Rep Power: 149

2001 LX 5MT

On my way home from work, while waiting at a stoplight, my engine started stumbling like it was about to shut off. Gave it a little gas and it recovered. Didn't trust it after that and it died on me at another stoplight. Started right up and ran fine.
Stopped at grocery near my house and now it won't start. Cranks, and I pressed the gas pedal to the floor. It wanted to run, but doesn't fire. The dash lights appear to be normal, so it doesn't appear to be a dead ECU.
Reminds me of the way it ran when my cam sensor failed last year.

A Honda tech on his way home pulled into the parking lot next to me and had a look at it with me. He took the gas cap off and listened as I turned the key to the run position. He says he hears the fuel pump and we could fainlty smell fuel with the hood open while trying to start it.
He also put a scanner on it and says there are no codes. He mentioned that there is another scan tool but he doesn't have it with him and that might tell us something, idk what.

He said if I get a can of brake-leen and spray it in throttle body and see if it fires....

Besides the not wanting to idle, it ran fine the whole drive home. It ran smooth, not missing or stumbling.

I am 160 miles since I filled up with gas. Gauge shows over half a tank. Since it isn't throwing a code, could it be the crank sensor or a failed coil? How can I tell if I have spark?
Could this be a failed injector, say for Cyl #1 that would keep it from starting?
Should I spray carb cleaner in the throttle body?

I am going to wait until later this evening to go back up and see if it will fire and let me get it home. Got anything I should check? Things I should try?

 
Rep Power: 518

Last timing belt? tensioner? Mileage?
Unplug the cam sensor and see if it runs?


You would do this to check for "lack of fuel". If it fires on carb spray then you know fuel is missing from the equation.

Not firing on it won't mean anything, too many variables.


If it had one failed coil, it should still run (poorly, with misfire) on the other 3 coils.
Same for the injectors-- unless there's a shorted winding in one.

Remove a coil, reconnect the wire connector. Use a spark gap checker..
OR
You COULD use this handy guide (from Bubbas Teknical Tips):

IGNITION VOLTAGE OUTPUT TEST

Scopes may be inaccessible from time to time, so we at "Bubba's Garage"
have come up with this here test for Ignition Output:

Hold medium wrench in one hand, Sears wrench preferred for accuracy
of test 'cause other smooth wrenches are too slick for throwin'!
With engine runnin', grab hold of the plug end of an ignition cable with the other hand
and hold on tight!
This will more than likely cause you to throw wrench! KV output is based on how far
the wrench wuz thrown!
10 feet =
approx. 10,000 volts

20 feet =
approx. 15,000 volts

30 feet =
approx. 25,000 volts

Over 30 feet =
Caution! Must be one of them new
dis-is-it ignition systems, use bigger
wrench and retest.


WARNING! No side effects have been reported due to testing at this time
(although it has been known to kill chiggers after berry pickin')

Bubba Sez: Electricity will not usually hurt you, instead it is the back of
your neck going through the hood latch that really ruins your day!!

 
Rep Power: 149

UPDATE: I popped the air filter cover off and gave it a shot of brake cleaner. Started right up. Drove it home, it ran smooth.
So, I should clean IAC? Scratching my head on this one.

 
Rep Power: 149

I replaced the timing belt, water pump and tensioner 400 miles ago. Total miles are 180,164. All genuine Honda parts.


A shot of brake cleaner and it fired up and runs smooth.


Spark gap checker... I must google this sometime, but it seems I have spark...

If this was a sensor or the IAC wouldn't I get a CEL.?

Even a clogged injector putting out less fuel should give me a CEL...?

So without an error code, what are my logical suspects? Fuel pump or IAC?

 
Rep Power: 518

Did you try cranking it BEFORE squirting brake cleaner in it? Would it have run ok on its own if you hadn't?

It's running, you have spark. At the moment.

Maybe, maybe not.
If it created enough misfires to trip the misfire monitor. Pump not likely IMO, they have been awfully reliable here.

Ran ok but idled too slow?
Starts hard or not at all but will start and run if you use the gas pedal just a little? (IAC stuck closed, can't idle on its own)



Did you try cranking with gas pedal maybe 1/4 way down instead of all the way to the floor? (see line above)


Did you unplug the crank sensor to do the job?

 
Rep Power: 149

I cranked it, no start. I just tried again when I got home. I had to spray a little brakeleen to get it running.

This describes it best for me. I will inspect, clean IAC...



Nope... will try that.

No...

 
Rep Power: 518

You got a scanner of some sort?
What does the PCM think coolant temp is? Does it sound accurate/feasible for cold engine, or does it seem out of line?

 
Rep Power: 0

Is unplugging the crank sensor bad? I've got mine unplugged at the moment while I'm replacing the head.

 
Rep Power: 518

Only in that there seems to be an unusually high incidence of problems that occur shortly after it has been unplugged. Poor connection, poor contacts, liquid entry and subsequent corrosion, that sort of thing.

I learned early on to just unbolt the sensor and move it off to the side without unplugging it.

 
Rep Power: 149

The timing belt DIY said to remove the bolt and thats how I did it.

I replaced the thermostat & coolant temp sensor with Honda parts in summer 2014.

I am going to start with IAC and clean it up. See what happens after....

 
Rep Power: 149

I don't have a scanner. Maybe I should invest in one. I just spent some money on cordless impact and crank pulley tool....

 
Rep Power: 518

Scangauge or similar? Bluetooth and phone app?

 
Rep Power: 222

https://www.amazon.ca/Veepeak-Blueto...obd2+bluetooth

I'm probably going to get one of these in the next couple months. I currently have a cheap princess auto (harbor freight) scanner at the moment that does a decent job.

 
Rep Power: 149

I cleaned the IAC and it started for me. It didn't start as crisp as normal.

I took it for a test drive. All seemed okay while it warmed up. But after it was up to operating temp I noticed it wasn't willing to rev past 3k rpm.

I got up to 60mph on the freeway and I downshifted to 4th. Smoke out the rear and it started to stumble.

It didn't want to idle after that.

Made it home and pulled off the air filter cover. The shiny stuff is oil....

 
Rep Power: 518

Holy poop!

How high is the oil level on the dipstick?

How much oil is sitting in the bottom of the intake manifold?


The filter media looks dry, so...
The oil looks like it had to have come through the breather tube in the valve cover.......
Is there a severe restriction in the air breather ductwork or that big chamber that would cause it to pull oil out of the valve cover (via manifold vacuum)?

Check oil level (again?)

PCV valve plugged up?
Baffle in the valve cover damaged?
Sludge in the head plugging up the oil drainback holes to the crankcase?

 
Rep Power: 149

I checked the oil on Monday and it was just a hair off full. Which I thought was odd because it was exactly full last week. I checked again after seeing that oily mess and it's still just under the full line.
Its coming from the breather tube for sure... PCV check is on my to do list...

The very large air box could have a plastic bag or something in it... I'll be investigating on Friday at the latest. Its been raining or threatening to... Full day at work tomorrow but I'll either get on it tomorrow or Friday.
I thought I had checked the PCV at some point, but I will definitely check it.
I've never seen signs of sludge, even last month when I had the oil pan off to replace the gasket. I was very careful with valve cover when I had it off to do the timing belt last month.

She was running great until Monday afternoon. I can't see how anything got damaged and it got to this point so fast.

You can guess what my first thought was... since every other thread is about a blown head gasket. But I've never seen oil coming out of the breather as a symptom.
I think its running like crap because there is oil in the intake air... I just need to figure out what is causing this back pressure.

 
Rep Power: 133

Check the cylinder pressure for bad head gasket, worn piston rings, valve seals, injector O-rings... Change the PCV valve.

 
Rep Power: 518

Full of rodent food stash?

Remove the big chamber from on top of the trans and test drive a few days to see if symptom persists?
I would agree on all these. Runs like crap as soon as it swallows a slug of oil..

Did you open the throttle to look in the bottom of the intake (flashlight ), see if there's a lake inside? (maybe use a dipstick to see how deep it is)

 
Rep Power: 149

No rodent nest, and not blockages on the very large airbox.
I replaced the PCV but the old one rattled and didn't appear clogged.

No lake in the intake, just an oily film but I used carb cleaner and it was running fine after cleaning.

I now have a vibration when I back off the throttle. Very odd, seems like its coming from the bottom end of the motor.

I drove it but never got above 2500 RPM.

It spit a little bit (teaspoon) of oil out of the breathing tube.

This is not good...

 
Rep Power: 518

Hmmm.........................Hose attached and flowing?
PCV is supposed to draw a slight vacuum on the crankcase especially while the engine is idling. Does it?
Open air filter box and block the valve cover vent tube with your fingers and wait a few seconds, can you feel vacuum?
(You will feel air pulsations back and forth because the engine is running but overall it should pull a little vacuum)
(Checking for a working PCV system, and checking that it is not overcome by blow-by at idle)



Remove fingers from breather....
If you hold throttle steady maybe 2000-3000 RPM does it spit oil out into the breather area, or must you be driving for this to spit oil out?


I'm thinking a compression test would be in order....
Compression test, is it lower than it used to be? (if you've ever done it in the past)


Pull valve cover and look inside? Oil return holes not plugged, baffle/oil separator area ok?


Puzzled.
Swallowing a huge gulp of liquid can bend rods.

 
Rep Power: 149

At cold start and idle I could feel it pushing air out the vent tube...
PCV connection was drawing a vacuum.

My wife is already searching dealer lots for a replacement used car (maybe on sale for Memorial day). She wants me to get something 3-5 years old, and an automatic that she can drive comfortably...
Over the years I've learned not to argue with her about these things (over 21 yrs of marriage)! She has always found great cars. The one car she didn't find was my Civic. I've been reminded of that often this week. I have heard about all the time I spent working on it, etc.
She is searching for a Toyota Corolla.

I'll trade in the Civic and have fond memories of it.
Maybe I can get a gently used 8th gen with a manual transmission after a few years... but I doubt the wife will approve...

 
Rep Power: 518

Aww man, I want to know whats causing the problem!

Cars can't make it to old age without help (maintenance/service/fixing whatever broke), doesn't matter what brand.

It will need a water pump.

 
Rep Power: 149

I traded the Civic on a 2013 Corolla. It feels very refined compared to my Civic and with the auto it could be described as "dull".
But I can't sink a lot of time, money and effort into the Civic for economic reasons. I'm in my mid 40s and I have a family that depends on me.

I want to express my appreciation to the forum members and especially you during my Civic ownership. I had a great experience and really enjoyed my Civic. I'm sad to see it go, but stuff happens.

 
Rep Power: 210

Make sure to check the recall list for a Toyota ( or on any make/model) ..they've had a lot of recalls in the past 10 years.

 
Rep Power: 0

Man my civic is acting up similar to this. Suck that didn't get resolved. Only mine starts fine cold just doesnt want to restart directly after engine shutoff.

 
Rep Power: 0

doesn't want to restart right I shut it down when up to temp. I drive 40 mile without issues.