D17 versus D16, help needed
05-11-2002
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D17 versus D16, help needed
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What are the primary differences between the old d16 and the new d17? Im trying to decide on wether to get a 02 Si or a 02 EX. Will the B16 head fit on the new engine? If not im assuming that it is a whole new engine, not just stroked a bit. What about performance parts? Will a greddy d16 turbo kit bolt straight up to a d17? or atleast the manifold? Surely the piping would have to be re-routed somewhat. If the D17 is a new engine completely does it spin counter clockwise or clockwise? Obviously if this is true the engine would be on the opposing side of the engine bay and therefore would require completely new components. Any help would be great, im getting either the ex or the si in the next 1-3 days. I really like the Si's interior, not to crazy about the hatch but once i saw it in person I liked it alot better. Thanks again.
What are the primary differences between the old d16 and the new d17? Im trying to decide on wether to get a 02 Si or a 02 EX. Will the B16 head fit on the new engine? If not im assuming that it is a whole new engine, not just stroked a bit. What about performance parts? Will a greddy d16 turbo kit bolt straight up to a d17? or atleast the manifold? Surely the piping would have to be re-routed somewhat. If the D17 is a new engine completely does it spin counter clockwise or clockwise? Obviously if this is true the engine would be on the opposing side of the engine bay and therefore would require completely new components. Any help would be great, im getting either the ex or the si in the next 1-3 days. I really like the Si's interior, not to crazy about the hatch but once i saw it in person I liked it alot better. Thanks again.
05-11-2002
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Rep Power: 0 First thing first the 02 SI is a K20 engine. Second NO the B16 engine or any of it's components will not fit the 7th gen Civic. The K engine turns the oposite direction from the D engine. The D engine is a smaller more compact engine and is a 1.7 liter versus the B16 that was a 1.6 liter or the K that is a 2 liter. Oh all of this has been covered so next time do a search!!!!!
05-11-2002
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Rep Power: 0 << First thing first the 02 SI is a K20 engine. Second NO the B16 engine or any of it's components will not fit the 7th gen Civic. The K engine turns the oposite direction from the D engine. The D engine is a smaller more compact engine and is a 1.7 liter versus the B16 that was a 1.6 liter or the K that is a 2 liter. Oh all of this has been covered so next time do a search!!!!! >>
1) Im not a newb
2) Everything you explained to me i had already posted as options in the original question
3) I know the k20a3 is in the si, and the d17 is in the ex, i stated this in the question obviously.
4) You realize that the b16 head fits direct bolt on the b18 and b20 right? [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-cool.gif[/IMG]
5) So your saying that the d17 is a completely new engine (ie not just stroked like a b18, as you would know had you had any knowledge of an engine, displacement = bore x stroke) yet it still spins counter clockwise? that just sounds odd, honda finally conforms to clockwise rotation, yet they make a new engine spin counter clockwise
6) The search wasnt working, kept timing out, thanks for the lack of answers and lack of reading the question, of yeah and the flames, cant forget the flames
Lastly I drove the Ex today and the Si, again, and im going to get a 2000 Si coupe, the hatchback is just minivan looking and the newer ex is just too slow with no aftermarket, but it looks good and ive seen alot of you guys' cars that are tight. Peace
05-11-2002
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Rep Power: 0 I'm sure I'm gonna sound like a fool asking this but what engine is the D16? Never mind I remembered we have one.
<< If the D17 is a new engine completely does it spin counter clockwise or clockwise? >>
I can't tell you which way it spins cuz I can't remember but I know the K engine and the D engines spin opposite directions. That is why you can't take the head from the RSX or the CRV and put it on the D17.
<< Obviously if this is true the engine would be on the opposing side of the engine bay and therefore would require completely new components. >>
Uh yeah.
<< Will the B16 head fit on the new engine? >>
Like I said before NO!
<< 2) Everything you explained to me i had already posted as options in the original question >>
Yes I understand that but I was clarifing since you obviously did not know for sure.
<< 4) You realize that the b16 head fits direct bolt on the b18 and b20 right? >>
Yes but when you have two totally different engines you can't do it. It would be like taking the head from a Focus and trying to put in on the Prelude. (well not that drastic but you get the point)
<< 5) So your saying that the d17 is a completely new engine (ie not just stroked like a b18, as you would know had you had any knowledge of an engine, displacement = bore x stroke) yet it still spins counter clockwise? that just sounds odd, honda finally conforms to clockwise rotation, yet they make a new engine spin counter clockwise >>
I'm just curious how you would stoke a 1.8 liter engine to a 1.7 liter engine.
<< Lastly I drove the Ex today and the Si, again, and im going to get a 2000 Si coupe, the hatchback is just minivan looking and the newer ex is just too slow with no aftermarket, but it looks good and ive seen alot of you guys' cars that are tight. Peace >>
Well the 2000 Si coupe would be an EX coupe here in the states. So before you try and sound all smart and pretend you know what you are talking about get your **** straight.
<< If the D17 is a new engine completely does it spin counter clockwise or clockwise? >>
I can't tell you which way it spins cuz I can't remember but I know the K engine and the D engines spin opposite directions. That is why you can't take the head from the RSX or the CRV and put it on the D17.
<< Obviously if this is true the engine would be on the opposing side of the engine bay and therefore would require completely new components. >>
Uh yeah.
<< Will the B16 head fit on the new engine? >>
Like I said before NO!
<< 2) Everything you explained to me i had already posted as options in the original question >>
Yes I understand that but I was clarifing since you obviously did not know for sure.
<< 4) You realize that the b16 head fits direct bolt on the b18 and b20 right? >>
Yes but when you have two totally different engines you can't do it. It would be like taking the head from a Focus and trying to put in on the Prelude. (well not that drastic but you get the point)
<< 5) So your saying that the d17 is a completely new engine (ie not just stroked like a b18, as you would know had you had any knowledge of an engine, displacement = bore x stroke) yet it still spins counter clockwise? that just sounds odd, honda finally conforms to clockwise rotation, yet they make a new engine spin counter clockwise >>
I'm just curious how you would stoke a 1.8 liter engine to a 1.7 liter engine.
<< Lastly I drove the Ex today and the Si, again, and im going to get a 2000 Si coupe, the hatchback is just minivan looking and the newer ex is just too slow with no aftermarket, but it looks good and ive seen alot of you guys' cars that are tight. Peace >>
Well the 2000 Si coupe would be an EX coupe here in the states. So before you try and sound all smart and pretend you know what you are talking about get your **** straight.
05-12-2002
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anyways I think the question has more to do with the D series engines.
Any D series head would probably be compatible with the D17.
as would B series heads with b series engines.
So with that B16 heads would not work on a D series engine, meaning no wont wwork with either version D or K series.
anyways I think the question has more to do with the D series engines.
Any D series head would probably be compatible with the D17.
as would B series heads with b series engines.
So with that B16 heads would not work on a D series engine, meaning no wont wwork with either version D or K series.
05-12-2002
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Rep Power: 343 heh. he's not a newbie, you guys are.
you guys need to learn how to read. from his question you can tell he has some knowledge on hondas.
actually, he did phrase a few things weird, but I got the gist of his quesiton.
2cute: what do u mean by 2000 Si is EX in the states? When he said 2000 Si, he meant the Si we got here in the states, not the Si from Canada.
when he said stroke, he meant the b18s are a lot alike compared to the b16s, just bigger stroke = bigger displacement (well, a few other differences, but the same engine in plenty aspect)
so, he's wondering if the d17s are minor upped version of the d16s. which... they are. but the changes are more than just bigger bore and stroke, the changes to the emission, is the major difference. the jump to ULEV, different exhaust system, and extra compactness of the engine is evident.. (ie: vertical throttle body port).
anyway, to answer his question, which is too late anyway since he decided on a car...
b16 head wont fit on the new engine, whether that be the d17 or k20. turbos for the d16 wont bolt straight up too without major modification. engine bay is just plenty more smaller that building a sensible turbo makes it harder, not to mention the more limiting exhaust system and stricter emission control ecu. it spins the same as the d16s, which is clockwise, right? heh.
going with the 00 Si coupe is a good choice.. though if your 92 Lude does run 15.1, you may get slower time with the Si.
the new Si is too expensive for what its worth. imo.
you guys need to learn how to read. from his question you can tell he has some knowledge on hondas.
actually, he did phrase a few things weird, but I got the gist of his quesiton.
2cute: what do u mean by 2000 Si is EX in the states? When he said 2000 Si, he meant the Si we got here in the states, not the Si from Canada.
when he said stroke, he meant the b18s are a lot alike compared to the b16s, just bigger stroke = bigger displacement (well, a few other differences, but the same engine in plenty aspect)
so, he's wondering if the d17s are minor upped version of the d16s. which... they are. but the changes are more than just bigger bore and stroke, the changes to the emission, is the major difference. the jump to ULEV, different exhaust system, and extra compactness of the engine is evident.. (ie: vertical throttle body port).
anyway, to answer his question, which is too late anyway since he decided on a car...
b16 head wont fit on the new engine, whether that be the d17 or k20. turbos for the d16 wont bolt straight up too without major modification. engine bay is just plenty more smaller that building a sensible turbo makes it harder, not to mention the more limiting exhaust system and stricter emission control ecu. it spins the same as the d16s, which is clockwise, right? heh.
going with the 00 Si coupe is a good choice.. though if your 92 Lude does run 15.1, you may get slower time with the Si.
the new Si is too expensive for what its worth. imo.
05-12-2002
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Rep Power: 0 Thx cap yoda, very helpful
One last thing, the K series (K20A1 (JDM Type R Integra), K20A2 (Type S in the states), K20A3 (02 Civic Si, Base RSX, and the K24 Cr-v engine) are the only engines honda has ever built that spin clockwise, which is the direction in which every other engine, pretty much ever made, spins. In the 60s when honda made the jump from motorcycles to cars, they made the engines spin counterclockwise because it puts the engine on the passenger side (in japan, drivers side in america) of the engine bay, therefore making it easier to route the steering column, which is obviously not so beneficial in america hehe. It just seems weird to me that they made a d17, changed the entire engine around (ie not just stroking it or boreing it or messing with the head, tb, etc) and made it spin counterclockwise. You can really tell the engines apart by sound tho, the clockwise spinning k20a2 and a3 just sound funky to me. And about the Prelude vs the Civic, my lude just has too many miles on it, and its an auto and im sick of it. Great car tho, i would buy it over a thousand times if there was just a better aftermarket. Thanks for all the info, the Si i found is a 2000 Red with 22K miles, good price cause i know the owner of the dealership. Going for these mods until i can afford a supra ( i would get one now but i have alot of money tied up in court, yeah racing [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/IMG]) Peace
One last thing, the K series (K20A1 (JDM Type R Integra), K20A2 (Type S in the states), K20A3 (02 Civic Si, Base RSX, and the K24 Cr-v engine) are the only engines honda has ever built that spin clockwise, which is the direction in which every other engine, pretty much ever made, spins. In the 60s when honda made the jump from motorcycles to cars, they made the engines spin counterclockwise because it puts the engine on the passenger side (in japan, drivers side in america) of the engine bay, therefore making it easier to route the steering column, which is obviously not so beneficial in america hehe. It just seems weird to me that they made a d17, changed the entire engine around (ie not just stroking it or boreing it or messing with the head, tb, etc) and made it spin counterclockwise. You can really tell the engines apart by sound tho, the clockwise spinning k20a2 and a3 just sound funky to me. And about the Prelude vs the Civic, my lude just has too many miles on it, and its an auto and im sick of it. Great car tho, i would buy it over a thousand times if there was just a better aftermarket. Thanks for all the info, the Si i found is a 2000 Red with 22K miles, good price cause i know the owner of the dealership. Going for these mods until i can afford a supra ( i would get one now but i have alot of money tied up in court, yeah racing [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/IMG]) Peace
05-12-2002
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Rep Power: 343 yeah. counter-clockwise. thats what I meant. heh. (I know they're the same as d16s and the likes, and they're different from most manufactures... and that they're finally spinning it the same direction as the other manufactures.)
anyway no biggie 2cute.
enjoy your Si dude. and keep the racing down, its gonna cost you!
anyway no biggie 2cute.
enjoy your Si dude. and keep the racing down, its gonna cost you!
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