*UPDATED AGAIN* SRT-4's Falling apart before 10,000 miles!! *UPDATED*
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Originally posted by nookiemonster
So JayFreazy you mean to tell me that you'd rather have your civic over a wrx, 1.8T, MSP, SRT-4 and the like? Imagine putting the 3500 into upgrading one of those cars and doing the ol comparo once again...I'm sure you'll find that they'd still outclass our poor civics. Comparing stock and modified cars is again apples and oranges.
So JayFreazy you mean to tell me that you'd rather have your civic over a wrx, 1.8T, MSP, SRT-4 and the like? Imagine putting the 3500 into upgrading one of those cars and doing the ol comparo once again...I'm sure you'll find that they'd still outclass our poor civics. Comparing stock and modified cars is again apples and oranges.
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You better start to realize that low-end torque is what we're looking for. Ricers always ignore it. Without it, HP is nothing. You may have all the HP in the world, but with only ~100lbs of torque, you are going to take a LOOOOOONNNNGGG time to accelerate to any significant speed, and hit your peak HP powerband. And no matter what turbo kit you toss on, our 1.7L D17A2 will never have as much torque as a 2.4L SRT-4 motor.
"Horsepower sells cars, torque wins races." -- Steve Saleen
You better start to realize that low-end torque is what we're looking for. Ricers always ignore it. Without it, HP is nothing. You may have all the HP in the world, but with only ~100lbs of torque, you are going to take a LOOOOOONNNNGGG time to accelerate to any significant speed, and hit your peak HP powerband. And no matter what turbo kit you toss on, our 1.7L D17A2 will never have as much torque as a 2.4L SRT-4 motor."Horsepower sells cars, torque wins races." -- Steve Saleen
Last edited by mk32382; Dec 6, 2003 at 10:06 PM.
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Rep Power: 0 Originally posted by S2000man01
neon coupe 4 door. my point was the neon platform.
4 years? hmm last time I checked neons were introduced around 95..... that would be 8 years.
I'm not comparing the SRT4 to a civic. But since you opened that can of worms... before the SRT4, quite honestly, the neon just doesn't have much street credibility. Let's say you'd go cruising and on the average night, you may run into some 12 or 13 second civics... but you'd be hard pressed to find a neon that runs that in the same night much less probably a year of cruising.
Like I said.. neons just weren't taking seriously and it has never been looked at as a "cool" sport compact car. To the average sport compact car crowd, if you said "which would you rather have... a neon or a civic" most would choose the civic.
On top of that, keep in mind that in Fast and Furious 2.... even though that movie was king of rice, even THEY TURNED DOWN the SRT4. They said they simply couldn't see putting a neon in a movie with the cars that were in it.... which included a few civics. (dodge tried desperately to get an SRT 4 in the movie) So if even the king of all rice movies turns down the neon, it simply further proves my point. The neon just was never taken seriously among the mainstream sport compact crowd.
neon coupe 4 door. my point was the neon platform.
4 years? hmm last time I checked neons were introduced around 95..... that would be 8 years.
I'm not comparing the SRT4 to a civic. But since you opened that can of worms... before the SRT4, quite honestly, the neon just doesn't have much street credibility. Let's say you'd go cruising and on the average night, you may run into some 12 or 13 second civics... but you'd be hard pressed to find a neon that runs that in the same night much less probably a year of cruising.
Like I said.. neons just weren't taking seriously and it has never been looked at as a "cool" sport compact car. To the average sport compact car crowd, if you said "which would you rather have... a neon or a civic" most would choose the civic.
On top of that, keep in mind that in Fast and Furious 2.... even though that movie was king of rice, even THEY TURNED DOWN the SRT4. They said they simply couldn't see putting a neon in a movie with the cars that were in it.... which included a few civics. (dodge tried desperately to get an SRT 4 in the movie) So if even the king of all rice movies turns down the neon, it simply further proves my point. The neon just was never taken seriously among the mainstream sport compact crowd.
First, it's a me2 car.
Second, the Japanese market for the car. If it wasn't for the Japanese aftermarket, there would NOT be a bunch of 12 or 13 sec Civic's. There just isn't enough aftermarket support for the the domestic compact cars. The domestic market is just starting to wake up (it's about fuggin time!) and support the market. Dodge is paving the way with the SRT-4 and soon we will see the Saturn Ion RedLine and then the Chevy Cobalt. The funny thing thing about the SRT-4 is even companies that only supported imports are now making parts for the car. To me, that speaks volumes.
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Rep Power: 0 I just have one question: What is wrong with a Neon?
Yes, it has it's problems. So what? All cars develop problems eventually. Even 'your' so-called reliable Civics. Yes, it's got a bland interior. It's not like a 7th gen has gold imbedded in the dash. You cannot compare a SRT-4 with a Civic. You can however compare a Neon with a Civic.
Neon / Civic
SRT-4 / Civic Si(R)
I have a Stage 1 on my SRT, and I still get 25-28 MPG. Is that as good as 40? No, but I'll almost guarentee that I'll have more fun in those 25 miles then you will in your 40.
And yes, Dodge probably did a bad thing with getting rid of the ACR, but what did Honda do? They got rid of the greatest Honda platform E_V_E_R: The CRX. And what did they replace it with? A shotty attempt at marketing towards the 16-24 'street racers'
I guess I'm trying to say one thing with this post ... be a car lover. Not a Honda, not a Dodge, just a car.
And don't even think that I'm flaming Honda, because, as it states in my signature, I own two. One that is currently awaiting a b20 VTEC swap
Yes, it has it's problems. So what? All cars develop problems eventually. Even 'your' so-called reliable Civics. Yes, it's got a bland interior. It's not like a 7th gen has gold imbedded in the dash. You cannot compare a SRT-4 with a Civic. You can however compare a Neon with a Civic.
Neon / Civic
SRT-4 / Civic Si(R)
I have a Stage 1 on my SRT, and I still get 25-28 MPG. Is that as good as 40? No, but I'll almost guarentee that I'll have more fun in those 25 miles then you will in your 40.
And yes, Dodge probably did a bad thing with getting rid of the ACR, but what did Honda do? They got rid of the greatest Honda platform E_V_E_R: The CRX. And what did they replace it with? A shotty attempt at marketing towards the 16-24 'street racers'
I guess I'm trying to say one thing with this post ... be a car lover. Not a Honda, not a Dodge, just a car.
And don't even think that I'm flaming Honda, because, as it states in my signature, I own two. One that is currently awaiting a b20 VTEC swap
just wanted to say that i ALMOST bought one of those pieces of crap.. but when the dealer tried to shove it down my throat, i knew not to touch one with a ten foot pole. thanks to my buddy eric aka Navyedoc.. i have kick *** 2004 honda civic sedan that i love. i wouldn't own a neon if they were givin em away! but i must say the 99 dodge ram 1500 sport i bought my husband is a great truck, i just think their cars suck ***.
wendy
wendy
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Rep Power: 0 Originally posted by navyedoc
just wanted to say that i ALMOST bought one of those pieces of crap.. but when the dealer tried to shove it down my throat, i knew not to touch one with a ten foot pole. thanks to my buddy eric aka Navyedoc.. i have kick *** 2004 honda civic sedan that i love. i wouldn't own a neon if they were givin em away! but i must say the 99 dodge ram 1500 sport i bought my husband is a great truck, i just think their cars suck ***.
wendy
just wanted to say that i ALMOST bought one of those pieces of crap.. but when the dealer tried to shove it down my throat, i knew not to touch one with a ten foot pole. thanks to my buddy eric aka Navyedoc.. i have kick *** 2004 honda civic sedan that i love. i wouldn't own a neon if they were givin em away! but i must say the 99 dodge ram 1500 sport i bought my husband is a great truck, i just think their cars suck ***.
wendy
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Rep Power: 0 Originally posted by navyedoc
my friend just bought one of them and i beat him with my STOCK DX (YEA im in the navy what do you expect?).. oh and my cars an auto too
my friend just bought one of them and i beat him with my STOCK DX (YEA im in the navy what do you expect?).. oh and my cars an auto too
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Rep Power: 0 Wait I hope I am just reading this wrong. You do realize we are not talking about regular run of the mill neons, but rather the turboed SRT-4 with hp in the high 2's right? If you say you beat one of those....
:zbsflag:
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Rep Power: 0 Originally posted by navyedoc
why do you come to A 7thgencivic to bash our cars? clearly if it was as good as you assume it is... you wouldn't need to be here to back yo **** up
why do you come to A 7thgencivic to bash our cars? clearly if it was as good as you assume it is... you wouldn't need to be here to back yo **** up
uh yeah i drive their cars too.. im not saying i dont like dodge, because obviously i own one.. i just dont like the cars.. for the money you spend it just doesn't seem like a valuable investment, in my oppinion. i can spend 15,000 or a vic or a neon.. im going to take a vic. i can spend 22,000 or so (not sure how much they run) for a accord or a stratus, im gonna take an accord. from the people i know who own hondas and doges of all types, i would choose a honda over a dodge car anyday.
Ok, I'm going to be serious one time with this post.
My first car was a 97 Monte Carlo Z34 (got it at 59k miles), fast car with Borla Exhaust, Intake and some other crap (i think it came close to 250hp witht he mods), I got that car because I was a dumb@ss and I did not realize how importent it was for a car to acctually be driven daily without constantly worrying about it. Sure it was fun to drive, floor that fvcker and get sucked into the seat was fun, very fun until all my paychecks started going into it to keep it running.
At 71k mile it developed MAJOR oil leak, by 75k miles alternator, fuel pump, radio and pretty much a lot of things started going BESIDES the Tranny and the Engine. By 80k miles with more then 3k put into for JUST repairs it had to go. Many of my friends who owned GM cars, Dodges.. domestics for the most part all told me the same thing, while owning the car it was always in need of some repair. Every domestic my relatives owned, same story for the most part.
Then I realized that all the people who said that domestics are a joke were right and cars like Honda, Toyota or Nissan were the way to go. I will NEVER own a domestic because I need a car that will not be a pain in the @ss. I'm not saying that ALL domestics are built poorly, but it is safe to say that the MAJORTIRY is built poorly, why, I dont know.
Give the SRT three or four years of driving and when you put on more miles taking it to the dealership for repairs then actually racing it, then you come and talk to us. 04 SRT starts at around $20k, give it 4 years and it will be worth around 7-8k because I think there is no one stupid enough to buy a used Dodge Neon, ESSPECIALLY one with a turbo in it... at leats I hope. 04 Civic starts at around 17k, in 4 years it will be worth around 11k and lets not forget that the Civic is a 115hp simple car compared to the 230hp (or whatever it is) SRT4.
Oh yes, that 7 year 70k miles WARRENTY a couple mentioned is just a POWER TRAIN warrenty that only covers the drive train (engine, tranny and transaxel). The bumper to bumper warrentry on the SRT4 is only 36k miles and if you did not have any problems with the car before 36k, I guarantee problems afterwards that you will have to pay for. So this is where I'm going with this:
The SRT4 is a horrible investment because it will lose value very fast, when the bumper-bumper warranty runs out you will have to spend money to fix the car and selling it will be a huge chllenge.
There are two types of people who would buy the SRT4:
1) people who love cars and know how to work on them, people who race them at organized tracks, people who know how to fix cars and people who are willing to take the SRT4 and make it a 10 second car.
2) people who are idiots. people who take the SRT4 and go brag about how fast it is without any knowlege of how it works. the people who just know that the car has a turbo and it can smoke otehr 4 cylinder imports. people who go around bragging that the car is ONLY 20k and by far the best sports car you can get for the money (there is a reason why it is only 20k, give the car 3 years and you will find out why )
Bottom line is that if you are #1, then I understand why you got the SRT. If you are #2 then you are an idiot...... and it seems that most people who posted here seem to fit #2 pretty well.
sorry for the long post
My first car was a 97 Monte Carlo Z34 (got it at 59k miles), fast car with Borla Exhaust, Intake and some other crap (i think it came close to 250hp witht he mods), I got that car because I was a dumb@ss and I did not realize how importent it was for a car to acctually be driven daily without constantly worrying about it. Sure it was fun to drive, floor that fvcker and get sucked into the seat was fun, very fun until all my paychecks started going into it to keep it running.
At 71k mile it developed MAJOR oil leak, by 75k miles alternator, fuel pump, radio and pretty much a lot of things started going BESIDES the Tranny and the Engine. By 80k miles with more then 3k put into for JUST repairs it had to go. Many of my friends who owned GM cars, Dodges.. domestics for the most part all told me the same thing, while owning the car it was always in need of some repair. Every domestic my relatives owned, same story for the most part.
Then I realized that all the people who said that domestics are a joke were right and cars like Honda, Toyota or Nissan were the way to go. I will NEVER own a domestic because I need a car that will not be a pain in the @ss. I'm not saying that ALL domestics are built poorly, but it is safe to say that the MAJORTIRY is built poorly, why, I dont know.
Give the SRT three or four years of driving and when you put on more miles taking it to the dealership for repairs then actually racing it, then you come and talk to us. 04 SRT starts at around $20k, give it 4 years and it will be worth around 7-8k because I think there is no one stupid enough to buy a used Dodge Neon, ESSPECIALLY one with a turbo in it... at leats I hope. 04 Civic starts at around 17k, in 4 years it will be worth around 11k and lets not forget that the Civic is a 115hp simple car compared to the 230hp (or whatever it is) SRT4.
Oh yes, that 7 year 70k miles WARRENTY a couple mentioned is just a POWER TRAIN warrenty that only covers the drive train (engine, tranny and transaxel). The bumper to bumper warrentry on the SRT4 is only 36k miles and if you did not have any problems with the car before 36k, I guarantee problems afterwards that you will have to pay for. So this is where I'm going with this:
The SRT4 is a horrible investment because it will lose value very fast, when the bumper-bumper warranty runs out you will have to spend money to fix the car and selling it will be a huge chllenge.
There are two types of people who would buy the SRT4:
1) people who love cars and know how to work on them, people who race them at organized tracks, people who know how to fix cars and people who are willing to take the SRT4 and make it a 10 second car.
2) people who are idiots. people who take the SRT4 and go brag about how fast it is without any knowlege of how it works. the people who just know that the car has a turbo and it can smoke otehr 4 cylinder imports. people who go around bragging that the car is ONLY 20k and by far the best sports car you can get for the money (there is a reason why it is only 20k, give the car 3 years and you will find out why
) Bottom line is that if you are #1, then I understand why you got the SRT. If you are #2 then you are an idiot...... and it seems that most people who posted here seem to fit #2 pretty well.
sorry for the long post
Last edited by HustleLikeMOFO; Dec 6, 2003 at 11:28 PM.
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Rep Power: 0 Originally posted by navyedoc
oh my bad.. i thought you ment a run of the mill neon.. but still the SRT-4 looks nice.. not worth the cash
oh my bad.. i thought you ment a run of the mill neon.. but still the SRT-4 looks nice.. not worth the cash
Damn, that hurt....... If I were you, I would stop running your gums because you obviously have no idea what you are talking about. Can you name another car that goes 0-60 in 5.4 seconds AND is under 21K? How about a 16g turbo & Valeo FMIC that is fully factory warrentied for under 21k?
Again, I'm not bashing Honda's, just ones intelect...
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Rep Power: 0 HustleLikeMOFO, I think you are one of the biggest idiots in this thread.
So you can predict the future, huh? You are SO MISINFORMED, it is not even funny. How about you read some articles and educate your dumbass AND then speak.
So you can predict the future, huh? You are SO MISINFORMED, it is not even funny. How about you read some articles and educate your dumbass AND then speak.
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From: Chelsea, Michigan
Rep Power: 0 My friends dad is one of the top suspension engineers at DaimlerChrysler and he was one of a few that got to do quality testing by taking the car and driving it for the whole summer in Michigan (which has a ton of sh!tty roads and even more unpaved roads everywhere). Although the car has some minor problems, it will prove to be quite sturdy in the long run (the engine and suspension) as for the rest of the car and the build quality, that may be questionable, but the car will not end up as bad as some of you predict.
Would you predict this for the PT Cruiser Turbo also, because they are the same engine...
Personally, I severely dislike the SRT-4, they are trying to make it something its not...cool and popular. If they had chosen to do this on a stratus coupe with a bit better design Id say that would kick ***. But they were reaching with the Neon, its ugly, its got a bad rep, and did I mention its ugly.
Would you predict this for the PT Cruiser Turbo also, because they are the same engine...
Personally, I severely dislike the SRT-4, they are trying to make it something its not...cool and popular. If they had chosen to do this on a stratus coupe with a bit better design Id say that would kick ***. But they were reaching with the Neon, its ugly, its got a bad rep, and did I mention its ugly.
Go Pistons!
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From: Troy,MI
Rep Power: 0 Originally posted by CivicHX01
"I love my Honda like I love my ganja"
i dunno why... but this thread makes me think of that song... lolz
"I love my Honda like I love my ganja"
i dunno why... but this thread makes me think of that song... lolz
