is 170 HP Possible?
06-27-2002
#32
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dude yeah i have heard that honda lies on power to get sales but i guess they do what they gotta do i dunno man though i think 170 is a lot harder than you realize lol
06-27-2002
#33
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06-27-2002
#37
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Rep Power: 0 HoeB16... you really are a PW aren't you? 900 + posts since Jan 2002? What's up with that? Not flaming, just wondering if you're trying to accomplish something...
06-27-2002
#38
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Rep Power: 0 I heard somewhere that someone that has a Civic EX 2001 or 2002 is replacing the engine with a RSX type s 2.0L 200 hp engine .... i would think you could get 170 out of the stock civic engine after ALOT of work but i wouldnt count on getting it unless you got some cash [IMG]i/expressions/beer_yum.gif[/IMG]
06-27-2002
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[hr]Originally posted by: lastweek
dude did you even read what i wrote i mean have you ever tried to stroke a 1.7l to 2.0l lol. my brother tried but it is a lot harder than i think you think lol. its easy to stroke an engine an even amount of liters like .4 but it is really hard to do .3 because of the natural vibrations of the engine lol. first you need a whole other harmonic dampener to keep the engine from rattling the car apart and that is tough to get for a 1.7 because there arent many of them around but you need more air and fuel too but not too much it is easy to add the air and fuel to the 1.6 again because of the even increment of stroking with the 1.7 if you make a mistake you can get little rocks in the engine and then you have basically screwed the whole thing up i mean there is a lot of planning involved in this lol[hr]
[hr]Originally posted by: lastweek
dude did you even read what i wrote i mean have you ever tried to stroke a 1.7l to 2.0l lol. my brother tried but it is a lot harder than i think you think lol. its easy to stroke an engine an even amount of liters like .4 but it is really hard to do .3 because of the natural vibrations of the engine lol. first you need a whole other harmonic dampener to keep the engine from rattling the car apart and that is tough to get for a 1.7 because there arent many of them around but you need more air and fuel too but not too much it is easy to add the air and fuel to the 1.6 again because of the even increment of stroking with the 1.7 if you make a mistake you can get little rocks in the engine and then you have basically screwed the whole thing up i mean there is a lot of planning involved in this lol[hr]
06-27-2002
#40
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[hr]You do this by buying shorter pistons and/or shorter connecting rods[hr]
[hr]You do this by buying shorter pistons and/or shorter connecting rods[hr]
[teacher voice] Shorter rods and pistons won't change the swept volume of the engine, which is what determines displacement. Shortening the rod/piston assembly will just lower your compression ratio, because you're making the combustion chamber bigger while retaining the stock displacement. If you want to increase displacement by stroking out the engine, you need a new crank to extend the stroke, or how far the pistons move. New pistons would be a good idea to bring the CR back down to something reasonable. [/teacher voice]
I'd expect something better from a moderator...
06-27-2002
#41
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Rep Power: 0 It MIGHT be possible to get 170 hp on our motors without forced induction. BUT...it would require everything that has ever been figured out on a NA motor and more money than any of us could probably spend. And still I don't think it's actually gonna happen then. I don't doubt that some really industrious individual COULD (eventually) stroke a motor like ours, but would it work long? Probably not. Can you bore it out? Only slightly and the hp gain would be well over $100 per hp increment. Port and polish? Certainly - good for about 8 to 10 hp w/o forced induction. What mods exactly do you think is going to get you that extra 25 to 30 hp? Possible - yes. Likely - no. There are better ways to spend your money.
06-27-2002
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[hr]Originally posted by: Explosivo
HoeB16... you really are a PW aren't you? 900 + posts since Jan 2002? What's up with that? Not flaming, just wondering if you're trying to accomplish something...[hr]
[hr]Originally posted by: Explosivo
HoeB16... you really are a PW aren't you? 900 + posts since Jan 2002? What's up with that? Not flaming, just wondering if you're trying to accomplish something...[hr]
06-27-2002
#43
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[hr]Originally posted by: red02dx
Nope, try again.
[teacher voice] Shorter rods and pistons won't change the swept volume of the engine, which is what determines displacement. Shortening the rod/piston assembly will just lower your compression ratio, because you're making the combustion chamber bigger while retaining the stock displacement. If you want to increase displacement by stroking out the engine, you need a new crank to extend the stroke, or how far the pistons move. New pistons would be a good idea to bring the CR back down to something reasonable. [/teacher voice]
I'd expect something better from a moderator...[hr]
[hr]Originally posted by: red02dx
Quote
[hr]You do this by buying shorter pistons and/or shorter connecting rods[hr]
[hr]You do this by buying shorter pistons and/or shorter connecting rods[hr]
[teacher voice] Shorter rods and pistons won't change the swept volume of the engine, which is what determines displacement. Shortening the rod/piston assembly will just lower your compression ratio, because you're making the combustion chamber bigger while retaining the stock displacement. If you want to increase displacement by stroking out the engine, you need a new crank to extend the stroke, or how far the pistons move. New pistons would be a good idea to bring the CR back down to something reasonable. [/teacher voice]
I'd expect something better from a moderator...[hr]
Edit: Okay, to be precise. You'll also need new fuel maps for the ECU. You'll need bigger injectors. You'll need a bigger fuel pump. You'll need a fuel pressure regulator to go along with that. Maybe the RSX fuel pump/FPR unit would work well? Then you could use a new head gasket that's stronger. Maybe some new head bolts too? More airflow will help out, so port and polish the intake and exhaust ports. Then port and polish the intake manifold. Then get a header that fits up to the new exhaust ports. Then a bigger trottle body. Then a bigger intake. Then a better filter. Then a bigger exhaust. That should be it.
06-27-2002
#45
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[hr]Originally posted by: Grey{Q]Okay, to be precise. You'll also need new fuel maps for the ECU. You'll need bigger injectors. You'll need a bigger fuel pump. You'll need a fuel pressure regulator to go along with that. Maybe the RSX fuel pump/FPR unit would work well? Then you could use a new head gasket that's stronger. Maybe some new head bolts too? More airflow will help out, so port and polish the intake and exhaust ports. Then port and polish the intake manifold. Then get a header that fits up to the new exhaust ports. Then a bigger trottle body. Then a bigger intake. Then a better filter. Then a bigger exhaust. That should be it.[hr]
[hr]Originally posted by: Grey{Q]Okay, to be precise. You'll also need new fuel maps for the ECU. You'll need bigger injectors. You'll need a bigger fuel pump. You'll need a fuel pressure regulator to go along with that. Maybe the RSX fuel pump/FPR unit would work well? Then you could use a new head gasket that's stronger. Maybe some new head bolts too? More airflow will help out, so port and polish the intake and exhaust ports. Then port and polish the intake manifold. Then get a header that fits up to the new exhaust ports. Then a bigger trottle body. Then a bigger intake. Then a better filter. Then a bigger exhaust. That should be it.[hr]
06-27-2002
#46
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Rep Power: 0 170HP FWHP N/A... Probable extremely expensive. If I am not mistaken the 1.7 SOHC VTEC uses a SOHC with rockers to operate 4 valves per cylinder. In it's design, ths is not that bad except there is power lost in the friction of transferring the power over a lever (the rocker) rather than direct (as in DOHC). Theoretically, you could replace the rockers with roller type and decrease friction, thus increasing power. I would say probably 10%. None of these parts exist yet, but I bet it will not be long. I always think of the Engine as a GIANT air pump. The more air you can flow through it, the more power you get out.
06-27-2002
#47
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Rep Power: 0 RED is RIGHT !!! Changing the crank changes the Bore x Stroke thus increasing displacement. Changing rods and pistons only affects compression because your Bore x Stroke is the same.
When I learned this stuff in 5.0 Engines 101,
Displacement = Bore x Stroke
I don't think any of this has changed.
When I learned this stuff in 5.0 Engines 101,
Displacement = Bore x Stroke
I don't think any of this has changed.
06-27-2002
#48
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Rep Power: 395 Nah, a well tuned 2.0l SOHC engine can put out maybe 180 horsies. The quoted mods refer to the stroker engine though. If you're not going to go with a stroker design, then you might gain 25% with higher compression and P&P and I/H/E and pullies and what not. That would be about 160. [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/IMG] Who knows the actual numbers though? I'm probably a little too optimistic.
06-27-2002
#49
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06-27-2002
#50
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[hr]Originally posted by: Spider883
CrazeDSpecV email addy is xavier1x@***.net please send all your unwanted mail there.[hr]
[hr]Originally posted by: Spider883
CrazeDSpecV email addy is xavier1x@***.net please send all your unwanted mail there.[hr]
06-27-2002
#51
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Rep Power: 0 I'm willing to bet money to anyone here that 170whp is easily accomplished with the right amount of cash. Go to www.Honda-performance.com Call them up, ask for John. Here's what he offered me (this has been done already)
D17 Stage two package= $3700 ( This includes lightening, balancing, blueprinting everything ) Everthing you need for N/A power.
Individual throttle body kit= $1,000 ( You'll need a haltech, or motech to run these, this kit is known for producing ridiculous amounts of throttle response, and power. )
Stroker kit can be done, but he doesn't have a price cuz it's the only thing that HAVN'T done, they would need to make the rods needed. He mentioned they have it all for our motor.. including some nice valve sleeves for those pushing major hp. Most of you know me already, i stay out of your little disagreements while you bash your own brand new car.. but the possibilities are endless. all you need is $$$
D17 Stage two package= $3700 ( This includes lightening, balancing, blueprinting everything ) Everthing you need for N/A power.
Individual throttle body kit= $1,000 ( You'll need a haltech, or motech to run these, this kit is known for producing ridiculous amounts of throttle response, and power. )
Stroker kit can be done, but he doesn't have a price cuz it's the only thing that HAVN'T done, they would need to make the rods needed. He mentioned they have it all for our motor.. including some nice valve sleeves for those pushing major hp. Most of you know me already, i stay out of your little disagreements while you bash your own brand new car.. but the possibilities are endless. all you need is $$$
06-28-2002
#53
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Rep Power: 0 patience is a virtue guys...
good things come to those who wait...
our engines new....
when the b16 was introduced, no one imagined it had that kind of potential...it took years for it to be extracted...wait..it will come....our engine needs a solid 4-5 years minimum behind it before anything big will come...
RF Bwoy
good things come to those who wait...
our engines new....
when the b16 was introduced, no one imagined it had that kind of potential...it took years for it to be extracted...wait..it will come....our engine needs a solid 4-5 years minimum behind it before anything big will come...
RF Bwoy
07-03-2002
#54
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Rep Power: 0 yeah i guess i will just have to be content with the measely hp numbers i have until the market decides to catch up with us.
I WANT A FRIGGIN TURBO!!!!!!!!!!!!! PLEASE OH GOD COME ON HKS[IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-blush.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-disgusted.gif[/IMG]
[IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-disgusted.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-blush.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/IMG]
I WANT A FRIGGIN TURBO!!!!!!!!!!!!! PLEASE OH GOD COME ON HKS[IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-blush.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-disgusted.gif[/IMG]
[IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-disgusted.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-blush.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/IMG][IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/IMG]
07-03-2002
#55
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[hr]Originally posted by: RockfordFosgateBwoy
patience is a virtue guys...
good things come to those who wait...
our engines new....
when the b16 was introduced, no one imagined it had that kind of potential...it took years for it to be extracted...wait..it will come....our engine needs a solid 4-5 years minimum behind it before anything big will come...
RF Bwoy[hr]
[hr]Originally posted by: RockfordFosgateBwoy
patience is a virtue guys...
good things come to those who wait...
our engines new....
when the b16 was introduced, no one imagined it had that kind of potential...it took years for it to be extracted...wait..it will come....our engine needs a solid 4-5 years minimum behind it before anything big will come...
RF Bwoy[hr]
07-03-2002
#56
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[hr]when the B16 was new, it was 1988. [hr]
[hr]when the B16 was new, it was 1988. [hr]
07-03-2002
#57
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Rep Power: 0 A) Ive never bashed any of the K series engines.
B) "advanced" tachnology means diddly squat in real world applications.
B) "advanced" tachnology means diddly squat in real world applications.
07-16-2002
#58
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Rep Power: 0 Just speculating... but how likely is it that, considering howmany D17's are going to be out there, we will see a DOHC Head developed for it. Possibly by someone like Skunk or Jun?
Anyhows, I do expect better components, such as roller rockers, better cams etc to be able to push the 150 Crank HP pretty easily on the D17 VTEC. Different pistons, crank, may push the power even higher. From a design standpoint, the SOHC 4Valve is not that bad. We only get 127 HP because it's a mass produced engine as a ULEV vehicle. I figure someone will reprogram the control module, and then we are rocking.
Add turbo and wooohoooo. Can't wait. this stuff should all be ready to go as my car comes off warranty
Anyhows, I do expect better components, such as roller rockers, better cams etc to be able to push the 150 Crank HP pretty easily on the D17 VTEC. Different pistons, crank, may push the power even higher. From a design standpoint, the SOHC 4Valve is not that bad. We only get 127 HP because it's a mass produced engine as a ULEV vehicle. I figure someone will reprogram the control module, and then we are rocking.
Add turbo and wooohoooo. Can't wait. this stuff should all be ready to go as my car comes off warranty
07-16-2002
#59
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07-16-2002
#60
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Rep Power: 0 okay,,, 170FWHP..ehhh.. 170 at the crank.. easier to do than you'd think..But the car would not quite be streetable...
New Feul pump,
Fuel pump regulator
bigger injectors.
Fuel management system (for optomal tuning)
Bored intake and exhaust ports.
Oversized valves.
better engine balancing
Shaved heads.
lightened flywheel
Underdrive pulleys.
I/H/E
Insane cams..
My friends old CRX with a D15 dynoed 173hp at the wheel....but had so little low end power it could never be street driven without spinning the tires..or heavily weaing the clutch...
170HP..sure..no doubt..
170HP and be streetable.. HARD WORK!!! $$$$$
New Feul pump,
Fuel pump regulator
bigger injectors.
Fuel management system (for optomal tuning)
Bored intake and exhaust ports.
Oversized valves.
better engine balancing
Shaved heads.
lightened flywheel
Underdrive pulleys.
I/H/E
Insane cams..
My friends old CRX with a D15 dynoed 173hp at the wheel....but had so little low end power it could never be street driven without spinning the tires..or heavily weaing the clutch...
170HP..sure..no doubt..
170HP and be streetable.. HARD WORK!!! $$$$$
