Originally Posted by andyman97

This has been an ongoing debate for a long time, so here is a thread dedicated to the subject. This is an opinion of mine but it honestly isn't biased. I have run almost every engine management available for the d17 on a very high horsepower engine and have had the ability to test them with tunes from some of the most avid, well known, and well respected tuners in the industry.

It is ultimately your own decision on what system you choose to run but heed this advice if you want reliability, power, and longevity. Without further ado....

What system should I use?
Short answer, Kpro. You can read all about the options here: http://www.hondata.com/kpro.html
The system goes for $1175 (as opposed to $1700 for the AEM) through a Hondata certified dealer. What that means is, you can pick up ANY k series manual transmission engine computer from the list of comatible ecu's on hondata's website, find an authorized hondata dealer and hook up with them to get the ecu sent to hondata for programming.

What's so great about kpro?
Kpro maintains the use of your on board data system (OBD). Why would you want that? Because if a sensor goes or you have a misfire in the cylinders, the ecu will still warn you of danger with MIL's/CEL's.

But AEM EMS doesn't use CEL's, and they make the car run like crap when they come on, why would I want something that still gives CEL's?
In short, to save your engine before you destroy it. If you have a bad cam sensor, the kpro will let you know. The AEM will not. You have to know what voltage the sensor is supposed to operate at and find the inconsistancies through datalogs/sensor voltage monitoring.

Why else would I want to use Kpro over the AEM EMS?
Honestly, because AEM is geared more towards high performance race cars, mainly in excess of 800-900 whp, not so much daily driver street cars. This is not to say that your car can%u2019t be streetable with the AEM, but on a d17, kpro is honestly much more efficient. The fact that the kpro is built off of a stock honda computer, it allows your car to run much smoother and is much more user friendly when it comes to set up and tuning.

What about piggybacks, like the Emanage, AEM F/IC, or XFC PCS?
If you want to run 6 or 7 psi and not make much power, go for it. They%u2019re a cheaper alternative but they in no way, shape, or form compare to a true standalone. The main reason for hassle is you can not run open loop on a piggyback, so your stock ecu is fighting every step of the way to correct your fuel and ignition timing. This isn%u2019t what you want, especially when you%u2019re making power. All the piggyback does is %u201Ctry%u201D to trick the stock ecu into putting out the correct pulses to the injectors and spark plugs. It%u2019s an extremely inferior way to control your engine.

At about 6-7 psi, you're liable to make an additional 20-40 whp with a standalone than you are a piggyback, depending on the tuner. You are also extremely limited with the amount of max power you can make with a piggyback. I can't recall having seen anyone get much over 200 whp on a piggyback.

I have a non-vtec motor, can I use kpro too?
Yes. The vtec ecu that you will be using requires a signal from a vtec solenoid. If you don't have one, it will trigger the CEL. But you can set the parameters for vtec to engage beyond the engine's capability, ie: 9000 rpm or 30 psi of boost. Keep in mind that without a vtec head, your camshaft options are limited to a custom grind cam.

I heard that you have to relfash your key when you change the ECU. Do you have to do that with kpro, too?
No, you do not HAVE to reflash the key with kpro. There is a parameter in the software to disable the immbolilzer. If you check that box, you don't have to do anything but your immbolizer will not work and the key light on the gauge cluster will flash continuously. If you want to get rid of the light, and/or want the immobilzer to work, you must flash the key, ecu and immobilizer from Honda for about $30-100, depending on the dealership.

What about my super awesome automatic transmission? It's so fast and strong and awesome, I can use kpro with it, too, right?
Nope, sorry. Kpro won't work with any autos.

In summary:
If you want reliable power, run the kpro. If you want problems and headaches, go ahead and be cheap and pick up that piggyback.

Questions and comments welcome, but this is an informative thread to people who are seeking answers. Please don%u2019t pollute it with nonsense and garbage. Thanks.

Originally Posted by I <3 My EM2

Yeah your right, I asked him about k-pro and said aem ems would be better and easier to resell if I ever needed to since it can be used on cars other than honda

Originally Posted by I <3 My EM2

also he said aem ems is easier to tune .. lmao. i guess for them its easier because I think they use it a lot! Its a very very professional shop .. I went by and made sure

Originally Posted by I <3 My EM2

I think im gonna just do the aem since the tuner is more comfortable with it, could reach higher numbers with it and hes a honest man, i spent a couple hours at the shop and phone speaking with him. Its a popular shop and they had some very high end cars in the lot that they tuned and built..

Originally Posted by I <3 My EM2

The only thing I heard, was that the aem ems cant control the cars A/C and fans and would need extensive wiring to get it working.. if thats the case then ill force kpro on him