Engine cranks in any gear? - Honda Civic Forum

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Engine cranks in any gear?

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Old 07-12-2018
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Engine cranks in any gear?

So this first started about a year ago with the engine not cranking in park at random times, but cranking in neutral. When it wouldn't crank in park, the gear indicator light on the dash wouldn't be on at all. This would only happen every couple of weeks. But after a couple months of this not happening, I noticed that the engine will consistently start in any gear. The indicator light on the dash works correctly, but it starts in any gear now. I don't think that these two issues are related, but I have no way of knowing. Any ideas what could cause this? I don't particularly care if it cranks in any gear, but I don't want to ignore this problem if it could damage something else or cause another problem. Thanks
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Old 07-12-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Follow and diagnose according to a correct wiring diagram for answers.
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Old 07-12-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by ezone View Post
Follow and diagnose according to a correct wiring diagram for answers.
I have a wiring diagram for the starter. My best guess is that the starter cut relay is stuck closed, but I'll have to find that relay and test it.
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

It's in the dash fusebox.

Has that relay been bypassed?
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by ezone View Post
It's in the dash fusebox.

Has that relay been bypassed?
Thanks. I'll test that relay and report back. And no it has not been bypassed. I didn't even know that it was there until I looked at the wiring diagram.
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

I can find out a whole lot of answers by probing a simple test light in the relay socket.
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by ezone View Post
I can find out a whole lot of answers by probing a simple test light in the relay socket.
I'm sure you can. However, the relays in the fusebox under the dash aren't exactly easy to get to. In my opinion, it would be easier to start with removing the relay and testing it outside the car than to do testing from the socket.
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by D17VTECPOWER View Post
I'm sure you can. However, the relays in the fusebox under the dash aren't exactly easy to get to. In my opinion, it would be easier to start with removing the relay and testing it outside the car than to do testing from the socket.
Disagree, regardless of difficulty. You aren't likely to find the relay stuck on, and if it were stuck on then trying to pull it out of the box would probably make it unstick and all your evidence would disappear in an instant.

I don't think I've ever needed to test a relay out of circuit. I've always been able to judge by evaluating the 4 or 5 terminals in a typical simple relay socket.

Be glad it's not a German car. LOL
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by ezone View Post
Disagree, regardless of difficulty. You aren't likely to find the relay stuck on, and if it were stuck on then trying to pull it out of the box would probably make it unstick and all your evidence would disappear in an instant.

I don't think I've ever needed to test a relay out of circuit. I've always been able to judge by evaluating the 4 or 5 terminals in a typical simple relay socket.

Be glad it's not a German car. LOL
But wouldn't you need to remove the relay to do your testing from the socket anyway?
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Okay so I removed the relay from the socket and it still cranks in any gear. What does this mean? Short in the load side?
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by D17VTECPOWER View Post
But wouldn't you need to remove the relay to do your testing from the socket anyway?
Yes, but that doesn't matter if you KNOW what you should find when testing in the socket.



Know. Evaluate. Judge. Deduce.
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by ezone View Post
Yes, but that doesn't matter if you KNOW what you should find when testing in the socket.



Know. Evaluate. Judge. Deduce.
Good point. I'm late and it's tired. :yawn:
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by D17VTECPOWER View Post
Okay so I removed the relay from the socket and it still cranks in any gear. What does this mean? Short in the load side?
you pulled the wrong relay?





Or its bypassed somewhere
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Effed up range switch?
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by ezone View Post
Effed up range switch?
I don't think so. All the indicator lights on the dash work correctly.
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by ezone View Post
you pulled the wrong relay?





Or its bypassed somewhere
I pulled RY1 on this diagram: http://www.skidmore.edu/~pdwyer/portfolio/e/udfrb.htm
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

You pulled the relay and you have a wire diagram.. Test, dont guess.





It's not the relay.
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by ezone View Post
You pulled the relay and you have a wire diagram.. Test, dont guess.





It's not the relay.
It can't be the relay since it still cranks without it installed. Something must be shorted. I'm too tired to go any farther with this tonight though since it's almost midnight here. Thanks for your help.
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Would it be a bad idea to ignore this issue?
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Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by D17VTECPOWER View Post
Would it be a bad idea to ignore this issue?
DependsŪ
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Old 07-14-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by ezone View Post
DependsŪ
Basically, I'm asking if ignoring this issue will strand me, damage something, burn my car down, or do something else nasty. I WILL NOT start it in gear, so no need to worry about that. Even if I did (which I won't), I always use the parking brake, so it's not going anywhere.
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by D17VTECPOWER View Post
Basically, I'm asking if ignoring this issue will
What do YOU think?
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Old 07-14-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by ezone View Post
What do YOU think?
I think it's fine to ignore.
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Old 07-21-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

I still didn't get an answer. Is this safe to ignore as long as I don't start it in gear?
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Old 07-21-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

You already came up with your own answer.
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Old 07-21-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by ezone View Post
You already came up with your own answer.
I know. I just want to make sure that this issue won't cause another problem or strand me if I ignore it.
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Old 07-21-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

It's my job to tell you it's broken, the government mandated safety starter interlock feature has been defeated disabled bypassed or broken and SHOULD be fixed correctly. The next decision is all on you. Congratulations your car is now in about 1986 safety standards.



I'd at least want to know exactly why it was done and know how well it was done. I wouldn't want a hairpin bypass jumper to fall out on a bump and not start on the next try.
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Old 07-21-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by ezone View Post
It's my job to tell you it's broken, the government mandated safety starter interlock feature has been defeated disabled bypassed or broken and SHOULD be fixed correctly. The next decision is all on you. Congratulations your car is now in about 1986 safety standards.



I'd at least want to know exactly why it was done and know how well it was done. I wouldn't want a hairpin bypass jumper to fall out on a bump and not start on the next try.
I did not bypass the starter interlock, and it used to work until recently. No one besides me has worked on this car since it's been in my possession. I think that the issue is inside the fusebox, but I need to do more testing to find out.

Update: It is in the fusebox. I checked for continuity between the 2 load side terminals on the fusebox, and there is continuity even with the relay out. But now that I messed with the relay, it won't start at all weather the relay is in or out and there is no longer continuity between the 2 load side terminals on the fusebox. Ever see a fusebox fail in this way?

Last edited by D17VTECPOWER; 07-21-2018 at 08:08 PM.
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Old 07-22-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Stuck (temporarily) relay?
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Old 07-22-2018
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Re: Engine cranks in any gear?

Originally Posted by ezone View Post
Stuck (temporarily) relay?
No. It's definately in the fusebox. There was continuity across the load side terminals on the fusebox even with no relay installed, but now it is completely open even with the relay in or the load side jumpered.
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