first day of my engine build, need advice.
09-01-2017
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first day of my engine build, need advice.
I'm going to ask a few questions here, I'm hoping for some help. To start off I have no interest in a K engine swap, I use the car for the occasional track day, and blasting down gravel roads, the car is built as a rally car, and I need to have it comply with the rules.
I have changed the engine in my EM2 for a D17a from japan because of a bad head gasket on the first engine. The D17a has always used about a litre of oil every 1500-2000 kms, or about every 1000 - 1200 miles. I've been to the engine shop and was showed that the problem is most likely the holes behind the oil control rings being plugged, not an easy repair for such a small thing. I'll do the soaking the cylinders in seafoam overnight, but I'm not expecting much.
So on to the questions,
1, I'm going to get an other D17a engine rebuilt, and when it is done I'll swap it into the car. I was told I should get a block guard by the builder. Does that makes sense on a N/A build? He said it was cheap insurance to not blow a head gasket.
2, I'm going to put in a stage one cam, I know I'm not going to get a bunch more power out of it, but every little bit counts. The question I have is my current rocker arms are bedded into the current cam. When changing to a new cam, will that destroy the new cam? Should I be getting a new set of rockers?
3, There are a few cams available for the D17a2, but I have never seen a dyno chart for any of them. Any opinions about who produces a cam with a good mid range power increase, I'm not interested in peak HP.
4, As the block will probably be decked, and the head machined as well, how much can I take off before I start running into valve clearance issues, or raising the compression to much. I don't want to go past 10.5:1
5, While the engine is apart, is it worth doing anything to the head other than a 3 angle valve job? I've seen many how to videos about porting heads, but without a flow bench is it just a waste of time on a d17a? Also I was under the impression that Honda got it about as good as it was going to get, so there is not much to be gained by porting and polishing.
That's the questions I have for now, like I said, this is the first day, I still have to drop the engine off to be taken apart, cleaned and measured to find out the condition of it. Like many race engines I need to fit into a class, and I'm not allowed to do much, I'm hoping what I am going to do won't be noticed by the officials. The ECU is a free component, so I may be getting a Kpro after all is done, but that's after the engine.
I have changed the engine in my EM2 for a D17a from japan because of a bad head gasket on the first engine. The D17a has always used about a litre of oil every 1500-2000 kms, or about every 1000 - 1200 miles. I've been to the engine shop and was showed that the problem is most likely the holes behind the oil control rings being plugged, not an easy repair for such a small thing. I'll do the soaking the cylinders in seafoam overnight, but I'm not expecting much.
So on to the questions,
1, I'm going to get an other D17a engine rebuilt, and when it is done I'll swap it into the car. I was told I should get a block guard by the builder. Does that makes sense on a N/A build? He said it was cheap insurance to not blow a head gasket.
2, I'm going to put in a stage one cam, I know I'm not going to get a bunch more power out of it, but every little bit counts. The question I have is my current rocker arms are bedded into the current cam. When changing to a new cam, will that destroy the new cam? Should I be getting a new set of rockers?
3, There are a few cams available for the D17a2, but I have never seen a dyno chart for any of them. Any opinions about who produces a cam with a good mid range power increase, I'm not interested in peak HP.
4, As the block will probably be decked, and the head machined as well, how much can I take off before I start running into valve clearance issues, or raising the compression to much. I don't want to go past 10.5:1
5, While the engine is apart, is it worth doing anything to the head other than a 3 angle valve job? I've seen many how to videos about porting heads, but without a flow bench is it just a waste of time on a d17a? Also I was under the impression that Honda got it about as good as it was going to get, so there is not much to be gained by porting and polishing.
That's the questions I have for now, like I said, this is the first day, I still have to drop the engine off to be taken apart, cleaned and measured to find out the condition of it. Like many race engines I need to fit into a class, and I'm not allowed to do much, I'm hoping what I am going to do won't be noticed by the officials. The ECU is a free component, so I may be getting a Kpro after all is done, but that's after the engine.
09-01-2017
#2
Dr Krieger of Modification
Re: first day of my engine build, need advice.
You kind of sound like you don't know what you're doing; which is fine.
I'm worried that you are going to get hosed by the shop, because you don't know what should be done/what they are doing.
If you have the second engine I would encourage you to tackle the rebuild yourself.
-Measure the block, it shouldn't be warped, so you should be able to leave that as is.
-take the head to a shop get it decked.
-the valve job may not be needed. test it buy putting the exact same valve in the valve guide which it came out of, poor water into the intake/exhaust port. If it leaks lap the valves yourself with lapping paste and a drill.
-make sure to lube the valve seals when you put them in.
-when you install the compression rings make sure to clock them.
-research how to install the oil rings.
-get some bearing gap gauge from an auto parts store, check your clearances to see if the main/rod bearings need to be replaced.
I'm worried that you are going to get hosed by the shop, because you don't know what should be done/what they are doing.
If you have the second engine I would encourage you to tackle the rebuild yourself.
-Measure the block, it shouldn't be warped, so you should be able to leave that as is.
-take the head to a shop get it decked.
-the valve job may not be needed. test it buy putting the exact same valve in the valve guide which it came out of, poor water into the intake/exhaust port. If it leaks lap the valves yourself with lapping paste and a drill.
-make sure to lube the valve seals when you put them in.
-when you install the compression rings make sure to clock them.
-research how to install the oil rings.
-get some bearing gap gauge from an auto parts store, check your clearances to see if the main/rod bearings need to be replaced.
09-01-2017
#3
Dr Krieger of Modification
Re: first day of my engine build, need advice.
As far as port and polishing goes, I took mine out a quarter inch.
-sounds great! deeper
-seems to rev faster (i'm not sure if this is true though).
-As far as power goes I'm not sure if it makes more since I dropped to low compression pistons for the boost build I'm working on.
-sounds great! deeper
-seems to rev faster (i'm not sure if this is true though).
-As far as power goes I'm not sure if it makes more since I dropped to low compression pistons for the boost build I'm working on.
09-20-2017
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I don't know exactly what I am doing with this engine, but I have rebuilt quite a few motorcycle engines, and my day job is working on turbine engines. I'm quite familiar with measuring, and the processes used to overhaul the engine.
Does a block guard make sense on a N/A build? I know they are cheap, but is it worth it, or needed? I plan on doing all the assembly work myself, I'm just getting the machining and cleaning done by a shop, they are doing that as I type this. The shop I'm using has done a few Honda engines, they seem to know what they are talking about. are there any things I should know now before I get into the assembly that will make a difference later on, that is specific to the d17? things the guys there may, or may not know?
Does a block guard make sense on a N/A build? I know they are cheap, but is it worth it, or needed? I plan on doing all the assembly work myself, I'm just getting the machining and cleaning done by a shop, they are doing that as I type this. The shop I'm using has done a few Honda engines, they seem to know what they are talking about. are there any things I should know now before I get into the assembly that will make a difference later on, that is specific to the d17? things the guys there may, or may not know?
09-20-2017
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Re: first day of my engine build, need advice.
If you understand that most of the time...righty tighty lefty loosey and you have/can use a torque wrench...then these engines are simple. To me their like a Briggs and Stratton kart racing engine but with 4 cylinders...
If your getting a D17A imported from let's say JDM imports, i would strip it down, leave the crank, rods, and pistons in... (they only have 35k-55k miles on them) and install a new water pump and oil pump. I do this just for added precaution.
The block guard may be required if your boring out for larger pistons...other than that, i wouldn't bother.
I would highly suggest getting ARP head studs. I installed them knowing i was going to have a turbo. I'm glad I did, i had a cheap head gasket fail on me from the gasket kit and the studs made the HG repair way easier due to the different torque procedures. I was also able to pull the head with the intake still installed without pulling the timing belt off
Crowler makes a reliable cam. If you want to the engine to breath and run better, i would get a stage 2 crowler cam. Of course you will then need the valve spring kit to support this....then it would definitely be worth your while to get the head worked on. and a P&P
If your thinking of going Kpro you might as well install the AEM adjustable cam gear while everything is out and use a Gates racing timing belt...mine is the color blue.
If your getting a D17A imported from let's say JDM imports, i would strip it down, leave the crank, rods, and pistons in... (they only have 35k-55k miles on them) and install a new water pump and oil pump. I do this just for added precaution.
The block guard may be required if your boring out for larger pistons...other than that, i wouldn't bother.
I would highly suggest getting ARP head studs. I installed them knowing i was going to have a turbo. I'm glad I did, i had a cheap head gasket fail on me from the gasket kit and the studs made the HG repair way easier due to the different torque procedures. I was also able to pull the head with the intake still installed without pulling the timing belt off
Crowler makes a reliable cam. If you want to the engine to breath and run better, i would get a stage 2 crowler cam. Of course you will then need the valve spring kit to support this....then it would definitely be worth your while to get the head worked on. and a P&P
If your thinking of going Kpro you might as well install the AEM adjustable cam gear while everything is out and use a Gates racing timing belt...mine is the color blue.
