gearbox

iTrader: (95)

wow i knew the 06+ civics had their issues, even more than previous 7thgens, but this takes the cake.

http://www.carcomplaints.com/Honda/C...ne_block.shtml

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

yep... that one is pretty bad

Devani

iTrader: (2)

it seems like it's only happening to R18's.....hope K series are better than those
---------
there's a TSB for the cracked block...K series engines are not affected by this....
only R18 06-08 Civic....

I hope my 09 SI is immune from all recalls and TSB's....none so far...

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

im sure the k-series is not affected, thats a tried and true engine already compared to a totally new one. it seemed from reading some of the posts that an exhaust pipe that is too close to the engine block without any heatshielding is causing the issue.

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

you would think the engine block would be able to sustain some heat though. At least without cracking. I guess it's the heating/cooling/heating/cooling that would do it though.

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

yeah i think so. and they all said its cracking at the same spot, right in the middle where the lines meet or something. dont forget about the oil leaks, water pump leaks, and all the other issues with this r18. what a mess. whatever happened to honda motors lasting forever... good thing they kept a K motor in the si or honda would be finished by now. even the si has its share of problems tho.

mf150

Obviously this is an issue with 2006 R18 motors...Do you think HOnda fixed this design defect in the newer models of the 8th gen?

are the K engines in the SOHCs or just the Si?

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

K motors are only in the SI. im not sure if they fixed the problem or not in later years, but im thinking not. it would have to be a complete engine redesign, because the tsb says to replace the engine, but that isnt gonna stop the issue from happening again. if there was an actual fix, it would be in the tsb.

mf150

I hope that is incorrect. I found a TSB for cracked R18s, but it was only for years 2006 - 2007. The TSB came out in 2008. So far as I can tell, the 2008s are okay.

mf150

I got this info from this thread: http://www.8thcivic.com/forums/mecha...all-trims.html

If you scroll down, click on the zip file ("all tsbs").

jgg204

i believe the cause is from a porous epoxy. Honda's quality really has plumetted from 2001+ across the board for all of their vehicles. not only did they drop the ball on the 7th gen Civic, but the 2002/2003 Honda Accord, their flagship model, had a massive auto-trans recall.

here is where the 2006 cracked engine block currently stands on Car Complaints: http://www.carcomplaints.com/Honda/C...ne/index.shtml

if you check out their latest gen Accord, you will find that the 2008 model year (the first year of production of the the current gen) is actually ranked #2 for vehicles with the most complaints, mainly due to blatantly poor brake design that caused brake pads to wear out between 5,000-8,000 miles:

ranking: http://www.carcomplaints.com/top_vehicles.shtml

#2 - 2008 Honda Accord
#5 - 2003 Honda Accord
#6 - 2001 Honda Civic
#11 - 2002 Honda Accord


it's astonishing that Honda vehicles have taken such a steep drop in quality at the turn of the century. while all manufacturers are implementing cost savings throughout their vehicle lineups (mainly by making interiors plastic), most manufacturers are increasing their quality. Honda seems to be on the decline, which in my opinion can be attributed to new competition from Hyundai and Kia. these Korean manufacturers never really posed much of a problem before, but starting in 2004/2005 time they started to roll out some fairly decent vehicles. Hyundai/Kia's initial target market were consumers who are accustomed to the quality of an asian car, but want to pay less for their vehicle. enter Hyundai which consistently sells their vehicles for thousands less than Honda and Toyota, while also slapping a better warranty on their products. Honda's sales started to slip, and thus their profits shrunk, so they had to make up for it somehow so they went on a Value Engineering purge across the board on all of their products. well, as we can all see, the end result of that measure was disastrous. recently, Hyundai has started targeting German imports with their new Genesis sedan. my educated guess would be that it's only a matter of time before Hyundai develops their own luxury brand. i think Kia will be merged into Hyundai (currently Hyundai owns Kia but it's wasteful to have to market 2 brand names), and then a luxury brand will be born within the next 5 years

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

this is true. i still regret not going with a used 99-00 civic at the time. older hondas (pre 2001) were bulletproof.

witeshark17

I just joined and have a quick question: of all the owners with 2006 - 2008 Civics with the R18 engine, are there many that have had no block cracking issues with hard use? Is there any pattern that suggests keeping the oil changed and coolant level up that helps?

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

it seems to be an actual defect in workmanship or materials, so driving style or maintenance will not really change the outcome.

witeshark17

Thanks for the reply. The dealership here seems confident that my car is fine.

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

yeah they wont really fix it til the crack happens and engine dies anyway. until then just enjoy the car. hopefully you still have some warranty left.

witeshark17

Yeah, so I hope... From what I've read, it's not a design issue, but a number of bad castings. Many Civics in the production range are running fine. Btw, is there any data known about block crack expectations based on either miles or time?

witeshark17

Has anyone had issues after getting a new short block? Is there any hint that some dealers have used block sealant to close smaller cracks?

johng35

I just got my letter from Honda extending the engine block waranty to 8 yrs with no milage limit.
Dated august 2010.

Guess this is a real issue and not just rumors if Honda had to address it.

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

good thing they are trying to take care of their customers this time around.

witeshark17

Yeah, it seems they're gonna handle it.

CraigW

iTrader: (1)

I thought the R18 was an Acura motor at one point ?? Lower trim RSX ??

witeshark17

AFAIK it's an all new Civic engine.The last Acura 1.8's I know of had timing belts and as we know the R18 has a chain and iVtec.

CraigW

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for the clarification, I love the extra power that my R18 has compared to my D17A1.

Thanks again.

Daudy

hi do you have a copy of the letter. how did you get it? My engine just cracked on Friday.

dmonroe

For what its worth, the engine block on my '08 civic cracked about a week ago. I noticed it was running hot and immediately added some 50/50 from the closest station and it was good for about a day until it started again. I kept it topped off for a week until I could take it in to get checked, and sure enough hey found a crack.

I'm not the original owner but its being replaced as part of the recall/warranty repair this week.

08 civic LX, about 57k miles with the last 30k driving between Phoenix and Tucson over the last 6 months in summer.

jordan1794

I have a 2006 civic lx...
I driving pretty conservative...usually...

But when I don't, I REALLY don't(cracked 100+ more than a few times)

I haven't had any issues with my civic at all...

For what it's worth I change the oil every 3,000 miles...

ezone

Honda bulletin 10-048; Warranty extension for cracked block; applies to Civic 1.8 engines (NOT SI or Hybrid), covers ALL 06-08 and SOME 09 model years (09 has a VIN break); 8 YEARS/UNLIMITED MILEAGE.
Dealer must run a VIN status inquiry to determine eligibility.
Newest revision of the bulletin up to now is June 17, 2011

Honda will replace the engine block, the head if necessary, and all the other little stuff that melted when it overheated (coils and dipstick, etc.). I have replaced one leaking radiator along with the engine job too, under this warranty extension.

The block can crack on the front where everyone can see it, and the block can crack on the back in the oil separator area where nobody can see it. I have only seen them crack on the front thus far.

Honda won't replace anything until the problem actually happens. Not all of them do it, apparently.

The warranty is on the car, not the owner. It doesn't matter if you are the 10th owner. As long as the VIN inquiry report says the VIN is eligible, it is covered for the period of the extension.

JMO: Changing the oil has absolutely nothing to do with this problem, I don't care how often it gets changed.

IMHO, the problem is mostly related to thermal cycling of a thin casting. Driving habits have had nothing to do with the problem AFAIK, as long as the engine hasn't overheated. I have replaced them anywhere from 50k to well past 150k miles.
If the driver runs the engine until it quits (melts down), that makes it far easier to order parts ahead of time since I don't have to remove and inspect the cylinder head, just order it and replace it. I can't drive the car to make any evaluation before the job starts, though.

If the car has trans issues, now would be the time to get that taken care of while the drivetrain is out of the car. I have had a couple of higher mileage units that needed a torque converter (shake/shudder/judder), but I couldn't tell that ahead of time, because the car was undriveable when it was received at the shop. Kind of sucks, because now that owner would have to pay to do the entire job instead of just the price of the part and its installation (in this example).

Not all of us dealer techs are out to retire off of you and your car.

HTH

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

good info. do you know if the new engine blocks actually fix the original problem? or is it like the 7thgen trans tsb where they just say replace the trans with another one that will eventually have the same problem down the road.

ezone

It is my understanding that the replacements are the same as late 09 and newer 1.8 engines, the ones that the warranty extension doesn't apply to. I have been told they have a thicker casting than the original. At any rate, I haven't seen any with repeat issues.

The replacement block also comes with a new water pump and tensioner bolt, among other things, that should cover any questions about the water pump recalls. Plus a whole shopping list of new hardware for almost everything big that gets disassembled during the job (subframe bolts, motor mount bolts, etc.) listed in the bulletin. The bulletin also has pictures of the areas that leak, in color. (I can't link the bulletin, it's on the Honda ISIS site and you would need a subscription to see it there.)

HTH