Wankenstein

The D17 injectors (most likely 240cc) are stock and designed to work with a D17 engine combined with stock ECU.

OP: This is just an observation and not a critisism (or at least not intending to be)..Through several of your post it seems like your goal is to achieve as much power (hp and torque) out of a D17 engine which is not know for that.
Not sure what your net goal is..do you mind explaining what you hope to ultimately achieve with your car's D17 engine? If, I am wrong in my oberservation or assumption please forgive me and I won't bring it up again.

D17VTECPOWER

iTrader: (1)

I did not put the Y8 intake manifold on for performance, I did it because the plastic intake manifold sucks and kept breaking. The intake meant that I had to put the Y8 fuel rail on. I never thought that the Y8 injectors would have been a problem. But I have heard that they spray a stream of fuel instead of a mist though. Not sure about that. Also, most of the mods that I did, like the DC Sports header and aftermarket exhaust were either because I found those parts at a junkyard for cheap or because I needed to replace those parts anyway. I would like to get as much power out of it as possible without causing problems, but I am well aware that these engines aren't performance engines and don't make much power without boost. I am saving for a K swap, so I don't want to put a ridiculous amount of money into the D17 to try to polish a turd.

ezone

Wow. I've not seen one break, and I've probably seen thousands over the years.

I can guess how though LOL

xRiCeBoYx

iTrader: (22)

I put boost through the OEM plastic IM. Never had any breakage or even signs of deformation.

D17VTECPOWER

iTrader: (1)

Mine cracked. I put JB Weld over the crack. Then the PCV nipple broke off when I barely touched the line. I had enough of the plastic one breaking, so I switched to the metal one and never had another problem. But to be fair, the motor was out of a 2001, so the intake manifold was 15 years old before it had any problem.

Wankenstein

Thanks.
Yes, a D17 is not a turd worth polishing for performance. Gas mileage and reliability is unturd-like though.

xRiCeBoYx

iTrader: (22)

I wouldn't sell it quite that short. There was a user here once upon a time putting almost 500 reliable horses to the wheels with a d17a1 (with a2 head)

Wankenstein

naturally aspirated?

D17VTECPOWER

iTrader: (1)

No way can a D17 make that kind of power NA. 200 for a NA D17 is near impossible.

Wankenstein

Yes, I'm sure Riceboy is referring to someone who boosted their engine.

My mom's car is an '04 Civic VP with automatic transmission. It's a light car and does well around town and highway, except highway passing it does struggle.

I've contemplated what a stock 7th gen manual transmission, lowered suspension, wider rims/tires would drive like. My guess is a fun car to drive.

dsm482

you can swap the chips between ECM you just need to know which one has it.. then you need to mach the ignition or key.

basic electrical soldering,.. i ve seen few youtube videos on it..

D17VTECPOWER

iTrader: (1)

I know that our engines are not built to handle making a lot of power. But I am wondering what a very safe HP limit would be on stock internals. I have had a very bad experience with a well maintained D17A2 starting to knock and catastrophically exploding for no reason. It had plenty of clean 5w20 synthetic oil and wasn’t even being run hard, so I question the strength of these engines. Every time I floor mine, I am slightly worried that it will fly apart. Do I need to worry? How strong are the internals of these engines? How do D17 engines compare to previous D series engines durablity wise? Thanks.

D17VTECPOWER

iTrader: (1)

I can swap the chips around, but I don’t know which ones to swap. I couldn’t find any information on these ECUs. Great idea though.

D17VTECPOWER

iTrader: (1)

I always try to keep the oil level around half way between the minimum and maximum marks on the dipstick. My logic for this is that I don’t want to fill the oil all the way to the full mark with the engine cold, because the oil will expand and be too full once the engine warms up. Besides, the engine still has plenty of oil with the oil level half way between the 2 marks, so it’s not like I risk damaging the engine from lack of oil. I also heard from a very smart engine builder that filling the oil all the way up can cause the oil to splash up and interfere with the cranksahaft moving, particularly under hard cornering. He said for that reason, the oil level should be on the medium to low end of the stick. Does that make sense to you? I don’t think that the oil level matters unless it is overfilled or underfilled, but I’m not sure. What do you think?

Wankenstein

Where is the oil level when the car is rolled out of the factory? If Honda engineers (or any manufacturer) deemed that to be the appropriate level..that's good enough for me.

D17VTECPOWER

iTrader: (1)

No idea what the oil level was from the factory. I bought the car used with 15K miles on it.

Colin42

The Honda engineers spent millions of dollars designing the engine to operate at the proper (full) capacity. I'm sure they even accounted for the possibility of the engine being slightly overfilled and it will still run ok. The space between the high and low marks on the dipstick represents about a quart and is the safe range where it is "ok" to run the engine. However I personally wouldn't run the engine hard without it being at the full mark. When you change the oil there can still be about a quart still inside the engine. There's a difference between a dry fill (brand new engine) and a service fill (oil change)

Wankenstein

I am not as qualified as others here to answer your questions but here it goes.

It's listed stock peak horsepower and torque.

Miles on odometer at time of failure? What are your driving habits?
Some D17's will last longer than others simply due to manufacturing locations/tolerances/metallurgy and other variables. This applies to any manufactured engine.

With normal use they are generally known to reach up to and above 200k miles. If one likes to drive it hard than most likely less than normal driving.

Just as well as other generations other than the head gaskets "seem" to breach more often.

D17VTECPOWER

iTrader: (1)

So you would suggest that I fill the oil almost all the way to full?

D17VTECPOWER

iTrader: (1)

I try to drive it as gently as possible, especially while it is cold. I occasionally floor it on the highway, maybe twice a month. The engine has always had clean 5w20 synthetic oil and a quality filter. I changed the oil and filter every 4K miles and only used quality oil. I check the oil every time I get gas, and I never ran it low. The engine had 120K miles on it at the time of failure, which I think is nothing for such a well maintained engine. It must have been defective from the factory. Also, I am probably making about 160 HP at the crank. Is that safe? Also, could I reduce the chance of another head gasket failure by installing ARP head studs? Thanks.

Wankenstein

Hard to say if it was defective..120k miles is roughly 10 years of average driving miles. There are sometimes guarantees in life and they're called powertrain warranties. Your car's engine made it past the warranty, so it's not a dud (in Honda's eyes, anyway).

Dyno'd?

I'm not sure..I've never used them.

D17VTECPOWER

iTrader: (1)

I don’t know what caused the failure. For all I know, maybe the engine had a slight flaw from the factory. Like I said, it always had plenty of clean oil and wasn’t usually run hard, so I don’t know. Do you think I have to worry about this one doing the same thing? How could I have prevented the failure?

Wankenstein

I don't think anyone can promise reliability. All one can do is regular maintenence, timely repairs and hope for the best. You can purchase a third party warranty if you want insurance but I've never purchased one and can't tell you if they are worth it. My guess is probably not.

D17VTECPOWER

iTrader: (1)

So is there anything inherently less reliable about a D17 than a D16 or K20?

ezone

So check the oil level when the engine is hot.

CLUE: There's only a gallon of oil in the engine, real life fluid expansion is minimal and inconsequential---unless it was already FAR overfilled.....and I see these come in with 4.5-5 quarts regularly, with no apparent problems noticed by the drivers.


Nope....Don't you think that Hondas engine designers already took that into account? Have you ever heard of that issue with Hondas engines? On the street?

Also: You aren't racing that car on a track.

Also along the same lines, if I were the engine builder actually building a hot engine for racing purposes, I would account for:

A) low oil level is more likely to allow the the oil sump pickup tube to be uncovered and starve the engine of oil under hard cornering situations (BTDT, big problem with some engines....and same situation with fuel slosh in some cars too),

and

B) if I were concerned with oil getting into the rotating assembly, I'd be installing a windage tray or some other means to control oil slosh.

ezone

The various factories aren't all that consistent about filling to a perfect level.

They were (and still are) arriving with anywhere from a smidge over the full line to 1/4 from the low line.

If I did the PDI I topped the oil up to at least 3/4 if not the full line....with a full oil filter (just ran and shut off).

D17VTECPOWER

iTrader: (1)

Good points. I also would think that the more oil the engine has, the less likely you are to run out and cause damage if a leak develops. But I think that the engine would also take longer to warm up from a cold start with more oil in the engine. Maybe insignificant, but running the engine cold is obviously a very bad thing.

D17VTECPOWER

iTrader: (1)

Also, would running the engine with the oil level half way between the marks reduce the amount of oil that the pistons receive?

ezone

Wrong all the way around IMO.

The oil level is inconsequential for warmup time as long as it has enough. (If it doesn't have enough, it won't warm up ever again)

Engines HAVE to be able to run cold. You're in a place you barely even see real cold.....and the people in the freekin arctic circle don't have the kind of problems you are thinking about.
No, you probably shouldn't hotrod a stone cold engine (at least give it a few seconds to get the oil flowing FFS) but doing so probably isn't going to do a lot of harm in the short term.

Oil technology these days is light years ahead of what your dad and grandpa and great grandpa grew up with.

Engineers already took this into account. Anywhere between the low mark and high mark is safe.

My personal preference is the full mark.

ezone

I'm sure there was a reason, you just didn't discover it.
The good ones will take it, the bad ones won't.

GO or blow!

No IMO....and you might hasten the demise of the gasket in there now if you try to install studs.....unless you just do a full head gasket job in the process.

I think it's a waste of cash for a stock engine. I reuse head bolts on these whenever I do a head gasket job. They aren't TTY so no reason to replace unless there is damage.

If it was a fluke failure, then this engine probably won't do it.Gotta know the root cause of failure first.
You can't do anything about it if you have no idea what caused it.