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Hey guys, new to the Honda scene. Just got married and inherited my wife’s 93 civic ex with d16z6 Long story short something caused it to overheat and warp head but still ran fairly well except under load it would buck and had lack of power.
I removed the head and took to a machine shop which confirmed it was warped and resurfaced it.
Re-installed the head after replacing water pump, thermostat, timing belt, valve seals, and intake/exhaust/head gaskets. Turned it over by hand multiple turns at crankshaft to insure valves would not hit after setting timing and all was good. Went to start it and it caught for about 4 seconds...then died out and will not even get close to starting again. Did not hear any valves hit. It has spark, fuel and air. Checked the timing again and it’s still where I set it but the belt was slightly loose...haven’t done a compression check but will shortly.

Are there any wires/hoses that I could have missed hooking back up that would keep the engine from being able to run? I never disconnected the plug wires from the distributor cap, just pulled the whole thing and re-installed the same way it was.

When I put the camshaft and rocker assembly back on the head I didn’t adjust the valves, was going to do that later. I just simply bolted the whole thing back down the way it was when I took it off and torqued to spec.

How sensitive is timing on this motor? I mean I know I’m not completely stupid but the timing marks being within an 1/8” is enough to at least get the car running somewhat right? even worse cause scenario that the block warped, it was still running and driving before I dug into it so I feel like I should be getting something.

Any help much appreciated my wife needs her car back asap
-Paul

 
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Did you reconnect the ground from the body to the head?

 
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From this info it sounds like a crank but no start issue. If that's the case try starting it with the gas pedal fully depressed (WOT). I had to do this on a D16Y8 after a head gasket + TB kit replacement. If that doesn't work try using starter spray in TB while cranking.
Also, ensure the firing order is correct.

Would be good to do valves adjustment first before proceeding further. It takes around 30 minutes or less and when it's done there's one less variable.

 
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Thanks guys for the quick response.
Update: finally got it running. Turns out it was off a tooth on the timing belt because I thought I was lining it up with a line on the pulley but it was just a nic in the metal.....lol

New problem now though is super rough timing at idle 🙄 trying to go down the checklist now so open to suggestions. No CEL and it runs great reved up and when cold, just wants to stall after warm up. Cleaned the IAC and no change.
I’ll update if I find out what it is.
Thanks for the help, I’ve only ever used the jeep forum and those guys werent near as helpful off the bat haha

 
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Just to confirm...when you set the mechanical timing at TDC you:
* matched the timing gear mark to the arrow stamped on the block (near oil pump).
* Notches in cam even with top of the cylinder head?
* Used the last ( most separated) timing mark on the crank pulley
* Aligned crank pulley timing mark (mentioned above) and cam notches (mentioned above) via the "V" site mark on lower timing belt cover
* Manually rotated crank 6 times counter clockwise to ensure timing Mark's align and that the spring loaded auto-tensioner is holding proper belt tension

If the above was done correctly then check ignition timing with a timing light and bypassing the service connector if not already performed.

Did you clean the IACV gasket screen too?
Do you have a data scanner to check fuel trims and o2 voltage and sensors?

Try idle air screw adjustment procedure per service manual.
Does your engine have a FITV?

 
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If you mean the timing mark jumps all over the place, you gotta install a jumper wire (paper clip) in the SCS connector before checking timing.

 
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Wow I need to dig into it a little more and confirm what you’re saying should be checked.
As far as the mechanical timing goes I originally lined up the gunsight with a line on the crank pulley that was roughly an inch away all by itself from the 3 lines all very close together with a red being the center line and it wouldn’t start. I’ve now lined it up with the red line and yes after turning the motor over 6 times counter clockwise it only barely moved to the left line about 1/8” away. The car started but is idling rough still currently.
Not sure if I have FITV, I’ll check this afternoon.
I did not see a screen anywhere with the IACV....just a probe sticking into the intake.
No I do not have a data scanner but wouldn’t it be somewhat alright if it’s running well at high idle?

 
Rep Power: 210

The line (shown in pic below as "A") that is seperated from the 3 grouped lines is the mechanical timing mark. The three grouped ones are for ignition timing. The mechanical timing mark on the pulley is really just an external mark (outside of timing belt cover) that correlates with the timing gear mark and arrow/pointer in the next paragraph and shown (2nd picture) below.





You mentioned you replaced the timing belt which involves removing the crank pulley. Behind the crank pulley is the timing gear (shown in pic below) the timing belt wraps around. There is an arrow/pointer ("B") stamped on the block. There's a timing mark notch ("A") on the gear too. When the first cylinder is at TDC the notch on the gear should be aligned with the arrow on the block. Did you make sure that before you installed the crank pulley that the abovementioned was aligned correctly?



IACV and FITV (if applicable) cleaning: https://honda-tech.com/forums/honda-...tv-tb-1844067/

 
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I’m pretty positive I did exactly that but maybe messed a step up...here’s what I did:

-lined up crankgear mark with arrow on block
-lined up camshaft gear marks level with head with “UP” on up
-installed timing belt
-tightened tensioner
-turned crankshaft counterclockwise 6 rotations
-loosened tensioner
-put counterclockwise pressure on crankshaft just enough to get belt tight on tensioned side, held in place and tightened tensioner
-installed crank pulley with keyway properly
-tightened pulley bolt
-installed belts, tried to start car and it wouldn’t
-noticed the 3 lines on crank pulley and adjusted the belt over one tooth on camshaft gear
-now with cam gear marks all at top dead center and gunsight pointing at left line of the 3 close together lines on crank pulley, the car has started but is running rough

Also how to do you turn the camshaft with the belt off? Is there a special tool? When I try by turning the 12mm bolt it just tightens it and won’t turn the whole shaft

 
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By your description it sounds like all mechanical timing marks are in line at 1st cylinder TDC. Running roughly?...did you set igition timing per service the manual as Ezone and I mentioned previously?
If you or a prior owner notched (chisel) a mark on the distributor housing and cylinder head for a timing reference and you aligned those notches after timing belt install that should be suffice. However since you didn't mention that then I'm assuming there it's never been done. Notch only after ignition timing set per service manual (pic below)




Why are you trying to turn the camshshaft if all timing marks are aligned?

 
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This sounds like he timed it on the ignition marks, not the TDC mark.

OP probably needs to set crank on the TDC mark (that single slash an inch away from the group of three) and recheck cam pulley position.

IF IT NEEDS CORRECTED
Don't turn the cam using its pulley bolt.
Move the crank until the cam is positioned wherever it needs to be, then remove timing belt and move crankshaft by ONE tooth or whatever.

 
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Not sure how I missed that..thanks Ezone.

Sounds like when he initially installed the belt he did use the TDC line (Reply #7):
"As far as the mechanical timing goes I originally lined up the gunsight with a line on the crank pulley that was roughly an inch away all by itself from the 3 lines all very close together with a red being the center line and it wouldn’t start."

 
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Alright guys I did what you said and put belt back one tooth so it now lines up again with TDC line (line all by itself on crank pulley) and I’m back to no starting same as before.

I did previously mess with the distributor rotating it from one end to the other and everywhere in between within it’s slots and it made little difference. There were no chisel marks made anywhere that I could see.

Sorry if this is a dumb question but what exactly is the purpose of the ignition marks on crank pulley if that’s not true TDC? Is there a difference in jumping teeth on crank vs cam pulley when adjusting mechanical timing or will either one keep the right ratio?

 
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It's science: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignition_timing

I have a strong feeling you may need to go all the way back to inspecting whether or not the cam gear, stamped ponter and 1st cylinder TDC is in alignment but first wait until Ezone replies.

 
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EACH mark has a specific purpose. See your service manual under timing belt replacement, and see the section on ignition timing.



Nope.

Don't wait up for me, I had a big dinner out with family and now I'm all sleepy.....and I have to work in the AM.

Mechanical timing must be perfect following the appropriate service manual (before ignition timing can be set up and checked), that might even include making sure the pulleys are indexed (keyed) to their corresponding shafts as designed.
If the cam gear slipped a partial turn on the cam, do you think the valves are gonna open and close at the right times?


I haven't seen mention of compression test results, and I haven't seen OP say the valve adjustment has been done. BEFORE you do these, the mechanical timing needs to be perfect.

 
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Okay I’ll go back through and re-check TCD alignment with cam gear and cam shaft. I did separate those two parts back when I had everything broke down when the head was off.
Sorry im slow to respond...just found out my diesel truck has leaky injectors quoted at $2200 repair 🙃
I’ll be sure to update when I get around to it.
Thanks for the help though guys can’t tell you how much I appreciate it

 
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I've seen a loose (insufficient torque) cam gear bolt allow the gear to beat the hell out of its keyway so it no longer indexes to the camshaft in the correct position, and it doesn't take much of a change to make one run like poo or not run at all.

Same goes for the crank gear keyway.

Just thinking of weird stuff that it's easy to make a mistake on during a big job like that.

 
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And just to add to this: OP: just to clarify..you are using the (1st) cylinder closest to the crank pulley at TDC ? Also, are you using a long screwdriver or other object to find the 1st piston's top-of-travel?

 
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Okay I’m back finally. After I get home from work I’m going to dive in and check everything from the beginning to be sure mechanical timing is set right. I’m also going to pick up compression gauges and a timing light on the way to use after.

Been studying over the service manual and just want to be sure of something- I’ve been leveling the TDC cam marks with surface of the head but according to this it’s saying for my d16z6 I should be using the lower mark on cam with arrow on timing cover? Which one should I be setting it to?

 
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And yes, I have been checking that in conjunction with timing marks throughout everything

 
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The one it says is for your specific engine?

 
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Yeah that was a dumb question sorry...

Is this the connector under the glove box? Why do you need to jump wires?

 
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Read: http://my.prostreetonline.com/2014/0...nition-timing/

After you set the ignition timing use a grease marker or chisel and notch in a mark on the distributor's base + cylinder head for ease of future reference.

 
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Well guys I went back and checked everything. Pulleys are both lined up right on their keyway. Moved the belt over so that now it is definitely on the TDC line on the crank pulley. Cam is where it needs to be. It started up and runs but still very poorly and stalls when I put it into gear. Seems like the belt looses a bit of tension after I run the motor but other than that I’m really at a loss. Hate to say it but I’m probably going to have to take it in to a shop. I just simply don’t have time while working 72hrs a week. I really appreciate all the advice you guys have given and I’ll be sure to update when the problem is found

 
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Did you set ignition timing?
Valves adjustment?

 
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I did not do ignition timing. The link you gave me mentioned not to go further if it’s idling rough and believe me it’s running really rough, barely stays running. Did not adjust valves because I don’t have feeler gauges. Compression test was good though

 
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Yes, and it is done to disable computer controlled timing (revert to base timing) so the ignition timing can be set correctly.

Whaaaaar is your service manual?
And it can sure run like crap if you don't do it. Doing these things correctly is pretty damn important.

Valve adjustment is critical too. Tight valves can cause all sorts of trouble.

Did you get the firing order wrong? Wires incorrectly ordered around the dist cap?

 
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Okay I’ll give it one more shot today and check ignition timing. But just to be clear...even after setting mechanical timing perfect it can still run like absolute ****/barely at all without ignition timing set right? I was just figiuring that if mechanical timing was good it would at least run and maybe just be a slightly off at idle.
Yes I have my service manual but it’s a pdf version and couldn’t find the section on ignition timing at first.
Firing order for plug wires are exactly the same on distributor as they were before I ever pulled the heads. Haven’t touched them. They’re all going to correct cylinders and I double checked rotor position at #1 TDC

 
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Head* this isn’t my v8 lol

 
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Also forgot to ask, are there any sensors I need to be checking? They were all fine before I started this project but who knows