Running Riot

id totally rock a dyno in my garage. charge half as much as the local speed shop and have it paid off within two years.

jamis33

Well went to the track today and it was a pretty bad day. Had an awesome time till I started breaking stuff. So was driving and heard a really loud sound and didn't know what it was but it seemed like as soon as I crossed 4k rpms it was like I had a hole in my exhaust. Then I noticed a crazy big expansion in the crack in my header. The guys at the track said that's probably what was making my car so loud but I'm still not convinced. Then I had to drive home 3 hrs and the idle was choppy and so was the throttle. The car lacked power and hesitated after 3500rpms. Then I threw a cel after 2 hrs and The car went to limp mode an was even choppier. Car wouldn't hold an idle. When I stopped car would just go to 0rpms and stall out. Checked code and it was p1129. And I have code details too. Any ideas? This car is my dd:s

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

P1128 - Manifold Absolute Pressure lower then expected
P1129 - Manifold Absolute Pressure higher then expected

both code require measurement of pressure with scanner
for P1128 if pressure is 54.1KPA or higher, its intermittent problem, reset ECU. if its lower, MAP sensor needs to be replaced.
for P1129 if pressure is 43.3KPA or lower, its intermittent problem, reset ECU. if its higher, MAP sensor needs to be replaced.

Since your have a crack, replace the manifold and you should be good.

Running Riot

haha not to laugh at your problems man just the way you put it made me laugh,

had fun until I started breaking stuff.

Hope you get it worked out.

jamis33

Well does the map sensor measure intake manifold or exhaust because the crack is in my exhaust? I guess it's a good excuse to buy headers anyways lol. It was a ton of fun tho. Rode with this guy in a 95 240sx with sr20. Makes me want to sell my civic and buy one of those. I'm getting better at track driving too. Also saw a sick rsx type s. Fully built bottom and top end with Jackson racing sc. That car was damn fast considering he had the boost turned down to only 11psi he said he makes 261whp and 210wtq. Maybe that's what my car needs

jamis33

ok i got an other question my afc neo is on crack. Im wondering if thats what caused the problem with my MAP sensor. Also i turned vtec off to see if it was a problem being caused by vtec crossover like loose rocker arms or something idk. Now i go to turn it back on so i go to model select ->v/t on. then i go to settings-> v/t control and it shows up NO CONTROL! what is causing this???




update: got my afc neo to work kinda. Seems like its running normal but i have bigger problems still. I reset ecu and cel is gone now and car will idle. But now whenever start up the car i get a puff of black smoke. Also car is idling high like at 1100 rpms. It sounds fine till around 4000rpms then i get a loud sound and it feels like the car is lacking power and stuff like i can floor it all day and it wont go past 5000 rpms in neutral. What is going on? can all this be from just one crack above my o2 sensor? I can only hope. Im also thinking im going to put some epoxy putty over the hole just to see if it will change anything. Ive got nothing to lose.

bomerman19

iTrader: (1)

crack in the header will raise hell with the car you have an exhaust leak especially that close to the exhaust ports on the head it will run like **** it will throw codes and stick it into limp mode all day long. It changes the volumetric efficiency on the other side in the intake mani which will cause the car to run like ****. replace the header should solve all of your problems.


the header gets extremely hot and will melt the epoxy it needs to be welded or replaced

jamis33

well i thought you couldnt weld cast iron? or u need some special way of welding it. Ok i threw some epoxy putty on the header and started the car up. First reations car ran really well. no CEL No lopey idle no hesitation and vtec crossover smooth but it was still really really loud. It felt like the car was running normal. 5min later and the epoxy was melting kinda and turned black and it smelled really bad but i think that fixed the problem so new header for me! so good thats both good and bad. good cuz i can finally free up some much needed power but bad cuz im out like $200+ and i wont pass emissions. but ive got another year to figure that out. Anyways i dont think i mentioned it but when i was starting it up before there was a puff of black soot that was coming out when i started the car. any ideas whats causing this? didnt do it since i patched the hole (that i can notice) but what would cause it?

ProjectMayhemR

iTrader: (1)

cast iron can be welded, it just takes someone who is experienced. The metal just can't go from hot to cold really quick or it will break you have to let it cool slowly.

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

OKay, several things...

First, dont bother trying to epoxy (dumb idea- it'll melt no matter what the packaging says, but props for trying) or weld it. If you try to weld it, it WILL re-crack in the same location no matter what.

As for your other problems. Reset the ECU again (by pulling the ECU fuse, or disconnecting the negative battery terminal for a minute). THEN do an idle relearn by turning off ALL the fans and stereo and dome lights and just let it idle for 10 minutes straight without blipping the gas or ANYTHING. Just let it chill. Turn it off, then start it up again and it should be good to go with a reset idle. Then your car should idle fine. You'll notice that your car will idle faster at first, then the idle will drop after a few mins, still wait out the 10 mins.

The black smoke is prob excess fuel thats sitting unburnt just after the car is turned off. There could be several issues causing this, but since you got a crack in your header, you need to fix it and then worry about any other problems, if there are any. Disconnect your NEO if you think its causing issues, infact, disconnect that before you do your idle relearn.

As for the MAP sensor... yeah I dont know why that codes getting thrown if you got a crack on your exhaust... very odd. Fix the manifold and then see if it still exists.

I got two EX headers if your looking for one. Plus a race header. Willing to sell.

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

OKay, several things...

First, dont bother trying to epoxy (dumb idea- it'll melt no matter what the packaging says, but props for trying) or weld it. If you try to weld it, it WILL re-crack in the same location no matter what.

As for your other problems. Reset the ECU again (by pulling the ECU fuse, or disconnecting the negative battery terminal for a minute). THEN do an idle relearn by turning off ALL the fans and stereo and dome lights and just let it idle for 10 minutes straight without blipping the gas or ANYTHING. Just let it chill. Turn it off, then start it up again and it should be good to go with a reset idle. Then your car should idle fine. You'll notice that your car will idle faster at first, then the idle will drop after a few mins, still wait out the 10 mins.

The black smoke is prob excess fuel thats sitting unburnt just after the car is turned off. There could be several issues causing this, but since you got a crack in your header, you need to fix it and then worry about any other problems, if there are any. Disconnect your NEO if you think its causing issues, infact, disconnect that before you do your idle relearn.

As for the MAP sensor... yeah I dont know why that codes getting thrown if you got a crack on your exhaust... very odd. Fix the manifold and then see if it still exists.

I got two EX headers if your looking for one. Plus a race header. Willing to sell.

ProjectMayhemR

iTrader: (1)

First you can't say it will break, because you don't know that, they weld cast iron all the time at the AFB my dad works at. Second it won't break in the same location it would break around the weld. The weld is stronger than the metal around it.
Bomberman answered this. He said the leak is changing the volumetric pressure in the intake manifold.

bomerman19

iTrader: (1)

yeah you could weld it up just fineit wont break in the same spot as noted by mayhem. the weld is stronger and if it is done right the metal's will fuse so a decent portion around the weld will also be stronger then the rest of the mani basicly think of it this way your are making shitty metal get heat treated it will be stronger. It would probably take me all of a minute it to weld the mani back up.

as for the map a leak tends to cause a loss of pressure on one area of the mani then you start getting the high and low pressure areas all mixed up and on the intake side it will pull stronger through one runner than an another causing a pressure deficiency and throwing the code. try to think of it this way if you were running a duel carburetor setup and this happened it would cause the the carbs to become out of balance the flow would be stronger on one side than the other and the car would run like ****.

this is one of the reasons it is so hard to squeeze power out of an NA setup as apposed to boost. everything has to be in balance, if you add one thing you have to make sure it does not take away too much from another thing. were boost you can get past a lot of balance issues cause the air is forced in and not relying so much on high and low pressure areas to get desired results

jamis33

ok should i be worried about the loud sound or just assume its my header? would any damage to the block or head cause the exhaust to get really loud? After plugging the hole with epoxy my idle became fine and it idled and wasnt shooting black smoke. But it was still really loud. I dont really know what to do about this. It sounds a lot better tho. Also triz pm me with the info about the race header. If im gonna spend money on a new header i might as well buy a good one. I probs cant afford it tho. Im leaning toward kamikaze, megan, or a bolt on LX cuz i dont have money to get exhaust work done. Althought dc 4-2-1 or hp race would do nicely if they were in the right price range but this is my dd so i need it going asap

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

Words. ****, I've always wanted to learn how to weld. Then I wouldnt get schooled like this! haha. I read from some other posts on here that it would always crack if you welded it (from one guys experience)... I guess if you do a shitty weld then its way more prone to break, which is probably what the guy did. *shrug* Good to know none the less.

bomerman19

iTrader: (1)

^ welding man it takes practice, prep, and gas helps a lot. the first stuff I welded would probably break but after welding for a couple of years and figuring out good heat penetration it starts to come together pretty nicely I am at the point I can structurally weld like build a roll cage but it takes so much work getting all the tubing and notching it and prepping the surface. Welding is fun but the initial price can be expensive man I would kill for a tig but I have less than $38 this week lolz

jamis33

hey bomberman im thinking of checking to make sure there is no internal damage. When i check valve clearence can i just use stock specs with stage 1 cam or does it have to be different. I couldnt find any info on crower website.

2002civicrider

iTrader: (1)

U can use the stock specs.... The specs that came with it is .008 intake .006 exhaust.. It's either that way or the other I'm not 100% sure but I think that's right.

ProjectMayhemR

iTrader: (1)

Yea welding takes alot of practice. Most tech colleges offer it as a course. I learned it in highschool so I'm not the most knowledgeable. My instructor was more interested in oatmeal creampies than teaching, but I can lay a better bead down than him and everyone else in the class. It's a pretty bitchin stress reliever too!

jamis33

Still Need header asap. Cough 2002civicrider. I have cash in hand for your Megan

jamis33

well guys yesterday i went to adjust the valve clearence and guess what? i found the real problem. apparently my car just sucks in general and it really is not liking this new head. first coolant leakage and a small oil leak and now all these problems. Heres what i saw. I was playing with the valve clearence so i popped off the timing cover. I noticed that hey when i crank the engine and set the cam gear to top the little arrow dealie on the block isnt matched up with the little notch dealie. So when the cam is at top the block is at like 1 o clock i think? the whole counterclockwise thing is confusing me right now its too hot out to think. so this means my cam timing is advanced rite? Im pretty sure when i had it apart yesterday i saw the cam was spinning ahead of the block. its probably out at least 10 degrees. that seems like it is the cause of my troubles. It explains a lack of power and the loud exhaust noise can still be explained by a bad donut gasket on the muffler and the crack in the header. im not worried about the noise im worried about the fact my car is running like $hit. Im assuming the cause of the timing problem is just i revved it a s hit ton at the racetrack and the belt just jumped so im takng it back to the mechanic and going to see what he can do for me and i'll probably replace the tensioner too just to be safe but i really think all the damage is done. im hoping i didnt smahs my valves or anything. im gonna get him to run a leakdown test too.

Running Riot

I had a similar issue when I had a SOHC turbo in my LX, the bolts that held the cam gear in place were **** and they loosened up under heavy driving, sounds like that may be why your timing went all ***** nilly. If the camshaft is ahead of the crank then the timing is advanced because the valves are opening before TDC but if the crank is that far back in relation to the cam then that could be why it is running like ****. I'm not an expert merely speculating.

bomerman19

iTrader: (1)

your car is running so the valves are fine re-time it. if the valves become un-seated or bent the car won't run at all. with timing either you mess it up or you don't there is not much for an in between. I would also replace the tensioner you should always replace the tensioner when you replace the belt because the load is different from a new belt compared to an old belt and it puts an extra strain on the already crappy tensioner. I have had one tensioner seize (I opened the hood and caught the belt trying to creep up over the cam gear before I started it one day... so lucky) and I had another one where the tensioner bolt sheered off in bumper to bumper traffic. The honda tensioner's suck

I believe one notch is like 8 or 13 degrees I can't remember they will run if it is off one notch but like ****. I would just re-time and put a new tensioner on it. Oh and if the valves do let loose it is not hard to fix what I would call a late night and a six pack for me, but honda will charge about $3500 to replace all the valve $1000 just to pull the head to check

oh and the valve spec the tight side is in the intake .006 the looser side is on the exhaust .008 since it get's significantly hotter and the metal tends to expand more when you have tried as many cams as I have you just kind of memorize it.

bomerman19

iTrader: (1)

your car is running so the valves are fine re-time it. if the valves become un-seated or bent the car won't run at all. with timing either you mess it up or you don't there is not much for an in between. I would also replace the tensioner you should always replace the tensioner when you replace the belt because the load is different from a new belt compared to an old belt and it puts an extra strain on the already crappy tensioner. I have had one tensioner seize (I opened the hood and caught the belt trying to creep up over the cam gear before I started it one day... so lucky) and I had another one where the tensioner bolt sheered off in bumper to bumper traffic. The honda tensioner's suck

I believe one notch is like 8 or 13 degrees I can't remember they will run if it is off one notch but like ****. I would just re-time and put a new tensioner on it. Oh and if the valves do let loose it is not hard to fix what I would call a late night and a six pack for me, but honda will charge about $3500 to replace all the valve $1000 just to pull the head to check

oh and the valve spec the tight side is in the intake .006 the looser side is on the exhaust .008 since it get's significantly hotter and the metal tends to expand more when you have tried as many cams as I have you just kind of memorize it.

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

Still got the link in my sig on how to replace your valves/valve springs/retainers if you find out they need to be changed.

jamis33

thanks for all the help guys. just a few quick questions. My tensioner appears to be working fine so can the timing just e reset without even removing the timing belt cuz i think i can get the gear bolt off then pop the gear off, turn the camshaft back and pop it back on? I just hate messing with the auto tensioner cuz i really have no idea how it works. Anyways thanks again for all the help. and also bomberman and civicrider those specs for .006 intake and .008 exhaust are those crowers specs or hondas? cuz in my crappy haynes manual it says a bit higher than that but i figure if there is less clearence that means more power? valves can open more? just checking. if thats the case i'll adjust it. I think the intake side is that size cuz i couldnt fit the smallest stock one in there and i was going to open it up. I guess the car runs fine so maybe i shouldnt mess with it the valves arent making an excessive amount of noise but this cam is deffs louder than stock lx. Also im getting a new header to fix that cracked one. I havent decided yet but hopeflly i'll have it figure out tonight! Im only on stock midpipe right now with 2.5" axleback what diameter exhaust should i run for best performance with my setup. i was leaning toward 2.25? any opinions. thanks again

bomerman19

iTrader: (1)

those are the specs for the crower cam if you can go 2.5 all the way through go 2.5 if not go 2.25 I wouldn't go any smaller these engines love to have the exhaust as free as possible. For the tensioner if you want the timing to be accurate you are going to have to loosen the bolt on the tensioner slip off the belt reset the timing and then slide the belt back on the tensioner and tighten the bolt back up. that is the only way to be sure that the timing is right and then rotate the crank by hand a couple of times to make sure it all spin smoothly.