samwichse

Sadly, my first gen Insight met its end in a low speed crash with a high-bumper+trailer hitch into the engine compartment. It was no sports car, but its light weight and short wheelbase made it what I will call "tossably fun."

I couldn't find a good replacement on short notice (they're a rare car), so I ended up with a cheap deal on an '04 Civic hybrid. I'm already paying way more for gas (I have a long commute) compared to the Insight, but this car is also nowhere near as fun to corner in/etc, and maintaining speed is important to keeping up the MPG.

So what's a good starting point to tame some of this thing's sogginess? I'm not shooting for the moon here, if it could just handle as well as my wife's '07 Fit Sport I would be happy.

I see there are lots of options for sway bars and shocks and bushings and what have you, but I don't really know what a good brand is or what the best place to spend money is for maximum gains. All my other cars have basically stayed stock (except a VW beetle that got some engine upgrades). This is my first car that weighs more than 2200lbs and it FEELS LIKE IT.

Sam

lowlife9

if you want it to take corners better get better tires i can imagine the tires on a civic hybrid aren't very good for handling but better for rolling resistance. and doesn't the hybrid use braking force to recharge the batteries so there mite be complications with finding aftermarket suspension for it but maybe im wrong ???

samwichse

I'm sure the stock tires aren't great, but the brakes/suspension are bone stock for the whole line (the regen takes place in a pancake electric motor that sits where the flywheel usually is) as far as I can tell. At least the parts shops I've looked at list it along with the other trim levels.

On the plus side, the alloys on the hybrid are very nice and light... but I'd rather not go with non-LRR tires, as a drop in MPG adds up quickly on my commute. However, I don't know if it is possible to replace the current 14" tires/wheels with something that's 15" and lower profile (would this help, or is it just for looks?)

Sam

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

remove everything ye don't need from inside the car. Actually a 2000 or older vic would have been more fun and lighter, but anyways that's what ye have.

part of sloppiness is from rear shocks too weak ( i see some with good shocks boingo'ing around..... tokiko blues shocks? Also, RSX rear sway bar and you should be good already. Not sure how much weight more the car have with the batteries...

samwichse

Ok, Tokico blue shocks for the rear...

RSX sway bar? You mean a sway bar made for an RSX, or a junkyard part?

Also: weight is 2730lbs vs 2430 for the non-hybrid. The battery and its associated junk (controllers and such) weigh about 100lbs in an Insight and the motor weighs in at maybe 30-40lbs (the system is almost identical between the two. In fact, the battery sticks can be directly interchanged). So I'm not sure where the extra 160-170lbs comes from?

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

yup rsx rear bar, used or not

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

tein H-tech springs for a small drop, and tokico HP shocks. better tires are a must, but usually the LRR tires for better gas mileage have lousy handling.

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

not sure if a drop is what he looks for.
wonder where the additional weight is located, it could change weight distribution (not by much, a passenger could change as much the distribution.)

samwichse

Probably a drop is out of the question, there are 3 roads on my commute that have speed bumps, and one of the sets is HUGE. Plus there are cattle guards (basically bridges made of widely spaced parallel metal bars that cows are afraid to walk across) all over my work and EVEN MORE SPEED BUMPS!

I do notice my back end continues to bob annoyingly every time I go over the speed bumps, but the factory shocks appear to be in mint condition.

Ok, so far I've got

*Tokico shocks in back (blue or HP?)

*RSX Sway bar (something like this? http://www.optionsauto.com/prodinfo.asp?number=HR-71323)

*Tires/wheels... I see on tire rack I could swap the 185/70R14 that are on there now for 195/60R15 and have the same diameter but 1/2" wider and slightly lower profile. Would this help handling significantly? It would cost me an additional 4lbs unsprung, rotating weight per corner to do this.

lowlife9

how are you going to fit a 15 inch wheel on 14 ???

samwichse

Um, by putting a 15" wheel on?

MindBomber

Tires - Honestly, stepping up from 185-195 isn't going to be of significant benefit, 215 is another story, but on a lightly modified suspension with fuel efficiency being a key factor I would keep it at 185.

RSX sway bar - Yes, exactly like that, but not that one. You're looking at a 20mm sway bar that costs $220, you could get a brand new 05-06 OEM 21mm sway bar for $75.

http://www.acuraoemparts.com/delray/...All&vinsrch=no

Obviously, buying from a junk yard would reduce the cost even further.

Tokicos- Blues and HP are the same shock, the HP models just happen to have the nick name blues because they're... blue

samwichse

Ahhh thanks!

So is the Acura swaybar a drop in replacement or will I need some extra hardware (it's a different diameter, I would need to replace the bushings, etc?)

And would I see the most benefit ONLY replacing the rear shocks, or would doing the fronts help significantly? Likewise, with the sway bar up front?

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

better keep car balanced - both ends at same time.exception goes for the rear sway bar, fronts ya keep stock.
yes, need brackets and bushings, endlinks should be ok.

samwichse

Haha, way late update, but I bought a set of Tokico blues shortly after this and installed them. The handling improvement over the stock sloppiness was so significant I never bothered with a beefier swaybar.

Also, the extra ~170lbs comes from: increased sound insulation in the hybrid model, and battery compartment support structure/armoring.

Still driving the car, but it still has two toxic flaws that suck all the joie de vivre from it:
1) Horribly flawed electronic power steering rack. This thing sucks *****. It has a known problem with stiction making the car want to meander down the lane. The only solution is a brand new rack unit for ~$1000 from Honda. Can't get a junkyard unit because it will probably have the same flaw. Really don't get this, because the very first EPS rack Honda put in a production car was the Insight, and that one felt great. As does my wife's Fit.

2) No VTEC! Well, technically it has VTEC, but they used it for cylinder deactivation instead of happy fun times. So the engine kind of wheezes out over 3500-4000 rpms instead of that kick in the pants starting around 3200. I'm a slow-cars-fast kind of guy, but come on.

But the good news is, I can relegate the HCH1 to family duty now because... I got another first-gen Insight! 1.0L, 73hp and 91ft lbs (peak at 2000 rpms!), and 1850lbs of short-wheelbase fun! The only car I'd want more is a Honda Beat (doable, some are now over 25 years old and importable). Or that new S660 Honda totally teased us with but never delivered for export.

What can I say, I love tiny cars. This Civic is still a land yacht for me.

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for feedback and glad to know you found another insight

Hondoyota

I ran Tokico Blues and Tein S tech springs on a prior car and had issues with the Tokicos constantly blowing. After blowing 2 struts and having the company refuse to replace them under warranty, I opted to swap the stock struts/springs back in. I'd be interested to hear how you fare with your Tokicos.

xRiCeBoYx

iTrader: (22)

i ran the blues with s-techs for a good 40k miles with no issues (including a cross country and an east coast road trip). Only reason I swapped it out was because I got a killer deal on the coilovers I'm currently rocking.