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Thanks to xian: this is a great article that is right on.

Here it is!

 
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That was entirely TOO truthful.

 
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yes it is.

 
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A well prepared article...I likes...

 
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totally agree w/ that article-

just wondering is it just me or do import drivers tend to have a slight respect for domestics for their raw power, but when it goes the other way around domestics think that imports are a complete waste of sheetmetal for their sheer lack of big engines...? at least that is the feeling i get from several people in my area. i know only a few muscle car drivers that will give props to imports for their ability to get lots of power from an engine 1/4 the size...

anyhoo just had to add my $.02-

 
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K-Wal-I-tay

 
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You're right about domestic drivers not liking import cars. I usually get the "I can fit your Civic in the back of my Ford F150 because its a go-cart". So I'm like "If I wanted a large, unresponsive, gas-gussling, crappy-handling, low-rpm vechile that will depreaciate 80% within the first year, I would have purchased that Ford, but I didn't. I bought a sweet car."
Me wonders why the Honda Ciivic is Canada's best selling car again this year. I don't think it has anything to due with being very reliable, fun to drive, awesome on gas, handles like it a dream, and retains its $$value$$. Nah, it can't be.

 
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This reminds me a bit of the prototypical NASCAR fan mentality... [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG]

They revel in these large, outdated, overweight, large displacement cars running endlessly around a boring oval... just because its the last true American car racing series. People should open their minds to everything. Who knows, they may even find WRC or F-1 entertaining...

I have a cool friend that drives a Porsche and an AMG Mercedes. Yet, ask him about a Mustang, Corvette, or Camaro and he'd still be excited to take one out for a spin! I respect that.

 
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is it because the import cars are out selling the domestic cars?

 
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So are you saying NASCAR fans suck? [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG] Actually I enjoy watching all types of racing and I've owned both domestic and import cars. Both have their good points and their strengths are completely different. Cars are like humans, each has it's own personality - you just need to like a broad range to like it all [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG]

 
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Maybe its just the way I look at it, but is it really any better for us to say "imports are POS low-efficiency worthless uses of an engine" than it is for a hardcore domestic fan to say "imports are just slow rice burners." If you think you're so much better than someone who knocks you for "rice" then don't stoop down to their level. Just take it in stride and use that money you save on gas for a good cause.

 
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[IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG]nuff said

 
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I agree. Too many domestic owners are like..."My 20,000 dollar van is better than your vic...." lol

But on the inside, theyre saying....why the hell did i buy this piece, when i could be driving a car that goes Whoomph when you shut the door, instead of BANG.

 
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Nice article. Thanks.

-Kre

 
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from the article:

A. Never mind that hp/liter is pretty irrelevant in the grand scheme of things, whether you like imports or domestics. Hp/liter doesn't make you go, power to weight does.

B. But there are plenty of people who seem to firmly embrace the "my (type of) car rules and everyone else's sucks" attitude. <--a lot of people here as well as people i know in real life have this complex.

"Import Killer - 780 hp from 7.4 liters!". Ok in a sense this is true...wait no it is true. to use a cliche, "there is no replacement for displacement"

 
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sorry to knock u, but this is an example of what i was saying. see my other post under B

 
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In Kurt Angels words..."Its True...OH its DAMN True"

 
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Hey wait a minute, some of you guys go and agree with the article but you have missed the point. We must be the true car enthuasiast and respect all types of cars regardless of how they make their power. Otherwise you're being brand loyal which limits your view and makes you seem stubborn.

 
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whoa, that was very well put...

 
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I get so tired of hearing that same phrase repeated over and over again. Yes - there is a replacement for displacement. How about engineering a better engine to begin with? How about 3.0L Toyota engines putting out around 900 hp to the crank on a stock bottom end? Why is it that a 2.4L supercharged J-body still puts out less hp than a naturally aspirated 2.0L Honda engine?

In short - anybody can create more horsepower by simply adding displacement. It is the cheap and easy way of adding power by using brute force (e.g. more is better). Unfortunately, bigger engines also waste more gas and have worse emissions ratings.

People are right when they say that hp/liter doesn't mean jack when it boils down to who wins or loses, and I agree that up to a certain point, you're going to need a bigger engine to put out more power. But please don't use phrases like 'there is no replacement for displacement'. When you say that, you are saying that there is no way to engineer a better and more efficient engine, and that the only way to get more power is to make the engine bigger. Import car manufacturers have been proving this wrong for many years now.

 
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"There is no replacement for displacement."

The Honda S2000 is high-tech and impressive for generating a lot of hp for its limited displacement, but its pretty civilian when it comes to torque... 153 ft-lbs @ 7500?!

I took a ride in my friend's 1999 Porsche 911 with a 3.4L H6 engine, 300 hp/260 ft-lbs. Then we ride his C43 AMG with 4.3L V8, it has 302 hp/302 ft-lbs.

Guess which car pulled better? Which one threw me back in my seat more??

The added displacement of the 4.3L V8 in the AMG gave the car 40 more ft-lbs of torque and a wider power band. Horsepower is the same, but torque makes all the difference. It was a heavier car than the Porsche too.

 
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I think import tuners should stop using the excuse of hp/L and efficiency. If they really cared about efficiency, they wouldn't be:

If the really cared about efficiency, they'd be racing Honda Civic Hybrids, rather than gasoline powered ones!

 
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Well yes, the laws of physics will dictate that larger engines will have more torque. If an engine has less torque, all that means is that you have to rev the engine higher in the powerband to get the thrust you want. Cars that have high torque ratings and massive engines typically can only rev up to around 5000 or 5500 rpm. It's a tradeoff: bigger engines = more torque = rev lower. smaller engines = less torque = rev higher to compensate.

Torque is the twisting force that makes you move, but horsepower is the application of that force and hp is ultimate what matters. If the engine is applying 300 ft/lbs. of torque at 2000 rpm, but a small import engine is applying half the torque but at double the rpm, they are still generating the same output.

2 different ways to achieve the same thing. Plus the smaller engine will still have the edge when it comes to reliability, emissions, and mileage efficiency.

 
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Instead of reading Import Tuner and Super Street, I suggest you attend a local IDRC or NHRA Import race and see how the real import pros do it. Also tune in to the Speed Channel and watch the GTI and GTII classes of the Grand Am Cup. All the Grand Am Cup cars have wings, but that's because they are regularly pushing > 100 mph and are at redline for practically hours on end.

Personally, I think it's a testament to good engineering that small import engines are able to rev so much higher than domestic engines, yet are 2 or 3 times as reliable.

 
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And if you think import guys are the only people doing ridiculous things like adding body kits and heavy rims, pick up a copy of 5.0 Mustang and Fast Fords. They have this ongoing project where they are trying to convert a GT into a Cobra by adding a Cobra wing, Cobra wheels, new bumper, doing everything to the car except modifying the engine. Retarded!

 
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Not trying to turn this into an imports vs. domestics debate (personally, I like and respect ALL cars). I'm just trying to dispel a bunch of myths and clear up some confusion.

 
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this guy is a genius

 
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Not true... the American market DOMINATES GT-1 and GT series races. The Corvette, Saleen S12, and the Panzos are always at the top of the list. All american made.

I actually read that article that he was talking about. Kind of stupid to even have an article about a 7.8 putting out 800hp. There are dozens of STREETABLE Supras running 800hp on a much smaller engine.

 
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Sorry, was referring to the average ricer wannabe street racer.