No scanner in the world is capable of actually doing that for a misfire code. Nor most other codes (though there are a few codes that do dictate immediate part replacement)
Figuring out the actual cause of a fault code is up to the person trying to solve the problem.



Parts store scanners might offer a shopping list of parts you can purchase (places like DangerZone and others may read codes for free and print you a shopping list so they can sell you lots of parts), but there is no replacement for working brain cells and real troubleshooting.
I can probably type a shopping list of 20 or more 'things' it could be.

A good troubleshooter usually nails it down to one specific exact 'thing', with supporting evidence and zero guessing.

Does the engine run smooth? Can you feel it misfire?



I'm a troubleshooter. I don't assume anything. If the problem is present and acting up, I can test and prove whether or not just about given item or system is or is not the cause of the problem, or a given part is either good or bad.
("HOPE" has no place in real diagnosis)

That's cheap if you get correct answers.

midwaymonsters

I understand that OBDII scanners aren't specific in giving the exact cause of a misfire. I also understand taking it to someone who can correctly diagnose the problem, I get that, I've taken all of our Accords in many times over the years for repairs and maintenance. All I wanted to do initially this time is get some idea what these SRS issues are by having O'Reilly's do a free scan to see what they come up with before I start shelling out more $$ that I don't have right now to get whatever problem(s) accurately diagnosed and repaired, that's all. Since this car is not a daily driver yet, I'm not in a huge hurry to get it fixed right away, although it'll be soon.

I'm not a mechanic and I do try my best to troubleshoot and problem-solve, it doesn't always work out, which is why I jump on these forums to seek help and guidance before I just jump right in and take it to the shop for something that I might be able to fix myself. As far as Freeze Frame Data, what will it specifically tell to me? I understand now that the data can be used to help identify the cause.

It does seem to run a little rough and there is a vibration, which could be related to another problem that I have...loud noise inside the cab. I had a mechanic remove the glass packs and replace it with a straight exhaust pipe and standard muffler; it didn't have a resonator when I bought the car and I opted to not have one installed. After the replacement, the noise inside the cab (and out) was reduced, but I'm still getting too much noise inside, particularly when I rev it up in neutral and when shifting it to first gear, even when it idles it seems a little too loud. The mechanic said that since the car had previously been in a front-end accident, one of the engine mount rubber bushing is worn, which he thinks is causing the vibration and the noise. The loud noise sounds like an exhaust leak up front to me...remember, I'm not a mechanic, but he said that there are no leaks that he can detect.

Like I mentioned earlier, I try to troubleshoot, too, but I'm not always successful. Since I don't have the necessary equipment, some of these issues I can't test myself without taking it to the shop.

Kingcredible

Many reasons for a cylinder misfire. I currently have the same issue with my 02 civic. I shuffled the spark plugs and coils hoping it was a bad plug or coil but not good. I found oil in the spark plug well so it could be a bad valve cover gasket. I will take it in to have a compression test, and probably gear up for the "You have a blown head gasket" response. Best of luck, let us know what you find about that misfire.

ezone

It's a snapshot of operating data taken at the time the fault code was set. It will tell things like vehicle speed, coolant temp, MAP, TPS, engine RPM, fuel trims, and more.

The cheapest code readers usually won't provide this or any other useful data. You usually have to go up a level above plain code reader and spend a little more money to get a more capable unit.
(A dealer level scanner can provide significantly more data than a generic or aftermarket scanner too.)


A misfire that only occurs at idle, vs. a misfire that only occurs while driving steady speed 45 MPH will not have the same causes, thus a misfire code set under either condition would require dramatically different diagnostic strategies.

If you know and recognize a dead cylinder misfire and you notice it while you're in the car, you should be able to relate how you were driving when you noticed it....OTOH many people don't know anything is wrong unless the car quits running or the warning light comes on, and this freeze data helps by providing information the driver cannot.


Your loudness and vibration aren't necessarily caused by a misfire, but a miss will certainly cause vibration... If one wants to know what a dead cylinder sounds and feels like, just unplug one ignition coil and rev up the engine a couple times, the effect should be quite obvious

midwaymonsters

Sure hope it's not a blown gasket. Best of luck to you, too. I'll post an update whenever I get it looked at.

midwaymonsters

Thanks for the insight, ezone. I'll post an update once I've taken it in.

04 blue civic

FYI. I had same issue with my seatbelt switch failure. Honda replaced no charge due to the part had a lifetime warranty on seat belts. So try Honda for new replacement maybe yours will be free also.

midwaymonsters

Did they charge you a fee of any kind?

midwaymonsters

I did replace cylinder #2's spark plug, took it back to O'Reilly's to have them recheck the misfire code...issue resolved.

04 blue civic

No charge was Free. Again he said they were still under warranty... I read Honda has a lifetime warranty on their seat belts. I believe almost all due now I believe it's required by law.

midwaymonsters

Was just double checking. The Honda service dept. stated that there will be a small fee for them to look at it, even if the SRS code is just the seat belt buckle switch/pretensioner, which doesn't seem right if it's a covered part. They never charged a fee of any kind to have 3 manufacturer recalls replaced, probably because they didn't have to use a scanner and interpret any codes, rather they just looked up to see if my particularly car had any open recalls.

ezone

Not quite. You can read which specific types of failures are actually covered, and how long they are covered, in the warranty literature that came with the owners manual package when the car was new. A failure that isn't specifically listed in that warranty booklet isn't covered, and dealers are free to make you pay for a non-covered failure. Some dealers will, but others won't. Some may do it for good customers as a goodwill gesture.

Also, the warranty period for seat belt related items is limited on newer cars.

NDNV

Would this be covered under limited seatbelt warranty?

Kingcredible

In reference to your SRS woes. I also had an SRS on my 02 civic. Took it in to the dealer and they were charging me $100 just to read the code… yes 100 just to read. They said “if it is a faulty seat belt buckle we would replace it for free as it is under a lifetime warranty”. But I’m not paying 100 for something I know it’s their fault. I use to work at O’Reilly so I waltz in and grab the OBD 2 scanner (which does read SRS codes by the way, it just depends on what O’Reilly you go to). The code read something weird about a “squib”.

Kingcredible

Now on to the misfire. I had the mechanic do a leak down and compression test and the good news is that there is no blown head gasket. The bad news is that the mechanic had no idea why it misfired after sitting parked. He suggests I clean injectors with those liquid cleaners you pour in the gas tank, so far no misfires but I’m not too sure If that solved the problem. I also suggest you getting a cheap OBD 2 bluetooth scanner from amazon. I did and it reads all sorts of codes as well as capture frame freeze data for misfires. It costs much less than a traditional scan tool and depending on the app, it may read SRS codes.

04 blue civic

Maybe what happened.. they checked with doing airbag recall and said seat belt switch was bad which was why light on. I asked how much and hesaid no charge to replace be a few days before part arrives. Part came in a few days later they installed. But yeah maybe they did as goodwill or wrote up as defect assy but either way I was happy for the freebie. Lol

Kingcredible

Yeah I've heard that too. Depending on the dealership goodwill repairs and diagnostics can be very convenient. Unfortunately for me, the local dealership likes money and the only goodwill they have is to sell you a new Honda.