Subaru at Top in Quality Survey
Thread Starter
Registered!!
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 131
Likes: 0
From: Toronto
Rep Power: 0 
Subaru at Top in Quality Survey Subaru, the Japanese automaker known for its all-wheel-drive vehicles, won the top spot for the highest-quality brand among new cars in Consumer Reports' annual automotive issue.
The magazine's annual survey of product quality and performance, which hits newsstands Tuesday but has already gone to subscribers, ranks Japanese and South Korean automakers tops for quality. U.S. brands are second but fall below the industry average, and Europeans rank a distant third.
Subaru jumped 16 places to become the most reliable automotive brand overall for 2004 models. It's the first time Subaru finished in the top spot in the 26 years Consumer Reports has conducted the survey.
Subaru owners reported eight problems per 100 cars and SUVs sold — an 8% problem rate. Honda was the second-highest-rated brand at 9%, and Toyota took third at 10%. Lexus, last year's leader, fell to fourth with an 11% rate.
In another surprise, the magazine found South Korean automaker Hyundai Motor Co.'s mid-size Sonata sedan to be the most reliable car in the U.S. last year, with just two problems reported for every 100 cars sold.
"That's quite dramatic and shows that Hyundai has really made a big effort," said David Champion, Consumer Reports' auto testing director. "It used to be a joke to have Hyundai and reliability in the same sentence."
Last year's reliability champ was Toyota Motor Corp.'s Lexus GS sedan.
"With Subaru and Hyundai doing so well, we have two newcomers pushing the others to do even better," Champion said.
The magazine's quality ratings are based on surveys from 810,000 vehicle owners. Subscribers were asked to report problems in 17 areas, such as engine or bodywork troubles, for vehicles up to 8 years old.
As for the U.S. automakers, they keep drawing closer to their Asian rivals but never quite catch up. The best U.S. brands — Ford, which ranked ninth, and Pontiac, 10th — had 15 problems per 100 vehicles for 2004 models, more than twice Subaru's rate. Audi was the best from Europe, with a 12% problem rate.
The industry average for 2004 model vehicles was a 16% problem rate, compared with 17% a year earlier.
As a group, Asian brands averaged 12 problems per 100 vehicles, a score unchanged for three years. It wasn't all glory, though. Nissan Motor Co., hobbled by glitches with the Titan pickup, the Armada SUV and the Quest minivan built at its new Mississippi plant, fell well below the average with a 19% problem rate.
Several brands were not rated because of insufficient responses, the magazine said.
Domestic brands fell just below the industry mean, averaging 17 problems per 100 vehicles sold, an improvement from 18 last year. "They've been getting a little more reliable year after year," Champion said.
European passenger vehicle brands continued dragging the bottom with a 21% problem rate, slightly worse than the previous survey's 20%.
Of about 160 models surveyed, the worst reliability scores, with 49 problems per 100 vehicles, were tallied by two behemoth vehicles: Ford Motor Co.'s Lincoln Navigator SUV and the Nissan Quest minivan.
This is the second consecutive year U.S. brands outscored European makes. The European automakers, long plagued by problems with complex electrical systems, have been further hurt by quality problems with their SUVs, Champion said.
Volkswagen's Touareg, for instance, had one of the worst results in the survey, with 48 problems reported per 100 vehicles. Porsche's Cayenne, which shares the same vehicle platform, had 41 problems per 100. BMW's X5 and DaimlerChrysler's Mercedes-Benz M-Class SUV, the Mercedes E-Class sedan and Volkswagen's New Beetle also scored far below average in reliability.
In a separate satisfaction survey, Consumer Reports asked subscribers whether they would buy the same car or truck again. The magazine said it received more than 250,000 responses.
In this category, the Toyota Prius gas-electric hybrid topped the list — a first for a hybrid — with 94% of owners saying they would repeat. Last year's leader, the Lexus LS430 sedan, dropped into second place with a 92% positive response.
Of 32 vehicles on the magazine's "most satisfying" list, 25 are Japanese models, six are European, and only one, General Motors Corp.'s Chevrolet Corvette, is a domestic model.
The survey shows that satisfaction and quality don't always mesh: The reliable Hyundai Sonata doesn't appear on the list of most satisfying vehicles, but the Nissan Titan pickup, which received poor reliability scores, does.
In another first for hybrids, Consumer Reports named the 2005 Honda Accord Hybrid as its best pick for a family sedan. The hybrid uses a V-6 engine and an electric drive system to provide enhanced performance with the fuel economy of a four-cylinder car.
Reliability survey
Asian automakers continue to lead the industry in reliability, according to a Consumer Reports survey of 810,000 passenger vehicle owners in the U.S.
Top five:
Problems per 100 vehicles
Model year 2004 2003
Subaru Fuji 8 17
Honda 9 10
Acura 10 13
Toyota 10 11
Lexus 11 9
Bottom five:
Nissan 19 14
BMW 21 19
Volkswagen 23 19
Merc / Chrysler 25 22
Lincoln Ford 26 31
Some brands, including Hummer, Isuzu, Jaguar, Kia, Mini, Mitsubishi and Porsche, were not rated because of insufficent owner responses.
Source: Consumers Union
The magazine's annual survey of product quality and performance, which hits newsstands Tuesday but has already gone to subscribers, ranks Japanese and South Korean automakers tops for quality. U.S. brands are second but fall below the industry average, and Europeans rank a distant third.
Subaru jumped 16 places to become the most reliable automotive brand overall for 2004 models. It's the first time Subaru finished in the top spot in the 26 years Consumer Reports has conducted the survey.
Subaru owners reported eight problems per 100 cars and SUVs sold — an 8% problem rate. Honda was the second-highest-rated brand at 9%, and Toyota took third at 10%. Lexus, last year's leader, fell to fourth with an 11% rate.
In another surprise, the magazine found South Korean automaker Hyundai Motor Co.'s mid-size Sonata sedan to be the most reliable car in the U.S. last year, with just two problems reported for every 100 cars sold.
"That's quite dramatic and shows that Hyundai has really made a big effort," said David Champion, Consumer Reports' auto testing director. "It used to be a joke to have Hyundai and reliability in the same sentence."
Last year's reliability champ was Toyota Motor Corp.'s Lexus GS sedan.
"With Subaru and Hyundai doing so well, we have two newcomers pushing the others to do even better," Champion said.
The magazine's quality ratings are based on surveys from 810,000 vehicle owners. Subscribers were asked to report problems in 17 areas, such as engine or bodywork troubles, for vehicles up to 8 years old.
As for the U.S. automakers, they keep drawing closer to their Asian rivals but never quite catch up. The best U.S. brands — Ford, which ranked ninth, and Pontiac, 10th — had 15 problems per 100 vehicles for 2004 models, more than twice Subaru's rate. Audi was the best from Europe, with a 12% problem rate.
The industry average for 2004 model vehicles was a 16% problem rate, compared with 17% a year earlier.
As a group, Asian brands averaged 12 problems per 100 vehicles, a score unchanged for three years. It wasn't all glory, though. Nissan Motor Co., hobbled by glitches with the Titan pickup, the Armada SUV and the Quest minivan built at its new Mississippi plant, fell well below the average with a 19% problem rate.
Several brands were not rated because of insufficient responses, the magazine said.
Domestic brands fell just below the industry mean, averaging 17 problems per 100 vehicles sold, an improvement from 18 last year. "They've been getting a little more reliable year after year," Champion said.
European passenger vehicle brands continued dragging the bottom with a 21% problem rate, slightly worse than the previous survey's 20%.
Of about 160 models surveyed, the worst reliability scores, with 49 problems per 100 vehicles, were tallied by two behemoth vehicles: Ford Motor Co.'s Lincoln Navigator SUV and the Nissan Quest minivan.
This is the second consecutive year U.S. brands outscored European makes. The European automakers, long plagued by problems with complex electrical systems, have been further hurt by quality problems with their SUVs, Champion said.
Volkswagen's Touareg, for instance, had one of the worst results in the survey, with 48 problems reported per 100 vehicles. Porsche's Cayenne, which shares the same vehicle platform, had 41 problems per 100. BMW's X5 and DaimlerChrysler's Mercedes-Benz M-Class SUV, the Mercedes E-Class sedan and Volkswagen's New Beetle also scored far below average in reliability.
In a separate satisfaction survey, Consumer Reports asked subscribers whether they would buy the same car or truck again. The magazine said it received more than 250,000 responses.
In this category, the Toyota Prius gas-electric hybrid topped the list — a first for a hybrid — with 94% of owners saying they would repeat. Last year's leader, the Lexus LS430 sedan, dropped into second place with a 92% positive response.
Of 32 vehicles on the magazine's "most satisfying" list, 25 are Japanese models, six are European, and only one, General Motors Corp.'s Chevrolet Corvette, is a domestic model.
The survey shows that satisfaction and quality don't always mesh: The reliable Hyundai Sonata doesn't appear on the list of most satisfying vehicles, but the Nissan Titan pickup, which received poor reliability scores, does.
In another first for hybrids, Consumer Reports named the 2005 Honda Accord Hybrid as its best pick for a family sedan. The hybrid uses a V-6 engine and an electric drive system to provide enhanced performance with the fuel economy of a four-cylinder car.
Reliability survey
Asian automakers continue to lead the industry in reliability, according to a Consumer Reports survey of 810,000 passenger vehicle owners in the U.S.
Top five:
Problems per 100 vehicles
Model year 2004 2003
Subaru Fuji 8 17
Honda 9 10
Acura 10 13
Toyota 10 11
Lexus 11 9
Bottom five:
Nissan 19 14
BMW 21 19
Volkswagen 23 19
Merc / Chrysler 25 22
Lincoln Ford 26 31
Some brands, including Hummer, Isuzu, Jaguar, Kia, Mini, Mitsubishi and Porsche, were not rated because of insufficent owner responses.
Source: Consumers Union
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 10,031
Likes: 0
From: Milwaukee, Wisconsin, US
Rep Power: 399 
also keep this in mind this is an INITIAL quality survey. even domestic cars often do well in initial quality surveys. it's long term where you really see the true quality of car manufacturers. do the survey for MY from 2000 or older, and you'll see honda/toyota at the top.
Registered!!
iTrader: (6)
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 542
Likes: 0
From: I sleep in a drawer.
Rep Power: 0
Originally Posted by S2000man01
also keep this in mind this is an INITIAL quality survey. even domestic cars often do well in initial quality surveys. it's long term where you really see the true quality of car manufacturers. do the survey for MY from 2000 or older, and you'll see honda/toyota at the top.
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,097
Likes: 0
From: Jacksonville, Fl
Rep Power: 374
Originally Posted by S2000man01
also keep this in mind this is an INITIAL quality survey. even domestic cars often do well in initial quality surveys. it's long term where you really see the true quality of car manufacturers. do the survey for MY from 2000 or older, and you'll see honda/toyota at the top.
Yeah you see that JD Power and Associates always give intial quality awards to dodge and kia, which is based on some short term trial. See what happens when you try to hit 50k.
Registered!!
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 1,501
Likes: 0
Rep Power: 297 the servey is not totally fair, as they only counted reported problems. But not mention what kind of problems.
A Lexus for instance would have way more functionalities compare to Civic, it has more parts, therefore it can have more problem reports. Also, please note that some of the high end automobiles such as BMW and Porsch had a lot of reports, it can be because the owners has high expectation on their car, and they would report any minor details.
A Lexus for instance would have way more functionalities compare to Civic, it has more parts, therefore it can have more problem reports. Also, please note that some of the high end automobiles such as BMW and Porsch had a lot of reports, it can be because the owners has high expectation on their car, and they would report any minor details.
Registered!!
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,597
Likes: 0
From: Edmonton
Rep Power: 0 Hyundai has jumped quite a few spots over the years, their performance has been really impressive. Most people used to consider Hyundai the same way people look at Kias or Daewoo nowadays, but their quality and offerings have really improved.
Most of their cars aren't the best to look at, the Toscani (sp?) Edition Tiburon I thought was kind of nice, they can be a wee bit slow taking into account the size of the block under the hood.
Hyundai offers features and quality for a good price, its just unfortunate that they'll never really be able to gain any prestige, because people will always view them as bottom of the bargain barrel cars.
Most of their cars aren't the best to look at, the Toscani (sp?) Edition Tiburon I thought was kind of nice, they can be a wee bit slow taking into account the size of the block under the hood.
Hyundai offers features and quality for a good price, its just unfortunate that they'll never really be able to gain any prestige, because people will always view them as bottom of the bargain barrel cars.
Nothing works better than a Chris except a Honda.
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 5,346
Likes: 0
From: Baltimore, MD
Rep Power: 346 I saw a neighbor bought a new Tucson recently... That must show how good Hyundai is going. I'm surprised that Subie beat Honda though. Impressive. Although, I guess they'd have to if they want to market vehicles above the midsize price range and into the luxery price range.
Registered!!
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,030
Likes: 0
From: Los Angeles
Rep Power: 288
Originally Posted by orion_squall
the servey is not totally fair, as they only counted reported problems. But not mention what kind of problems.
A Lexus for instance would have way more functionalities compare to Civic, it has more parts, therefore it can have more problem reports. Also, please note that some of the high end automobiles such as BMW and Porsch had a lot of reports, it can be because the owners has high expectation on their car, and they would report any minor details.
A Lexus for instance would have way more functionalities compare to Civic, it has more parts, therefore it can have more problem reports. Also, please note that some of the high end automobiles such as BMW and Porsch had a lot of reports, it can be because the owners has high expectation on their car, and they would report any minor details.
I sort of agree.
Higher end car buyers have more expectations out of their vehicles than someone who purchases a Civic.
Usually older people can afford the expensive cars while the young typically buy entry models.
Grandma would have alot of complaints about her new Lexus that young Civic drivers like us would learn to deal with or fix ourselves without reporting it.
How many of us post threads about a problem with their Vic and ask whether they should go to the dealer or not?
Those older people who drive their high end cars go to the dealer first thing without hesitation.
Higher end car buyers have more expectations out of their vehicles than someone who purchases a Civic.
Usually older people can afford the expensive cars while the young typically buy entry models.
Grandma would have alot of complaints about her new Lexus that young Civic drivers like us would learn to deal with or fix ourselves without reporting it.
How many of us post threads about a problem with their Vic and ask whether they should go to the dealer or not?
Those older people who drive their high end cars go to the dealer first thing without hesitation.
Originally Posted by orion_squall
the servey is not totally fair, as they only counted reported problems. But not mention what kind of problems.
A Lexus for instance would have way more functionalities compare to Civic, it has more parts, therefore it can have more problem reports. Also, please note that some of the high end automobiles such as BMW and Porsch had a lot of reports, it can be because the owners has high expectation on their car, and they would report any minor details.
A Lexus for instance would have way more functionalities compare to Civic, it has more parts, therefore it can have more problem reports. Also, please note that some of the high end automobiles such as BMW and Porsch had a lot of reports, it can be because the owners has high expectation on their car, and they would report any minor details.
Registered!!
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 110
Likes: 0
From: Midwest
Rep Power: 0 
Consumer reports is a great magazine to compair features and specs, but I would take anything they recomment with a grain of salt. They recommend Sony electronics over most other brands when Panasonic has some of the best quality controls in manufaturing. Not to downplay CR, they are great publication and provide a lot of info to consumers they may never be aware of, but I have seen it all to many times. Consumers purchase the CR best buy and they have been burned. Just my two cents!
Thread
Thread Starter
Honda Civic Forum
Replies
Last Post
Touge
Canada East
0
Aug 11, 2015 10:21 PM
Touge
Ottawa
0
Aug 11, 2015 10:21 PM
