Are our Civics really safe? Real world findings...
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Just Be
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Are our Civics really safe? Real world findings...
Looks like a new study conducted by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety shows that Civics models 2000-2002 don't reflect the "Top Pick" rating designated by the IIHS. Below is a table taken from www.iihs.org
ALL SMALL Injury Collision Theft
133 132 221
Volkswagen New Beetle 79 85 41
Volkswagen Golf 91 127 116
Saturn SC 117 96 37
Ford Focus 124 125 64
Acura RSX 137 211
Toyota Celica 138 168 164
Mitsubishi Eclipse 139 137 163
Honda Civic coupe 150 138 104
Hyundai Accent 151 109 55
Ford Escort 165 126 75
Mitsubishi Mirage 204 155 156
What we're looking at is the first column of numbers -- which represent losses due to injury. (The lower the #, the safer) The Civic is rated SUBSTANTIALLY below average. What gives? According to the table, the New Beetle is the best.
ALL SMALL Injury Collision Theft
133 132 221
Volkswagen New Beetle 79 85 41
Volkswagen Golf 91 127 116
Saturn SC 117 96 37
Ford Focus 124 125 64
Acura RSX 137 211
Toyota Celica 138 168 164
Mitsubishi Eclipse 139 137 163
Honda Civic coupe 150 138 104
Hyundai Accent 151 109 55
Ford Escort 165 126 75
Mitsubishi Mirage 204 155 156
What we're looking at is the first column of numbers -- which represent losses due to injury. (The lower the #, the safer) The Civic is rated SUBSTANTIALLY below average. What gives? According to the table, the New Beetle is the best.
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Just Be
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Rep Power: 0 That idea is flawed. The rigidity of a door has nothing to do with the way a car manages crash energy, it just says that car has well-designed hinges/hardware. My grandpa's 99 Ford Explorer's doors feel RIGID as a steel wall when you shut it, no panel vibration or roof deflection, yet take a look at its crash results. Injuries can result from manythings, including the way a car manages the crash energy and how the passengers collide with various materials in the car and the design of those materials, etc. I believe the Civic is (if not MORE) AS structurally sound as the Beetle, and this has to do with the beetle having a high roofline and tall door sills. Also it could be due to the fact that the Beetle may come with SAB standard where as only a very small # of civics have SAB. Who knows?
Last edited by MangoEX; Oct 25, 2003 at 02:04 AM.
Originally posted by Boilermaker1
Go shut the door on a Volkswagen. Then go shut the door on your Civic... I think you'll have your answer on that one.
Go shut the door on a Volkswagen. Then go shut the door on your Civic... I think you'll have your answer on that one.
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What you don't realize is the ratio of car sales to accidents. Naturally the civic will have more accidents and death/injury ratios only because there are so many more of them on the street. What you want to look at are the crash test ratings. When I bought mine in December of 2000, I looked at the crash test ratings and the civic was the top contender. Not that I really cared, but just some food for thought. Those numbers you brought up are really deceptive. Like I said, look up the crash test ratings.
PS...the reason the new beetle got so high is because .... seriously would you buy one? hahahaha Not very many of those POS' on the street when compared to civics.
PS...the reason the new beetle got so high is because .... seriously would you buy one? hahahaha Not very many of those POS' on the street when compared to civics.
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Originally posted by phatcyclist
huh?, I dont have a VW but im guessing your talking about the sound the doors make. As for that remark, I dont think it really accounts for saftey that much, as much as s says how much the door weighs. Ill be quite honest with you, ive heard or been in accidents in diffetent cars, and the funny thing is, the crash test data has never correlated with the results. My friend hit a deer in a mustang at 65 MPH, spun out, it an iron fence and then slammed into a tree, walked away without a bruise or scrath, it was a 99mustang, and those have shitty ratings, so I dont relly listen to those things anymore.
huh?, I dont have a VW but im guessing your talking about the sound the doors make. As for that remark, I dont think it really accounts for saftey that much, as much as s says how much the door weighs. Ill be quite honest with you, ive heard or been in accidents in diffetent cars, and the funny thing is, the crash test data has never correlated with the results. My friend hit a deer in a mustang at 65 MPH, spun out, it an iron fence and then slammed into a tree, walked away without a bruise or scrath, it was a 99mustang, and those have shitty ratings, so I dont relly listen to those things anymore.
The thing that that test really doesn't sort out is how many bad accidents were included. If you think about how many ricers flip or total Civics and how many Coffee house wienies do the same to Jettas and Beetles, sure the VW number will be lower. I do agree that most of these numbers are crap... but I still say that VWs are better built cars and that is gonna help a bit.
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Rep Power: 348 I'm not too sure what everyone else is looking at but I see the Civic faired better than most in the same category...
The only reason the Civic is in the average range is because they included luxery cars in the test which brought the average higer...
The only reason the Civic is in the average range is because they included luxery cars in the test which brought the average higer...
I sure wish my car was newer
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Rep Power: 366 YOU GUYS ARE ALL MISSING THE REASON
Think about the people on this site who drive their Civics like they're F1 cars. You can think of quite a few, right? Now think of everyone you've ever seen driving a Beetle. Can you think of anyone who you think is gonna be racing that thing like they're crazy? With the exception of the Turbo Beetle, the answer is a firm "no."
You have to think about who is buying the cars and how those people are driving the cars.
Civics are for young guys and old ladies.
Beetles are for gay guys, ditzy girls, ditzy women, and did I mention gay guys?
Think about the people on this site who drive their Civics like they're F1 cars. You can think of quite a few, right? Now think of everyone you've ever seen driving a Beetle. Can you think of anyone who you think is gonna be racing that thing like they're crazy? With the exception of the Turbo Beetle, the answer is a firm "no."
You have to think about who is buying the cars and how those people are driving the cars.
Civics are for young guys and old ladies.
Beetles are for gay guys, ditzy girls, ditzy women, and did I mention gay guys?
Originally posted by Boilermaker1
Go shut the door on a Volkswagen. Then go shut the door on your Civic... I think you'll have your answer on that one.
Go shut the door on a Volkswagen. Then go shut the door on your Civic... I think you'll have your answer on that one.
I think that has to do with the country of origin. Go shut the door on any german car, and then a japanese car....and there's your answer.
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Rep Power: 348 Is the coupe offered in Japan?
That might be the thing. The Civic (platform) is designed for a sedan than modified to be a coupe, and every other small car that Honda uses.
That might be the thing. The Civic (platform) is designed for a sedan than modified to be a coupe, and every other small car that Honda uses.
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Rep Power: 345 i can the beetle being the safest. One of my old friends got railed from behind by a girl in a new beetle with his Subaru Impreza. She hit us doin about 40 and we were just about stopped at a light turning. His car was totaled, the rear quaters went under the doors, the bumper was practicly on the ground still attached to the car. And the beetle....a cracked licence plate frame, no joke either i'm 100% serious, there was nuthing else damaged to the car be sides the licene plate frame, and some scratches on the bumper.
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Rep Power: 0 you know why racecar drivers survive crashes when they hit a wall going a buck twenty? Because the rest of the car basically blows up, around the occupant, which means there is less energy to be absorbed by the person inside the car. SO, a car that doesn't take any damage in an accident is a bad thing, that means that ther person is left to absorb most of it.
For a simpler analgy, think of it this way, if you hit a wall, and you were in a solid steal cube, which doesn't deform at all... all the energy of the crash will be transfered into your seatbelt, and then into your body, causeing you auorta to rip away from your heart.
NOW, if you crash in a car that crumples like a ****, which means that the energy is transfered over a longer time (still very short) you take a little less energy over a longer time, so, your body isn't as effected.
If bullets bounced off of bullet proof vests, you'd suffer much worse injuries then if they just absorbed the shot like they do now.
If anyone's taked a physics class they usually go over this sort of thing.
For a simpler analgy, think of it this way, if you hit a wall, and you were in a solid steal cube, which doesn't deform at all... all the energy of the crash will be transfered into your seatbelt, and then into your body, causeing you auorta to rip away from your heart.
NOW, if you crash in a car that crumples like a ****, which means that the energy is transfered over a longer time (still very short) you take a little less energy over a longer time, so, your body isn't as effected.
If bullets bounced off of bullet proof vests, you'd suffer much worse injuries then if they just absorbed the shot like they do now.
If anyone's taked a physics class they usually go over this sort of thing.
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Thats why I laugh at people when they say that they are safer in trucks and SUV's... Full frame vieichles Suck *** for crash safty. your safer in your civic then you would be in an Escalade....
Unibody chassis with crumple zones RULE!
I worked in the colision repair industry for many years and My parents still own a body shop, Ive seen some serious wrecks, but its always the cars that crumpled the most that had the least occupant injury.
Thats why I laugh at people when they say that they are safer in trucks and SUV's... Full frame vieichles Suck *** for crash safty. your safer in your civic then you would be in an Escalade....
Unibody chassis with crumple zones RULE!
I worked in the colision repair industry for many years and My parents still own a body shop, Ive seen some serious wrecks, but its always the cars that crumpled the most that had the least occupant injury.
Last edited by Zzyzx; Oct 25, 2003 at 10:02 PM.
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Rep Power: 0 my bro wrecked his civic hb at 120 and walked away he went off the road when a women cut him off he hit a colvert adn flew about 10 ft in the air i was behind him and i saw it we pulled over thinking he was hurt and he got out causing at the women for cutting him of when he was trying to pass adn he got the ticket for not maintaning lane when she went all the way in his lane ive seen mustangs wreck at half that speed and get twice the damage
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Rep Power: 330 Originally posted by j-jolly
my bro wrecked his civic hb at 120 and walked away he went off the road when a women cut him off he hit a colvert adn flew about 10 ft in the air i was behind him and i saw it we pulled over thinking he was hurt and he got out causing at the women for cutting him of when he was trying to pass adn he got the ticket for not maintaning lane when she went all the way in his lane ive seen mustangs wreck at half that speed and get twice the damage
my bro wrecked his civic hb at 120 and walked away he went off the road when a women cut him off he hit a colvert adn flew about 10 ft in the air i was behind him and i saw it we pulled over thinking he was hurt and he got out causing at the women for cutting him of when he was trying to pass adn he got the ticket for not maintaning lane when she went all the way in his lane ive seen mustangs wreck at half that speed and get twice the damage
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Rep Power: 0 Originally posted by Renamazazo
you know why racecar drivers survive crashes when they hit a wall going a buck twenty? Because the rest of the car basically blows up, around the occupant, which means there is less energy to be absorbed by the person inside the car. SO, a car that doesn't take any damage in an accident is a bad thing, that means that ther person is left to absorb most of it.
For a simpler analgy, think of it this way, if you hit a wall, and you were in a solid steal cube, which doesn't deform at all... all the energy of the crash will be transfered into your seatbelt, and then into your body, causeing you auorta to rip away from your heart.
NOW, if you crash in a car that crumples like a ****, which means that the energy is transfered over a longer time (still very short) you take a little less energy over a longer time, so, your body isn't as effected.
If bullets bounced off of bullet proof vests, you'd suffer much worse injuries then if they just absorbed the shot like they do now.
If anyone's taked a physics class they usually go over this sort of thing.
you know why racecar drivers survive crashes when they hit a wall going a buck twenty? Because the rest of the car basically blows up, around the occupant, which means there is less energy to be absorbed by the person inside the car. SO, a car that doesn't take any damage in an accident is a bad thing, that means that ther person is left to absorb most of it.
For a simpler analgy, think of it this way, if you hit a wall, and you were in a solid steal cube, which doesn't deform at all... all the energy of the crash will be transfered into your seatbelt, and then into your body, causeing you auorta to rip away from your heart.
NOW, if you crash in a car that crumples like a ****, which means that the energy is transfered over a longer time (still very short) you take a little less energy over a longer time, so, your body isn't as effected.
If bullets bounced off of bullet proof vests, you'd suffer much worse injuries then if they just absorbed the shot like they do now.
If anyone's taked a physics class they usually go over this sort of thing.
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Rep Power: 0 Originally posted by Zzyzx
^^^^ EXACTLY!^^^^
Thats why I laugh at people when they say that they are safer in trucks and SUV's... Full frame vieichles Suck *** for crash safty. your safer in your civic then you would be in an Escalade....
^^^^ EXACTLY!^^^^
Thats why I laugh at people when they say that they are safer in trucks and SUV's... Full frame vieichles Suck *** for crash safty. your safer in your civic then you would be in an Escalade....
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Rep Power: 0 The reason why the "heavier car will win" is because it doens't get slowed down as much, therefor the occupant isn't thrown into the windshield as hard.
For a simple analgy, think of a fly flying towards an semi truck, the trunk will not be slowed down at all, so the driver will not fly out of his seat. WHILE the fly will end up going backwards....
No, replace the fly with the civic, lets say the civic is going about 60, and the semi is going 60, they have a head on collision. Now the semi will probably be going about 45ish if it had a full load, while the civic wil be going 45 in the other direction, so the effective crash speed for the civic was 105 mph, while the semi was about 15. Even if the civic drives car wasn't totally crushed, they'd be dead anyway because their internal orgrans would be all torn up from the sudden change of direction. THAT is why the bigger car wins, is because it has less of a directional change. Now if you hit an immovable object, such as a 10 foot thick concrete wall, the smaller car will probably fair better since it has less mass to slow down in comparison to a semi...
For a simple analgy, think of a fly flying towards an semi truck, the trunk will not be slowed down at all, so the driver will not fly out of his seat. WHILE the fly will end up going backwards....
No, replace the fly with the civic, lets say the civic is going about 60, and the semi is going 60, they have a head on collision. Now the semi will probably be going about 45ish if it had a full load, while the civic wil be going 45 in the other direction, so the effective crash speed for the civic was 105 mph, while the semi was about 15. Even if the civic drives car wasn't totally crushed, they'd be dead anyway because their internal orgrans would be all torn up from the sudden change of direction. THAT is why the bigger car wins, is because it has less of a directional change. Now if you hit an immovable object, such as a 10 foot thick concrete wall, the smaller car will probably fair better since it has less mass to slow down in comparison to a semi...
