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Hey guys, I just registered with the forum as I just bought my first Honda. I don't know very much about these motors at all. So lets start with a little background on the car.

I just bought this 95 civic lx 3 days ago. I've been driving it EVERYWHERE with no issues. When I got off work today I decided I was going to stop and get the tires balanced and a much needed alignment.

The guy at the shop drove it around the parking lot for 20-30 seconds and parked it. He came out wrote down some info off the car: tags, mileage etc etc. the normal stuff.

When the tech came out 1-2 minutes later the car cranked and cranked but would not start... Now I've only had the car for 3 days... but have yet to see this problem.

The only way we the car to start was to hold the gas pedal to the floor. After getting it to start it revved itself to about 2 grand and slowly came down to under 1k. If you hit the gas, the rpms would drop before going up, like there is a delay there.

Got the car home and let it set for a while. After it cooled down, it starts up and responds perfect. Can anyone PLEASE help me with this problem? It seems that once it gets to operating temperature it doesn't want to run right, nor does it want to start if you turn it off.....

The car is a manual 5spd and bone stock.

Thanks in advance for your time, and suggestions.

 
Rep Power: 517

Ok....
And then....
I'm thinking the car does NOT want to be there. Stay away from there.






Was that the very first time you drove it long enough to get it to operating temperature?

Does it still act wrong when it gets to operating temperature now?

Check engine light on? What codes?

 
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It was not the first time that I've drove it long enough to get operating temp up. I've done that multiple times in the past 3 days.

Yes it still acts up when it reaches operating temperature. It starts with a delay in the lower rpm register (kinda boggish, gotta really rev it to take off without stalling). If you turn it off, it will not start until it cools down, however at times you can start it if you hold the gas pedal to the floor. If you start it like that it runs really rough.

No check engine light on.


At first I was wondering if maybe it was a coolant temperature sensor, because if you pop the hood after reaching operating temperature everything in the engine bay is HOT! I know that may sound stupid... and maybe it's a Honda thing, but i'm not used to vehicles getting that hot.

However the temp gauge seems to function normally, starts cold, and stays about halfway.. I let it idle and turned the heat on, fan is kicking on. I checked most of the visible connections under the hood, and checked the plug wires (which look new).

I have not pulled the plugs yet...

What would make these cars run fine cold, but crappy at operating temp?
Timing issue maybe??? The seller told me that they recently had the timing belt and water pump replaced... But why all of a sudden would I see the symptoms?

 
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Or could it possibly be the Crankshaft position sensor?

 
Rep Power: 517

Um, yeah. You sound like it's your first time under a hood.
ALL engines are hot at operating temperature. Some parts are much hotter than others.

Um, this
But not for the reason you assumed above.

The coolant temp sensor was my first thought. (There are 2 separate sensors.
I mean the sensor that the computer uses, not the sensor for the gauge.)

If you had a scanner that could read live engine data, the needed information would be in the data. No guesses. I'm thinking that the sensor is probably inaccurate at certain temps, and seeing live data in real time could confirm the suspicion. Maybe compare with an IR thermometer or something too if necessary.

 
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*Update*

Started the car up and drove it 20 miles to work this morning. Upon arrival I shut the car off and immediately tried to restart it, just cranked.

10:00 am I started the car up and drove it to the gas station.

Noon - Now 90 degrees. Tried to start the car and now it won't even crank.

Jumped it with a screw driver to get it home. I've tested and have voltage coming from the ignition switch, and passing through the connector, however no voltage at the starter solenoid.

Is it possible that this is a bad main relay?

 
Rep Power: 517

Main relay can make the car not start (by losing power for the ECM or the fuel pump), but the main relay cannot keep the starter from working. Sounds like you have now found 2 different issues?

That reminds me of people that say you can open all the doors to cool off the interior like 15 minutes, and it may run again when the relay gets cooled off.

Main relay can be usually resoldered if you are even remotely handy at soldering. Save yourself $80+ if it helps.
I have done this to several dozen over the years.....at one point around Y2K there was a shortage (national backorder) of main relays from Honda and I soldered a pile of them during that time. None failed.

No crank, could be anywhere between ignition switch and the starter.
Ign. switch, neutral safety/PRNDL, clutch switch, wiring, etc.

You said 95 LX civic, I need to know more:
2, 3, 4 doors?
Manual or automatic?
USA or Canada market? (where are you at?)

Fuse #18 (7.5 amp) in the dash fuse box is connected to that starter circuit.....Does it receive 12v when you try to crank it?

 
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2door, manual trans, USA. Also it must be a DX because from what I've heard all LX's have 4 doors, and it's not a vtec, so i'm guessing that rules out the EX. I just bought the car and the seller told me it was a LX.. No badges on the trunk indicating either way.

I will check that fuse to see if it's getting 12v tomorrow.

 
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Also I did try splicing the black and white wire under the dash and running new 12g wire to solenoid... still nothing

 
Rep Power: 517

Manual trans uses a safety switch on the clutch pedal, and a "starter cut" relay connected to that.


You can have a 2 door DX, I don't see 2 door LX in the list.
Power windows or not?
DX got manual windows. EX got power windows.


Found this diagram on Google, looks right for that car



Starter cut relay is somewhere under the dash between clutch pedal and fusebox (guessing) the pic I have is clear as mud.

You can see where fuse 18 is on the starter circuit here, I kinda used that to "split" the mess in half during diagnosis. If it gets power, I know a bunch of stuff IS working, but if not powered then I have to go upward in the diagram and do more checks.

 
Rep Power: 517

You ran a jumper wire from where to where and it still did not work?

 
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If it has the optional dealer installed security system, it would have another starter cut relay as part of that system too.

 
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I'm not aware off a security system in the car. It does have power windows. I ran a jumper from the black and white wire from the ignition system under the dash straight to the starter. It still wouldn't crank. I thought that would bypass the issue for a temporary fix. I'm at work now but will dig into it more this evening to see if I can figure it out.

 
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But it does crank when you run the jumper wire from the starter to the battery?


Power windows should make it an EX

 
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Ran jumper from starter to battery and it fired right up.

 
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Any idea? Its driving me nuts. Would really like to get this thing fixed. Thank you ezone for your time and patience.

 
Rep Power: 517

If what I now have pictured in my head is really what you have done, then you may have a bad ignition switch.

(Make sure you aren't trying to use the white/black instead of black/white wire. White/black is for accessory power, not the starter.)



Starter will work, but you have no power coming out of the ignition switch on the crank wire with the key in the crank position..... Did you confirm this with the voltmeter? Still has power going in on the white wire, but no power coming out on the blk/wht wire

Looking at the diagram above: If you go directly to the back of the ignition switch and jump white wire to black/white wire, does it crank? (You still have to push in the clutch before it would crank.) If you can make it crank with this effectively bypassing the ignition switch, that should confirm the switch is bad.