Rep Power: 266

ok so here is where i stand on what i am planning on doing next summer if money provides. i want to resleeve block with darton sleeves and bore to 77mm.get the Wiseco 77mm custom NA pistons with an undecided compression. i am currently debating on whether to swap the head and get the stage 3 A2 crower camshaft with new springs and retainers ( either supertech or crower) . I'm between having KMS and energy dynamics do the head porting with new .5mm overbore valves and a decent valve job. right now that is the extent of the build i will be doing. i would like to get a custom header and ITB setup but thats another 2500 right there. Im going to try and find a wreck with under 40,000-50,000 miles to put in place of my current 83,000 mile engine. hopefully i can find a manual tranny with axles ECU and everything else (another build in its self) to replace the auto tranny currently plaguing my car. whether its the a2 or a1 i don't think i will be picky about because either way i see the building being a pretty monstrous one. and for everyone that is wondering what my hp goals are i am not going to jump to conclusions and get my hopes up. i would rather be surprised when i get the final dyno. the goal is to keep the price of the build under 2500 (excluding the new engine). so i will be doing as much of the work myself as possible. i know this list will probably change but that is where i currently stand in my thinking. so what is the verdict? anything that should be reconsidered? anything to be improved upon? what compression would you guys suggest to keep the car running on pump gas if that is even possible at this point. thanks guys

 
Rep Power: 388

Its possible, and very likely to keep it running on pump gas.

I'd say your build price is going to go over budget- like you said, an ITB and custom header is that much.

You might want to look into portflowing, to be on top of whatever fabericators you choose.

With a stage three cam, it'll be rough, but do able.

If you switch to a manaul, you might have to grab a new clutch and flywheel down the line to handle the power (if applicaple). Plus, you can save some weight on thoes components = more useable power to the wheels.

Its a good idea to grab the spare engine, I might have to be on the look out for a new block now!

I picked up the stage 2 a2 cam, crower valve springs and ti retainers already. I havent installed yet.

Your going to need to run a stand alone ems. I'm going to run hondata, but you could pick aem or whatever you want. So dont go grabbing the next civic ecu that you find.

As far as the valves... (you knew I would haunt you on this) Are you planning on running +.5mm on both intake and exhaust side? What about coated vs non coated / stainless? How did you come to this conclusion? What research do you have to back this decision up?

With the camshaft and the valve springs, you can push the redline up for a more useable power band. You'd then be good to 9,000 RPM redline, or at least thats what crower says. And no, you cant change the redline or the fuel mixture with the stock ecu. Standalone for the win... $1k+

Other then that, sounds pretty good. We'll be the only two people doing an NA build. I think I'm going to have to push mine off till next summer too. I dont want to have to slop it together now and pay the price later.

Words of wisdom... your going to need a new gasket pack- you can buy it from honda directly, or you can grab one off ebay... I got mine off ebay, from the same dude as speedfoos. It looks to be top quality. Many people say dont run the head gasket, or the valve seals... but the look identical in every way to the stockers, and I havent heard any problems from anyone about these guys. They are shipped directly from japan, suprisingly- how do I know... kuz of the japanese sheet of newspaper that was packed in with it to protect it. I also had to grab new valve guides. From the stealership they are ~$160ish, shipped from majestic, they are $105ish. Technically I didnt need to do this, but when your building a used motor, you dont know where its been, but you know where you want it to go... might as well be on the safe side. With oversized valves, this eliminates the need for that paste and grind concept.

 
Rep Power: 0

this is by far the best N/A build post ive seen on this website, period. +1 for u civic-driver, im impressed at all the research uve done, i have an a1 too, so im very curious at how ur cam works out, if u do decide to do this mod, i want to know ur cost for cam replacement, as i want a slightly more aggressive cam profile as well, good work, keep it up

 
Rep Power: 266

ok let me rephrase the 2500 budget part. thats what im trying to spend for the headwork valves,retainers , springs , camshaft , sleeves, and pistons. which is i think at 2200 without any labor ( i think). that is what will be bought first i believe. also thinking about getting the crankshaft knife edged and micropolished.i really dont want to get new rods which i know i should but i dont know that i want to rev it to the full 9000 rpm. so if it will be needed on the 7500-8000 i want to do im not sure but ya.

i am planning as of now on getting the .5mm overbore unless i find something that convinces me otherwise. as for the coated versus stainless, i want to get the black nitride coated (http://www.honda-performance.com/info-lv2.asp?id=312) just because from what i have found they hold together better ,disperse heat better and have less friction in the valve guides. i guess using normal bore with regular stainless valves is worthless in most applications so i said what the hell and kinda went with it. the guy i emailed never emailed me back on the valve questions so im not sure right now thats just where i stand.

as for fuel management im really open to what you guys suggest. i was leaning towards k-pro just because i have heard good things but i dont know if it has limits in comparison to standalone AEM. im really curious to see if i would have to get new injectors for the setup. i will probably go with this (http://www.streetlevelperformance.co...ion%20Kit.aspx) when i get to the fuel demands stage with the fuel management and possible the rsx injectors if it reaches that stage(dont know if it will).

yes i was planning on getting new gaskets and seals everywhere but thanks for posting it in case some one see this and gets inspired lol. as for the flywheel and clutch i was already planning on it just because it will be a used tranny so might as well replace while its off the car. also going to get the revo shift assembly because i think it will be easier to find than a stock one.
just for clarification the ITB and header will be in the years to follow so that i will still have things to upgrade.
was there any suggestions on compression ratios? that is still kind of foreign to me other than knowing 12:1 and higher is pretty much considered "high" compression. knowing what will actually work ...
well ya. anyway just thought i would throw this post up before i hung out with my automotive engineers club. we have a mini baja vehicle with a 10 hp engine.thing is a blast to drive.the club is just a bunch of other mechanical engineering majors like myself bullshiting and havine fun. we are working on the tranny and rear suspension right now. gearing is to high for the hills and the geometry is off on the rear. gotta love college heh. alright later guys

 
Rep Power: 266

ok well as promised triz i sent the "old one" another email and asked him what he suggested and i sent him the specs for your cam so he could get a better idea. i saw that family car seemed to agree with my on the 1mm being overkill on the N/A yes flow testing would probably be in order to tell for sure but ya.

To continue i was thinking about the not getting new rods and crankshaft and what could be done to help it and not totally kill the bank. I came across a site that does some relatively cheap cryo treating : http://www.metal-wear.com/racing_component_prices.htm
i was thinking getting the camshaft , the crankshaft, and the connecting rods. the crank being micropolished and the knife edged first ( would that cause any issues?). that was just a thought on something to reinforce them a bit and such.

any thoughts on any other services coating etc. that could be done on any internal parts that would help keep the engine alive longer? also any that would help increase the performance? im trying to look at many different things that will help out in the long run. possibly the black nitride coating that is done on the valves applied to something else? ok i will continue looking and you guys have a good one later.

 
Rep Power: 266

bump for thoughts on k-pro vs AEM for stand alone? or any other services to look into?

possibly thinking of a 11:1 compression ratio for the pistons that seems to be the consensus on honda tech on what is acceptable in lower elevations and i live in Colorado so my car has never even seen sea level so i should be in the clear with 91 gas. possibly lower we will see.

I am also between the stage 3 and stage 2 camshafts at the moment because i'm worried about idle and the stage 3 putting the powerband up higher than i would like. im a fan of low to midrange power which i know isnt common in our cars. so im thinking if i stick to the stage 2 the mid range will still be preserved and i will also get more top while sacrificing the lower a lot less. hopefully the losses in certain areas will be offset by the higher compression pistons.

Just a little update before going to class. later guys

B

 
Rep Power: 266

Also i screwed the email up i sent to "the old one" when i put the cam specs in so he couldn't read it. so i re-did it and sent it again.

one thing i forgot to bring up was the oil issues in a higher revving motor. I was considering getting the oil pump modified to increase flow. another service offered by Endyn. they also have a extra oil adapter which seems good in theory and i thought it might be a good idea as well:
http://theoldone.com/components/Oil%...umbing_kit.htm.
any comments on this? and as i havent really looked at the way things are plumbed where would i attach the oil line if i were to use this.

i also came across this speedfoos and was wondering if this is really what you were trying to make? : http://theoldone.com/components/breather/

Ok well that should be the last update for the day later guys


B

 
Rep Power: 0

is it really necessary for the oil pump? maybe later down the road when you rev it up to 9000rpm. but in order to do that, you would have to strengthen bottom end or else it would kaboom. And about the cryo,, wouldn't it make the iron brittle? i duno, have to read more to find out.

btw, anyone ever thought of using GX piston? i should be ok to use the stock bore with its higher compression and stronger rod.

 
Rep Power: 266

I have heard of people using the gx pistons before im not sure of their results or what sort engine management they used but im sure it wasnt easy. if i was planning on the standard bore i would look into it a lot more with a 12:5:1 i believe comp ratio.

I would say that the oil pump is not necessary but my thinking is it mas made for stock application and this isnt one, larger bore high revving etc... so it cant really hurt to have a little better oil flow in there.

as for the cryo making the metals brittle this is try only if the person doesnt know what they are doing. if the metal is gradually cooled then return to norm it doesnt make it brittle it just make it a little harder and changes a few characteristics making it wear better.

I have been sending emails back and forth with the old one for a couple days and he is reluctant to work on or engines because of the bad lower geometry that i mention in a earlier post but i am making progress with him so i will update you with that when i can.

triz i have yet to find an answer to your question but i did find in someones NA build list on a b-series that they had a 1mm increase on intake and a 2mm!! on the exhaust sooo im not sure what to think on the issue now. I kind of have a theory that the intake velocity is important to maintain so too much of an enlarged valve could kill that but in the exhaust it should be more important to just get it out of the cylinder but that is just my unstructured theory.

i have also been looking into the ITB setup again and seriously thinking of making my own setup. 1 for some performance if i can figure out so obstacles and 2 for the awesome sound i would expect. After looking into ITB setups a little more i found that to make them help with power in anyway you have to make the volume in the velocity stack equal to the amount of air used in a combustion cycle ( or something along those lines). if its larger then the velocity slows and you get the same effect as an overly ported head. so the way i see it is that as long as i can stay away from making the velocity stack too large there will still be some benefit even if its not on the money with the best possible size. So this leads me on the quest of finding what type of motorcycle TB to use and if i stick to a honda setup would the throttle sensor match up any better. i plan on welding the TB to the D17 Injector plate so that i wont have to get different fuel rail and such. im going to see if i can find a formula or something to use with the ITB and to see what motorcycle TB's are supposed to do well in the homemade world. Thats the newest update. later guys

B

 
Rep Power: 388

Werds. Been to dseries.org?

Oh crap, how come I cant pull up that site... ****, looks like its been hacked... anyone know about that?

 
Rep Power: 0

triz, it looks fine to me... its at, http://http://www.d-series.org/forums//index.php?

 
Rep Power: 266

alright well the past week has been filled with stress and exams so i havent been able to look up a whole lot of information. I did go to d-series to look at there home itb stuff but alot of the links didnt work but i did find some places with useful information. The most helpful has been :http://www.team-integra.net/sections...?ArticleID=484
Although its based of a b-series (i think) it still give me some basic ideas on what dimensions would be needed for the setup. I guess if you use the honda cbr throttle bodies you dont have to worry about tps sensor because its supposed to be the same in all hondas and they have 35 or 37 mm TBs so that seems to be the best for our engine. Does anyone know the distance from the valve to the start of the IM? that and a general diameter of the Intake port? im really hoping to make this car have alot of low end as i have mentioned earlier so i will try to design the ITBs for a lower to mid powerband. im nowhere near finished looking up things for the ITBs but that is the little update on them.

I have also looked into the LX head Vs the EX head again and i am leaning towards keeping the lx head again. I say this because i believe that the vtec-e is going to work against me in the low to mid powerband. i say this because the way i understand it is that the A2 head has the 12 valve to 16 valve switchover which creates the economy swirl. While the lx head has the 16 valve at all times. going off that i would say that the A2 head is going to be more restrictive in lower and mid rpms. i know be staying with the A1 with the larger profile will make the car a little less friendly for DD but i think it would like it more. hopefully i can get a nice camshaft from the colt cams place that will help maintain the idle.

On a side note does anyone know if there is any truth in the rumor around of crower making an lx camshaft? or is it just talk around the campfire? also the other day i about crapped myself because i thought i found a production IM made by obx. The problem is that the website is "under construction" now. It was: http://www.tuningdepot.com/makersear...?&cid=2&page=4 but since the day after i found it the site has said that so i was all confused and looked around and couldnt find it anywhere else. It had models for turbo app. and NA app. and said that they were for the D17 motor so ya. im guessing it is just a D16 IM that they are trying to sell for the D17 but still it was an interesting find.

alright well i have to write a paper. Later

B

 
Rep Power: 388

I'd help u out on the head measurments of an A2 head, but I'm down at college, and mine is back at home. *snap!*

Dont forget about the runner length and everything. If I go ITB down the road, I'll design carbon fiber runners, and find a way to plug a filter on the end. But thats finishing touches compared to where everything is at now. It would be nice to tear apart one of thoes $1,000 k20 ITB's and modify the mechanicals for our engine. I sadly dont have that kinda money, and probably neither do you.

 
Rep Power: 266

don't worry i am well aware of all the different variables involved in the process. right now its seems that i will need a fairly long runner with anywhere from 30-40 mm bore on the valve. im not sure if i will be able to run a taper and everything but we will just have to see along with many other parts of the itb system. i have the same problem with being down at college. Its a 5 and a half hour drive to my house. i feel helpless without all my tools.

 
Rep Power: 266

i have been looking into camshafts as of the past 2 weeks. I am thinking about trying to sell my ghetto maxxim 17" rims and this flat panel 19" tv that isnt getting used. I am going to try and get enough money for some sort of fuel management(other than emanage, probably a vafc2) and a cam regrind. I know i should probably hold out and get a nice fuel management but im in college and havent got to work on my car for a little over a month. yes i know im addicted. ok so i have been looking into the specs that i want to base them off of about half way between the crower stage one and NA two specs.

I have a basic under standing of the way a camshaft can increase performance with valve lift height and duration. I am still a little confused on what certain parts of the profile mean but im still looking into it. I found these specs for the cam lobe height for the stock LX and EX engines:

Cam lobe height for D15Y2, D15Y3, D15Y5, D15Y6, D17A1, D17Z1 engines Intake 35.299 mm (1.3897 in.) -
Exhaust 37.281 mm (1.4678 in.)


Cam lobe height for D17A2, D17A5 engines
VTEC intake, primary 38.604 mm (1.5198 in.) -
VTEC intake, secondary 32.848 mm (1.2932 in.) -
VTEC exhaust 38.784 mm (1.5269 in.) -

Im not sure how these translate into valve lift yet or if that is in fact what they are right now but im still trying to find the info. I also have been looking at the profiles that Crower has listed on there site and none of them line up with what i have found. so im a little confused at this point.

From what i have found i want to increase the lift and the duration( less duration that lift increase). Problem with the increased lift is the risk of valve float and extra stress on the stock springs. Im still not sure if valve float would only occur if the rev limit was raised. Im trying to figure out at this point basically what is the max cam i can run without upgrading the valvetrain.

This is basically a little update to see if you guys can tell me more of the fine details while i continue to look around for more info. I will continue to look around and thanks for any input you guys have.

 
Rep Power: 388

Your going to want to upgrade the valve train, it is a weak point in our motors when trying to increase HP. Basically the stockers wont handle a rev limit increase, and they will struggle under adjusted duration and lift. Its only 300 bucks for the valve springs and retainers from crower- and you even have the benefit of using my video DIY from the summer to guide you through it!

Check out this classic video that explains how vtec works, it should help you visualize and translate the lift and duration numbers just a little better:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=AcT_ZyY3F0k

Oh, and I thought you wanted a LX cam regrind? If so, you wont have the secondary vtec lobe. In that case, you will be making the regular lobes more agressive- which will impact your fuel economy when just driving around town, and you wont have that second mode to flip over to when your car needs that extra power. Which is why I think you should go with the EX head swap. Now that I think about it, I dont know if the crower springs are going to work for your lx head- you'd have to hit up honda and ask the part numbers and see if they are the same. I'd look on majestic for you, but their inventory numbers are differnt from hondas part numbers, and when your messing with engine internals- you dont wanna trust some unlegit numbers.

BTW, I stuck your thread for more exposure!

 
Rep Power: 266

im curious if anyone knows the exacts on our vtec system. I know that we supposedly have the vtec-e which doesnt open all valves the same height to create a swirl in the combustion chamber. http://asia.vtec.net/spfeature/vtecimpl/vtec1.html this is where i get my vtec-e info. im curious as to the differences and if it really would help on the performance side. I am using the specs for the crower camshafts to get a rough idea of what i want to use for the lx regrind.i have also thought about the differences in the valvetrain. im hoping that supermex will find this because he has quite a bit of experience with the lx head and should be able to enlighten us. Im not going to go for the full camshaft right now. i am going to try and get a lower level profile for the time being so i can hopefully avoid lots of costs. I would like to try and get a new cam profile and fuel management before winter starts just for a little more fun. also i am aware of the lower economy and as long as there is some increase horsepower i will be happy. thanks for the help Triz

 
Rep Power: 323

I noticed a few details that should be adressed. The fact that you don't want to use crower ultralight rods,(because you dont want to rev that high) but you want to get your oil pump modded for high revs are contradictory. Save your money on the oil pump mod and get the rods. our longer stroke d17's are not going to be 9-9.5k revving engines. With a stage 2 cam/built engine you will see peak hp at around 8200-8500rpms. Rods IMO are a must for safety and reliability, dont cheap out on that part. The stock oil pump i think will be fine up to 8500 rpm. But you could check out what stock d16 pumps are capable of of on d series.org. There are lots of tuners that know kpro very well and very few that know ems well, for that reason i would say kpro is the way to go. Not to mention you can use my tune to get you close to what you will need. I think homemade itbs from a gsxr 1000 would be fine for a d17. and cheaper. check out some of the diys on honda tech.

 
Rep Power: 266

first the gx pistons where addressed once and with the larger bore i plan on will not work.

second i have been coming to the same conclusion with the rods and they have been becoming very necessary. im hoping the rumors of another company making rods that will be in the $500 range is true and will be availible by the time this build is set into place. if they are that will most likely be my choice for new rods.

third I will look at the other d-series oil pumps and see what they can handle. Im thinking that with the modified oil pump less chance of oil being consumed and just generally less wear on valvetrain. but i will look into it more.

fourth i had been leaning towards k-pro so its good to hear that it will most likely be the better choice. now with the itb setup. i have been leanign towards honda based bikes for throttlebodies just so i can use the tps sensor without modifing as much, i was told honda uses the same on bikes and car for tps voltage range. arent the gsxr1000 tbs like 51-53 mm (not sure)? wouldnt that be to large? from what i have found that would be too big. most my info is based off of here: http://www.team-integra.net/sections...les.asp?Show=1
I have been looking at the Cbr600 because of a little smaller tb 40mm (what i remember of hand) which would be better suited for the generally lower output of our engine but will need to be based off of what it will be after it is built which i would have no clue as to what it would be. i will check out the DIYs on honda tech thanks man. +1

and for the record filters will be used on the ITB setup when i get that far. i might use some sort of a airbox on the end of the throttle bodies to keep sound output down and for MAP sensor placement for easier tuning. havent looked into it much but it is an idea

thanks for all the input guys keep it coming.

 
Rep Power: 291

What kind of power difference would you see between a larger bore 11:1 compression vs stock bore and 12.5:1 compression pistons(aka GX)? If you just theoretically changed our pistons to the gx pistons how much power could be gained?

Keep up all the good work civic-driver. Im trying to sift through all the info and its taking some time to sink in. I would rep you but I need to spread some around first.

 
Rep Power: 0

^ I found this: http://www.bgsoflex.com/crchange.html

Granted it's really just a ball-park figure-probably WAAAAAAAY ball-park - but just something to think about.

For us A1s (using power from crank), we'd get 123 at the crank with the GX pistons. A2s get 135. The problem is that we don't know what to expect from the larger bore in interms of base HP

Us n00bs can use search engines too! XD

EDIT: Found another but can't calculate cause at work right now:

http://www.dmperf.com/compression.htm

 
Rep Power: 323

the problem i see with the gx pistons is the valve reliefs. will they clear a stage 2 or 3 cam? or will there be piston to valve contact. an aftermarket piston will definatly have the room. and on a street drivin sohc car 12.5 is a bit high. 11.5 would be a better safer choice.

 
Rep Power: 266

alright well like i had mentioned earlier i had been thinking about a lower regrind and some cheap fuel management. well i think i found a regrind between a stage one and two for 225 from a very reputable place( before i say there name i will wait for a confirmation from them) and a Vafc2 for 100 bucks.
my first question, should i have to worry about valve clearances( i know it depends on lift and such but i dont have all the specs yet) with the stock pistons?
my second question is would i be able to tune the car well enough with the Vafc2? im not familiar with it( or tuning anything for that matter) and am not sure if it runs off of fuel maps or is it just going through it and adding or subtract fuel at certain points on the device? my delima is that i want to install it myself but to get the right tools i would have to do it at home over my thanksgiving break which is about a week long then i would have to make the 5 hr drive back with whatever "tune" i could do by myself as there are no tuners in my small town. do you guys think i could getting it running well enough for the drive back to school? almost forgot, what is the best way to do a street tune? would it be necessary to buy a wideband for this project(not the larger one)? is there anyway to get a data chart of where is lean or stoich from the cars data port? could this all just be done with a normal A/F gauge? input is welcome

as to the piston compression i was thinking somewhere in the 11's. i was originally was thinking in the twelves but i guess it is a lot harder to get tuned safely.
another question i have is how much does altitude effect gas octane? i was told by a friend that likes muscle cars that in higher altitudes like here in colorado you can run a lower octane that what is recommended for your compression ratio. any comments on this?

thanks guys

 
Rep Power: 266

one more dumb question but the vafc2 will work even though i dont have vtec right? if it just dont connect the wire and set it to a passive mode it should be fine right? thanks

 
Rep Power: 388

Wow.. loaded post.

First question: piston/valve clearance
You shouldn’t have to worry. Its possible that they could make a grind that would throw your valve into your piston, but that’s unlikely. If your using after market pistons, you will have to worry a little more. This can be a little tricky to figure out. Although you will probably be running aftermarket springs, I don’t think you'll have to worry about these becoming a factor. If valve lengths are the same, and lift is the same, then it will be the same as stock- duration is the other factor that comes into play with the valves- but this is simply the amount of time the valve is held open vs closed. So- if its stock pistons, and stock lift, then you don’t have to worry. If its a different lift, then find out what’s the clearance between the stockers when lifted (opened) to begin with, and see what the clearance is. I'm sure you can find this in the downloadable repair manual under head specs or something.

Second question: tuning with the vafc2
From the build that I had envisioned that you would undertake, a vafc2 wont help you to any degree worth speaking of. If you just want a mild cam swapped in, then you should be fine. You wont be able to raise the rev limit, or put in fuel maps of course, but you shouldn’t need to kuz the stock ecu will correction for air/fuel to an extent. The vafc2 doesn’t have fuel maps, it just changes the signal that the stock ecu spits out. I cant think of a great analogy but say you have a valve that controls water flow--The end result you want is to have the water a different path, but you can only adjust the flow of the water, not where it goes. The vafc2 will only adjust the flow, and cannot totally change the map. So you probably will have problems with leaning out, or being too rich though out the curve. Just getting the vafc2 hooked up can be made easy with the dezod pnp harness which is around 120 bucks if I remember correctly. Your car should be completely drivable unless you go in and change the settings after hooking it up.

As for the octane vs altitude:
The higher up the hill you go, the less air there is- which results in less air pressure. Lower compression = lower octane requirement

You might also want to read this for more in-depth discussion of octane vs altitude: http://nvl.nist.gov/pub/nistpubs/jre...45.N02.A05.pdf

Link to vafc2 manual: http://www.apexi-usa.com/pdfInstallation/25.pdf



As for the other questions, I'll let someone else take those. The turbo guys are the ones to talk to about tuning these days.

 
Rep Power: 266

thanks for the info triz and dont worry i wont be sticking with the Vafc2 for very long. It will just be used on this mini build that i hope to get done before Christmas. the purpose to be for something to tinker on and to get a little more familiar with the insides of my car.So any more help with the street tuning? possible options on monitoring A/F and those other questions? thanks guys

 
Rep Power: 266

Headwork

P&P with Larger valve bore etc -$700-1000
Depending on company and level of porting either Endyn or KMS
http://theoldone.com/components/cyli...g_and_Menu.htm
http://www.honda-performance.com/services-porting.asp

conversion to vtec head and possible new engine-$300-600
complete head swap with new ecu buy off a wreck or new engine from wreck

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Camshafts Depending on Vtec vs Non

Vtec Head D17A2:

Stage 2 or 3 camshaft-$380 Crower
http://www.dezod.com/cat_camshafts.cfm

Non-Vtec Head D17A1:

Custom ground camshafts: $325-480 dollars Crower or Colt Cams , both have been emailed and will make a custom grind for our car
To B. Campbell,
Thank-you, for contacting us.
Sorry we have not seen this model as of yet.
However, I have been working with cams for over 25 years and designing
something new has always been my one of my passions.
A few questions need to be answered first on the valve train, example: solid
or Hyd lifters, roller or flat tappet, sohc or dohc etc.
We would need to see your cam first to determine what the stock lift and
duration is. At this point I can design something with you over telephone
that will suit what you're after as well as cost.
There is no charge if we can't do anything for you. We will also pay for
the return shipping back to you if this is the case.
If you are interested please give us a call at your convenience and I will
go over the details.
Thank-you,
Geoff Bardal
FOR OUR U.S. CUSTOMERS REGARDING SHIPPING
When sending in your cams, via any courier service or the post office.
Please put as the value of the cams to be under $10.00.
This falls under NAFTA and no duty charges will be inflicted on you.
Please put on the way bill as well as on the package.
"Damaged Camshaft for Repair and Return"
PAYMENT
We only accept International Money Orders in US funds made out to Colt Cams
Inc.
COLT CAMS INC.
#54 - 3347 262 nd Street
Langley, BC
V4W 3V9
TEL: (604) 856-3571
FAX: (604) 856-3572
www.coltcams.com
geoff1@coltcams.com
www.coltcams.com

Brent,
If it is going to be a custom grind you are going to have to send in the specs along with your cam. The price for that would be $100 and the motor that you have is a non vtec, the D17A2 is a vtec motor. the cams are different. We dont make cams for single cam non vtec honda motors. but if you can get the specs that you want for your cam, we can do it.



Thank You,

Marco Romero
Crower Cams & Equipment Co.
Phone (619) 690-7806
Fax (619) 661-6466

http://www.crower.com/cat/import/honda/cams/d17a2.shtml

Also Bisimoto might also be able to do a regrind for $225 im still waiting for a response.

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Spring and retainer-$300-350 Crower or Supertech http://www.dezod.com/cat_camshafts.cfm

Valves +.5 mm overbore set-$265 KMS performance
http://www.honda-performance.com/info-lv2.asp?id=312


so that brings to headwork with a vtec head to: $1995
headwork without vtec to : $2095
headwork and conversion to vtec : $2595

all without labor and shipping costs on some
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Bottom End


Sleeves-$250 Darton $750(installed by Darton)
http://www.darton-international.com/sl_import.htm
The only sleeves we have for the D17 blocks are the 300 Series open deck sleeves. The sleeves come for stock bore size and have a max bore of 77mm. You can go with a 78mm bore on the D16 block but the D17 is casted differently than the D16 so they would not use the same sleeves. The D17 300-011 sleeves take about a week to make and cost $250.00 for the set. Installation is an additional $500.00 and takes about 15- 20 days.

Let me know if you have any more questions.


Thanx,

John


John Catapang
National Sales Manager
Darton International, Inc.
2380 Camino Vida Roble Bldg. K
Carlsbad, CA. 92011

sales@DARTON-international.com
tel:
tel2:
fax:
800-713-2786
760-603-9895
760-603-9629


Pistons: $500-520 stock bore vs custom bore Wiseco

http://www.wiseco.com/Catalogs/Automobile.aspx

Brentt,
We can custom make the part for that bore and whatever compression you would like. Cost is approximately $139.36 each (includes rings,pins,clips and coated skirts) and it takes 4-5 weeks.
Best Regards,
Wiseco Piston Co. Inc.

Crankshaft lightening- $465 – KMS
http://www.honda-performance.com/ser...ning.asp#crank

Connecting Rods- $785 – Crower Maxilite
http://www.dezod.com/pd_crower_maxilite.cfm

there is a rumor of carrillo making a cheaper version for rods.

Shot peened and balanced connection rods- $135 if you don’t want aftermarket and just a little more insurance




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Fuel Managment
Standalone ECUs- $1000-2000 Hondata K-Pro or AEM EMS
Hondata depends on price of donor ecu
http://www.dezod.com/cat_engine_management.cfm
http://www.hondata.com/prices.html

Return line Kit with fuel pump upgrade:$650 Street Level Performance
http://www.streetlevelperformance.co...ion%20Kit.aspx ( this could also be pieced together for a little cheaper)

Larger Injecters-$100(used)- 546(new) RSX injectors
http://www.dezod.com/cat_honda_oem_parts.cfm


Intake manifolds or ITBs

ITB- $500- 3000 Danstoy, Hayward Performance Intake Systems, ExtrudaBody, DIY

http://extrudabody.com/Products/ITBs.html

http://www.haywardperformance.com/intake.htm#custom

Our custom ITB setup will run for 1,200.00. That is hardware only. We can either use Toyota 20 valve ITB's 40mm, 44mm or brand new TWM ITB's which are a little more pricier. You would also need to run a Full stand alone management.

Feel free to ask us any more questions if you have them

Jed
Manager of Danstoy
http://www.danstoy.net/products.html


Custom NA intake manifold- $1050-1250 Endyn

We haven't built one for the D17's. We have built a few D16 manifolds, however.
I'd have to see one of the stockers to tell you if we could do it.
Be prepared though....the fabbed manifolds run in the $1050-1250.00 range.

http://theoldone.com/components/

*all prices where what they quoted me a while ago so they dont represent what you could pay*

 
Rep Power: 266

well i guess i missed the header in my list i wrote up ... put down the wrong version... whoops ..... any way go here if you want a set: http://theoldone.com/components/head...ng_headers.htm
and it says that custom made ones start at $1375 and yes they are remarkable headers. production models start at $795 but there isnt one for the D17. it is possible you could get them straight from hytech but im not sure i havent contacted them

 
Rep Power: 266

well bisimoto finally emailed me back saying that they will do a custom ground level 1.5 for the LX. they said it would take 7-10 days once they receive a core. They didnt say a different price so im guessing normal d-series prices apply. I have to get my exhaust in order before i can get it so we will see when that happens. just wanted to let you guys know that that was another option and the price is good too.

 
Rep Power: 388

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