spangle6

2003 Honda Civic LX, 92,000 miles. My dealership has been warning me about worn-out struts the last couple of years during routine maintenance. Suspension is a common issue where I live because of winter-ravaged streets. I recently asked for estimates and they hit me with $1900 in recommended work on suspension.

DEALERSHIP
1. Front sway bar links (right broken, left about to break): $139
2. Rear sway bar links (creaking, not broken, "optional"): $165
3. Front struts (one leaking oil heavily, one damp): $879
4. Lower ball joint boot broken: $118
5. Front compliance bushings, surface cracking: $474
6. Alignment: $115
TOTAL: $1,890

The total was so huge that I took it to two neighborhood shops and asked them to "look at the suspension." Surprise -- both agreed with the dealership on only one thing (front sway bar links), but neither said anything about struts!

LOCAL SHOP #1
1. Front and rear sway bar links: $306
(confirmed the front ones were broken and the rear ones creaking)
TOTAL: $306

LOCAL SHOP #2
1. Front sway bar links (right broken): $123.
2. Disassemble, clean, lube and adjust rear drum brakes: $107.
(Because I said there was creaking in the back.)
TOTAL: $230

My main question is: How could the dealership say the front struts and compliance bushings were shot, and the shops didn't say a thing? I told Shop #1 that I'd heard the struts were bad and they said they were fine. I didn't say anything about struts to Shop #2. I've tried the "bounce test" and it seems fine, but I'm told that doesn't necessarily matter for struts. Their performance seems fine, but I wouldn't be surprised if they were worn out.

Is it possible the two shops missed the leaking struts and cracked compliance bushings?

Max91

Are the struts leaking for sure? About the sway bar links, thats an inexpensive part and very easy to replace. A 6th grader can replace those in about an hour.

What you might try is go to a parts warehouse and ask them about a local reputable mechanic. The NAPA warehouse near me knows all the good mechanics and witch ones to stay away from.

Hope this helps!

ezone

An independent shop tech may not be as familiar with the cars and not know what is common to find bad.

As a dealer tech, I can tell you that I already know the most common things to look for on those cars.

And 5 different people can make 5 different lists. Some things are more important to some people than others.

Struts, lower control arm bushings (the front or compliance ones, see next paragraph), and swaybar links are pretty standard at 100k. Ball joint boots too.


However, you stated "5. Front compliance bushings, surface cracking:". Surface cracking is minor (or sounds minor to me). When these go bad, they break the rubber completely through and allow the lower control arm to contact the subframe and make clunking noises.

I bet the dealer is overlapping labor charges though. You shouldn't be paying to disassemble the same suspension parts over and over for each part of the job if the jobs are all done at the same time.

All of these can be confirmed with a visual check.
I think that after your indy shops had their looks, you should have shown them the dealers list and asked to be shown each of the items and shown how and why they need attention.

I know if I make a shopping list, I have no problem explaining and pointing out to the cars owner the hows or whys of what I put on the list.







Lubing the rear brakes is also common. You would hear a loud squeak every time you pump the brake pedal, even with the car stopped. Annoying at times, but not critical at all.

spangle6

Thanks. Dealership said one front strut was leaking badly, the other one moist. The first indie shop I asked about struts and they said, "No, they're fine." The second shop I didn't mention struts to see if they would see it on their own, and they didn't.

I gather that struts that are just a little damp are not a big deal, and that compliance bushings are not a problem until they're making noise. But I want to get premium new tires very soon, so I don't want suspension problems.

lowlife9

since when does the lx come with sway bars. remove the front sway bar you dont need it. rear deal with the creaking its a common problem they need lubricant but its nothing to be concerned about. if the struts feel fine then why replace them so leave them alone. the ball joints i would replace ASAP if there damaged. the compliance bushings are also a common problem those will inevitably need replacing.

most of the problems you have are easy to fix yourself with the rite incentive that being $2,000 dollars. there are a ton of step by step DIYs in this forum that will guide you if you decide to go that route.

ezone

True.
Struts are a hydraulic item, and there is an allowable amount of oily film that does collect on the upper parts of the housing.
But there shouldn't be a large amount of oil, nor should the housing have a thick collection of dirt stuck to it (evidence of major leakage).
It is a judgement call.
If they pass a bounce test, they may be fine for a long time.

But the original front struts on most 7th gen cars were well known for causing knocking noises with no visible oil leakage (and pass a bounce test). Replaced many for that alone.
Someone familiar with these can usually tell with a short drive (I would hope). I can usually start suspecting when I hit the 1/2 inch rise going through the shop door. *POP*


Also true,
and don't we all?


The parts catalog says it does, front and rear.... I looked up a 2003 LX 4 door.
US/Can and Japan builds take different part number swaybars on the front too.

lowlife9

interesting.

Kennykid2002

iTrader: (1)

End links are not hard to do yourself.

Dealer tech explained to me, that a bit of oil on the struts is quite normal.
If the shock is blown, oil would be gushing out and it'd be pretty impossible to miss; you'd know for sure the shock is blown.

Compliance bushings, you're almost guaranteed to have cracking, if they're oem and unchanged.
Mine has surface cracks too.
It only becomes a problem when they break.

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

Just to add to above:
you said wintery place - ball joint boot will be a must - snow and salt will contaminate metal/lub inside (if still there are lube in there anymore)
sway bar links - not a must, but cheap enough and easy to do yourself with simple tools, so why not?
struts - rears are usually more evident, since rear springs ad struts are soft enough to bounce during driving. (have seem some boucing all around...) Fronts are not that bouncy, so the pop/knock noise or affluent leaks could be used as test.
compliance bushing - expected to fail, but if cracks are superficial, no need (they designed to twist rubber so they crack after some time).
If you go indie shop, recommend KYB GR2's a OEM replacement (some might say tokiko HP blues, but they have een reported as making the ride stiffer - good for stiffer springs, but might not fit everyone's tastes)

spangle6

Well, I went to a THIRD shop and did what I should have done before and asked them to show me the struts. The front ones were indeed pretty leaky but maybe not completely failed quite yet. The rear were moist. Since I want new tires I'll probably spring for the front struts. Still don't see why the other shops (one of them a tire shop) didn't note the struts.

They quoted me $500 for the struts (though they were Monroe Sensa Tracs and the whole internet seems to prefer KYBs -- I just want whatever will last longer).
I can see that the sway bar links look pretty easy to do but they quoted me $78 total with no labor charge, pretty hard to beat.
Plus alignment for $90 -- all of which saving me about $500 over the dealer.

Based on what you guys have said, looks like I can hold off on the compliance bushings and cleaning the brakes (maybe not the ball joint boot), saving me another $600. Thanks!