jessica19699

Hello all, this problem just developed yesterday I was leaving work and I went to start my car and it just cranked for about 10 secs I then put my foot on the gas and it finally started I brushed it off thinking nothing of it but after it sat all night I went to drive it to work today and it did the same thing(it seems to do it when the car is cold), the cars runs fine, idle is good ,3 months ago I had a similar issue with the idle being very sporadic and the car didn't want to start sometimes I then took it to Honda they diagnosed it and said since I had put a new head on it 6 months before(blown head gasket) the valves needed adjusted and the timing was off, they made the repair and it seemed to fix the issue now 3 months later this is starting to happen now i'm not sure if this is a major issue or what but could it be it needs another adjustment ?the car always started no problem after turning the key,also before Honda fixed it I had the crank sensor and cam sensor replaced so i'm not thinking that is the issue here(I was guessing at the idle issue before and had them changed out), spark plugs were changed not even a year ago also, any ideas or help is appreciated if this is something simple before I have to take it to Honda again. Thanks in advance


P.S. there is no check engine light on either

5.0Thunder

insert key into ignition, turn to on position without cranking, let it sit for 5 seconds, then crank it. Does it start easier or same?

I'd probably start the diagnosis with a fuel pressure test to ensure you're getting immediate pressure at the rail when the fuel pump turns on. Pump could be getting lazy on you.

I've ready something about the security system not recognizing the key immediately and causing this as well.

Colin42

could be a temp sensor giving an incorrect value as well

jessica19699

Thanks guys for the feedback I just had a guy friend here at work tell me he think it is the fuel pressure regulator based on my symptoms kind of sound like what u are describing othunder where is that located on a 2004 civic?I will check both these things out after I get home today and get back to you

mcnoople

Hondas don't have fuel pressure regulator problems or fuel pump problems like many other (GM) brands. You symptoms sound more like it is flooding. If you really want to look at the fuel pressure regulator you are in for some fun since it is submersed inside the fuel tank.

Do you happen to start your car for very short periods of time before this problem occurs. Something simple like starting the car to back it out of the garage and then turning it off again? This kind of behavior is known to cause symptoms like you are describing. Usually it only happens in cold weather and it happens when the owner had the car running for less than 30 seconds and then turned it off and let it sit for a while.

ezone

If your guy friend THINKS it could be (pressure regulator or whatever) that can be tested and proven before wasting money on unneeded parts replacements.
Again. (HINT: It's not a GM, the regulator is not a likely cause IMO and it's not a common failure item on these cars)



CEL is not on, but does it work?
Has it been checked for stored fault codes?
Got a scanner that can show live operating data? (This is where you can check for things like false temp sensor readings.)

Does it crank too slowly?
Does it crank at normal speed?

How poorly (or good) does it run immediately after you finally get it to start?
Does it puff a small amount of black smoke out the tailpipe when it finally starts?

Have you tried spritzing carb&throttle cleaner spray into the throttle body to see if that makes it fire up immediately? (or at least attempt to fire up)

Have you checked plugs---you would need to crank it a few seconds and have it fail to start, then remove the plugs immediately to see if they are bone dry (no fuel injected) or if they are wet, and figure out if they are wet with gasoline, or wet with antifreeze

jessica19699

ezone cel isn't on and it worked 3 months prior so i'm assuming it still does.

I haven't checked it for stored faults yet.it cranks at normal speed and after it has started it runs and idles fine, I haven't noticed any black smoke out the back either then again I do leave for work at 4 am so it is dark.

I haven't tried spraying any carb or throttle cleaner spray into the throttle body either.

Yesterday I tried what othunder has mentioned on here I stuck the key in without trying to start it I waited 5 secs then cranked it about 3 turns it sounded like it was going to start but didn't so I back off and then tried cranking it again while hitting the gas pedal and it started up, it sounded better than the previous tries but still wasn't normal and then just this morning this one had to be the worse

it is about 40 degrees here around 4am when I leave for work I went to start the car without waiting the five secs it cranked and cranked about 8 turns but didn't start
I backed off and tried it again it cranked about another 4 times then it did something I hadn't seen before it looked like it had skipped a crank turn (meaning it kind of just went dead) I still had the key turned to start but it didn't crank when this happened I noticed the battery light went out also when this happened I backed off it and then tried it again it then cranked a couple more times did the same thing like it fell dead then it just started re-cranking then I gave it some gas it kind of puttered like it was going to start I then backed off it again then tried cranking it again with my foot on the gas pedal and finally it turned over,


is it possible the valves or timing might need to be re-adjusted since I had it done 3 months earlier due to sporadic idle and intermittent start issues ? Or maybe a starter issue where the starter is about to die? i'm going to have the battery and started tested after work today providing it will let me get home

ezone

This certainly doesn't sound right, and a new question would be 'what happened to cause it?'

Was it a momentary power failure for the starter (did it sound like you let off the key then twisted it again, starter makes that loud clunk noise again as it re-engages?)

or did the engine fire a cylinder that 'kicked back' against the starter?

Did all the dash warning lights go dim when it happened, or did they stay bright?

Probably should be inspecting and testing all battery cable connections for both battery cables, the clamps, the wires, the attachment points on the starter (+ cable) and body/trans/engine (- cable)....and check the small wire at the starter for being to loose for a good connection

If you can get it to do this consistently then it might be easier to figure out why it's happening.


IDK if any of this has anything to do with the long crank time either.
Is the gas tank low when it cranks longer than usual? Or does it do it with a full tank too?

jessica19699

I was a momentary power failure or it seems like anyway, as far as I recall all the dash lights stayed bright but I did notice the battery light went out when the crank stopped, I will check the connections on the battery ect and i'm going to have the both tested today ,the gas tank has been full and half full at least when this has happened, it seem to happen when it is cold or been sitting awhile

jessica19699

I will check the battery cables ect, the lights seemed to stay bright but the battery light seemed to go out when the crank stopped, i'm going to have both battery and starter tested after work today.it only drops out for a second then it starts to crank again

5.0Thunder

I will say the starter pause (or struggle?) happens on my racecars when they get too much fuel. almost like one cylinder pops against the starter or maybe floods. Flooring the throttle on my racecars puts it in a "flood clear" mode so it clears the cylinders and fires the engine.

Not that hondas have the same feature, but maybe the engine is flooding.

That being said, I don't have knowledge of the particular control logic of these cars so I'll bow out of the thread for now. It sounds like the more knowledgeable people are here to help you Jessica. Just follow their checks/methods and you'll likely find the culprit soon.

jessica19699

Thanks for your help othunder I literally just took a co-worker here at work up to my car so he could hear what it does for himself for the last two days it has struggled to crank here at work after sitting all day and don't you know the car turned right over I didn't even hit the gas ,I normally never give it gas to start it but the last two days I step on the gas pedal (not flooring it) to help it get started and it has helped some, now i'm betting when I go to leave work here in another hour the car will do the same thing it had been doing ughh so frustrating it is mid 60s here and it seems to do it when it was cold in the early morning or been sitting for awhile.

jessica19699

So after my co-worker went up to check out the car and hear what it was doing and the car started with no problems yesterday I went to leave for the day an hour later and it started again with no issues, this morning coming into work it cranked about 8 times I gave it gas and it started I did turn the key on without starting it for a few secs before also not sure that made a difference or not, I also had the starter, alternator and battery checked yesterday they all 3 checked out good it looked like the cold cranking amps could be low around 500 cca not sure if it would cause the issues i'm having because it hasn't been below freeing yet and the battery isn't even 2 years old yet, I do have a friend of mine who is a mechanic checking it out for me this weekend.

thornygravy

I had very similar symptoms on my 04 pretty recently. Happened for months where it would be fine and then randomly give me a hard time starting, if I let go of the key and tried a couple seconds later it would start, or if I just kept persisting and let go of the key it would start.

brand new battery, so that wasn't it..

One day I stopped somewhere and it wouldn't start, like at all. Just relay clicks. Ended up being the starter. Which I hope is your issue because if you have a mechanic friend, it's a relatively cheap part, $80ish depending where you look.

I doubt it's your battery or alternator. Funny thing is while this was happening I took it to several people who all said my starter was fine. It's almost like it was intermittently failing until it just couldn't go anymore.

Hope you figure it out!

Wankenstein

That's pretty much the norm. Starter or solenoid contacts wear over time and typically a starter will become intermittent before failing completely.