eddie1976

Hey folks...I have a sinking feeling this is going to set me back some money...hoping to get your "professional" opinion on this noise. The noise is coming from the left side of the engine as you are looking at it from the front.

Thanks!

Wankenstein

Sounds like it might be either the alternator bearing, a/c compressor bearing or power steering pump. Remove belts one at a time and spin by hand and assess for loose play.

eddie1976

Thanks. Doesn't sound like chain tensioner?

ezone

Is it the rattle noise? (I heard the AC and fans kick on, but the rattle was more suspicious)

Oil level is not low, oil isn't pitch black from lack of service?


You might remove the accessory belt and start the engine (extremely brief, only a matter of seconds should be necessary) just long enough to verify the noise is gone after the belt is removed.

(If the noise is still present then it's probably something internal inside the engine)

If the noise is gone then it must be caused by something using the accessory belt drive system. Your possible causes will be related to the alternator, water pump, AC compressor, power steering pump, and two idler pulleys.


You could then spin each individual pulley by hand, listening for rough bearings or bearing noise in each accessory pulley as it spins.

100k miles or more showing on the odometer?
Knowing what fails on these cars, I'd kinda expect the pulley on the AC compressor to be the one making noise.

eddie1976

Thanks ezone. Car has about 140k on it. I change the oil myself per the maintenance minder with full synthetic. I noticed some decrease of oil, about 1 quart low. This is the first time I have noticed a decrease in the oil. This car hadn't consumed any oil for the life of it. This sound has been around alot longer than this past oil change, so I doubt it is related to the low oil. I think messing with the belts and pulley's might be a bit more than I can undertake. It is pretty tight in there....

So, if its the AC pulley, can I wait til it fails without causing major issues? I just don't want it to be related to the chain.

ezone

It's not really tight if you have the appropriate tools available.
How about improvising a stethoscope, use it to locate the source of the noise?

It's ALREADY failed, whatever it is. You want to let it destroy something before fixing it?No matter what the source of the noise is, it's not good. A failure in either area (timing chain OR serpentine belt) could destroy the engine and leave you stranded.

eddie1976

Thanks. I have stethoscope. I will poke around tomorrow. Definitely don't want to destroy the car. It has lots of life left in it.

ezone

Worst case scenarios (IMO):

If a failure ends in timing chain breakage (while driving), severe engine damage is instant and you coast to a stop.

If a pulley failure while driving along causes the serpentine belt to break or come off, you may not notice immediately because the engine will continue to run..........but when the belt driven water pump quits turning you might have less than a minute to figure out there's a problem and get it shut off before the engine is severely overheated, which can cause a lot of damage.


In either case, you're stranded (according to TV commercials it will either be in the desert at high noon, or deep in crack-ville at midnight LOL), you have to get a tow truck, and you are looking at a much more expensive repair bill that could have been avoided.

eddie1976

I hear you....will poke around and make an appointment at the dealer. If it is the timing chain, I would want them to deal with it.

Will report back once I have listened to the car more carefully.

eddie1976

Checked it out this morning on a cold start. No noise at all. Seems that the noise is out of control when the temp is cooler. It was 55 this morning here.

ezone

So how cold was it when the noise DID occur?


Make notes of conditions when the noise is most likely to occur, so when it comes time for someone else to try to figure this out they can witness the noise occur in a timely fashion.
Also, that recording may help someone else to understand what noise YOU heard, if you can't be present to demonstrate and point out the issue in person.


Note ambient temperature
engine temperature and time running
and/or time spent driving until noise becomes noticeable
note how often the noise is noticed (you can't tell them "all the time")

Does the noise change as AC compressor cycles on and off? (strong indication of the pulley bearing failing, but no change doesn't necessarily mean it's not the problem)

eddie1976

It was between 40-45 when I did the recording. As I would say anything below 40 is a guarantee to hear the noise. On the day I made the recording, after the initial start up and running of the errands, I could not replicate the noise. I guessing because the ambient temp hit mid 60s. There doesn't seem to be any correlation between AC being on or off. I listened to the AC come on and off and could not hear the noise with the stethoscope.

Hoping for a cold day this week to check it out.

eddie1976

It was 40 this morning, started up the tractor/civic and listened to her carefully through the stethoscope. I could tell it didn't sound the same as my reference alternator from a 2004 civic. I could hear the harsh sounds coming from the alternator. I'm pretty sure it needs to be replaced. Now to find a DIY that I can follow.

Thanks for the help!

ezone

Before spending any money, you may want to slip the belt off and run it briefly to make sure

the noise is eliminated,

then spin each of the pulleys by hand, listening for roughness and noise and feel for unusual play.

eddie1976

good call. Is it as simple as loosening the wingnut and getting the belt off?

ezone

No, the 2010 uses a spring loaded automatic tensioner, and it's dampened by (the equivalent of) a small hydraulic shock absorber so it will only move very slowly, do not force it.

I use a short 19mm socket on an extra long bar to release it, but a regular wrench may work too.

eddie1976

Thanks. I will take a look this weekend. If I have to replace the alternator, what brand would you recommend? I looked at mag auto, a reman. honda is 270 + 70 core charge.

Autozone has brand new for 295 includes the core charge.

ezone

Your prices...Hondas is less...I'd trust it for sure.

Got a quality local auto electric rebuilder? (typically they would only do things like starters and alternators) That might be the lower cost choice.

In our shop when it comes to starters and alternators we push Genuine Honda parts of course, but usually also quote a price using local parts store remans as well and let the customer make the (hopefully informed) decision.
The parts store parts warranty doesn't include the labor to diagnose and replace their failed parts in our shop, we let the customer know that up front.

Sometimes a lifetime warranty isn't worth squat when you're stranded in deep in BFE and the shop in the middle of nowhere can't honor the part warranty on the part purchased back home (and you're always at least 500 miles away from home when it fails LOL).

(BTW, the alternator is almost out in the open, right on top of your engine and could probably be changed in 15 minutes or less.)


One employee I work with spent some time working for a local Dangerzone, and would never ever buy reman "rotating parts" (starters/alternators) from them.

eddie1976

So you would trust a re-manufactured alternator (honda) over a new one from say Denso or duralast that is new?

I know it is an easy job, will have to take care of it soon before things get worse.

ezone

I misread your prices. What's the basic price of the new one? (without core charge)

I'd skip the duralast. I'd probably choose between reman Honda or new Denso.
Wait....wasn't the OEM alternator made by Mitsubishi?



Have you figured out if the noise is really the compressor pulley bearing, not the alternator at all? LOL
I know I've done far more compressor related work than alternators here.

eddie1976

Yes, OEM is made by Mitsubishi and it is $400 online. The Denso I saw was about $200, but it is reman. The honda is $270 on mag auto (without the core).

I have not taken the belt off yet, I'm not sure if I have a long enough wrench and wife has had the car all weekend. But, listening to the sounds, most of the noise I could hear were from the alternator. When I listened to the alternator I could clearly hear the rattle or clacking coming from the alternator.

Like you said, I have to take the belt off and turn the pulley by hand.

Thanks!

CraigW

iTrader: (1)

My very trusted mechanic suggested Honda Re-man when asked a while back.

And yes.... try to find a local rebuilder.

Wankenstein

Junkyard (used) OEM.. maybe $30 to $40..can by 10 of those for the price of new.