Roxie

So I was perusing ebay for Mugen accessories, and came across a few of these "Mugen" steering wheels. I thought that for the cheap prices I might consider one. I know the whole airbag/safety/etc. argument about them, and I am not going to have an airbag free wheel until I have a 4 point harness inside my car (the Schroth that's DOT approved). I believe in safety, but I think a 4 point harness would be better in a crash than an airbag. Plus, I'm not completely sold on airbags being beneficial. But that's a whole different can of worms here.

ANYWAYS... curious if anyone has seen this particular one http://www.ebay.com/itm/JDM-HONDA-MUGEN-POWER-320MM-STEERING-WHEEL-HORN-HORN-BUTTON-W-HUB-ADAPTER-/230746297905?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories &fits=Year%3A2002|Make%3AHonda|Model%3ACivic|Submo del%3AEX&hash=item35b98d1631&vxp=mtr

I'm about 99.9999999999999% sure this is a fake, but I personally don't care about that. Anyone know if this will mount up without much of a hassle? Or, do you know someone who's bought one of these knock offs and not had a good experience overall? Just is a style of steering wheel I like, and can't complain about the pric. However, I'm thinking there's some sort of problem with it (mounting, or some sort of functionality) since it is so cheap. Suggestions?

Muirsy

http://youtu.be/SMxB4RpCDzA

you get what you pay for..

MindBomber

That's fake.

4 point harnesses also aren't overly safe when used alone, it's really important that they be paired with a good quality racing seat. You might (probably) already know that, but just to add.

Roxie

Noted lol. I figured it wouldn't be of the utmost quality, but DAMN! I mean hell, I'd test it the same way soon as I bought it. Would ultimately be a disappointing experience, but a lesson learned the hard way. Glad you posted that

I do know it's better to use it with a racing seat, for safety reasons. However, from what I've seen in crash test results, using the Schroth with a stock seat seems to be performing even better than your stock 2 point belt. Correct me if I'm wrong though, as I am no expert on safety belts/harnesses. I would buy the harness first, as I'd prefer to use a 4 point on the road than a 2 point. But, I would buy a proper racing seat soon after as the harness would perform better with it. Just my own personal preference, as I do mostly freeway driving (and most crash tests are based around in-town speeds). Just a way for me to feel safer while driving, regardless of how fast my car is

Aetoc

iTrader: (1)

If you're going to go fake, make sure the spokes on the wheel are big, and have some sort of convex shape to them to disperse any stresses over the whole thing. My wheel is an NRG which I bought used for $85. It's got a bit of flex to it if you reef on it, but because of its shape, it not going to bend that easily. Just don't go racing with a cheap wheel :P

lowlife9

if you use a 4 point without a roll cage and your car rolls over say goodbye to your head.

Roxie

Wasn't planning on racing with it lol. Just saw the style, and liked it is all haha. I have a few other wheels I'm considering, just can't afford a few hundred for a steering wheel right now.

So you're saying that a safety belt/harness does you zero good in a rollover crash unless you have a roll cage. Therefore; everyone needs a roll cage, regardless of what seat belt they wear. Makes perfect sense mate.

lazlong

Airbags don't save lives, seatbelts do. The only reason for airbags is to "prevent" more injuries. I put the quotes in because in a 70mph wreck the airbag hurt me worse than the actual wreck did.

lazlong

Yeah, most vehicles have no roof support if you flip 'em.

Roxie

That's how I see it. I've met plenty of people who've been hurt by airbags more than the rest of the wreck. Plus, airbags are designed for a specific distance from the person. For shorter people (like me, at 5'5'') it becomes a big safety hazard since we sit closer to the wheel than a taller person. Airbags, in my opinion, are only safe for the taller population.

That I do know. However, it doesn't matter what restraint you use in a roll over, the roof is still weak. So... I don't see why a 4 point is more dangerous than a 2 point in that respect. Maybe a 2 point might let you go in that kind of crash, which MIGHT save you by ejecting you from the car, therefore not shearing your head off. But we all see the fault in that logic. Just the context doesn't make sense to me.

maxtierney

iTrader: (5)

The reason 4/5 Point Belts are more dangerous without a cage in a rollover is that you can't duck down or lean to the side in a rollover. In a two point, you have that ability. In a 4 point, your head and torso are stuck in the vertical position. You'll be about 18" shorter if you do survive.

lazlong

lmao

MindBomber

The other issue I understand that exists with using a four point harness stands in using it without a bucket seat, but this is far from something I am well versed in. A four point used in conjunction with a standard seat, which allows your body to move side to side, forward and back, can harm you because the belt itself has no give. Where in a bucket seat, that's a part of a complete safety system, the belt and seat work together to not allow you any movement. Imagine a side impact with a standard seat and four point harness, your body would shift to one side resulting in your neck hitting the strap of the belt HARD, that force is enough to inflict injury on a very sensitive spot.

I also feel compelled, although it's somewhat irrelevant to this discussion, that you would still be 18" short if you relied on a shiny blue Cusco cage.

Roxie

Now that makes much more sense. However, I don't see how people will actually have much of a reaction time to prevent any harm coming to them in a rollover. Plus, I do know that with your typical vehicle, a single roll is survivable. It's when they roll over multiple times that it becomes very dangerous. Don't remember where I heard it, but the reason was due to the windscreen absorbing the impact on the first roll (via shattering and lessening the load on the supporting beams that hold the roof up). After the first roll, everything has been weakened. Can't say it's true, but it makes enough sense to me. Don't know if anyone has anything to refute that though.

The bucket seat part I can fully understand. My question then becomes: what is classified as a bucket seat? I've sat in some that don't seem to hold you properly, but then again it's the stock ones that feel that way to me. Haven't been in any aftermarket seats that felt that way.

Now, with the use of the Schroth harness and factory seats (not talking about any/all 4 points out there), does anyone know if it's actually a bad combination? I saw a DIY on how to install it on here or the 7th gen forums, but it was used with an aftermarket racing seat. Aside from that, I haven't seen much about them on the forums. Anyone know for a fact whether they are a good/bad combination? I remember seeing some information from (most likely) Schroth talking about the use with stock seats, but it was not manufacturer specific. I've never seen much for or against the use of these with the stock seats, or even about the use for daily driving. Anyone have actual experience, or at least a friend of a friend to say anything? Maybe some research they found? I've not found much besides people selling them, or manufacturer info that is very generic.

lazlong

A bucket seat should fit like the name implies, like you're sitting in a bucket. Just a word of caution: If you do much driving at all a properly fit seat and harness will be uncomfortable as hell after a while. It's bearable when racing 'cause, well, you're racing. lol. The factory seats and seatbelts should be adequate to keep you're body in. If you're really worried about safety you should be worried about you're arms and head flailing about. I suppose that's where the airbags come in. I guess just keep you're thumbs in the wheel when the bags go off and your arms won't flail about.

Roxie

I'm willing to sacrifice comfort for safety on my side of the car. I can't drive comfortably to begin with since I have muscle problems in my back as it is. I've rode in racing seats for a while before, and I don't have much a problem with them. I typically don't drive long stints anyways, and I am almost never awake to drive during rush hour (nor am I willing to work a job where I drive in that ungodly time). I'm fine with compromising comfort for safety. I just want to get rid of my airbag and use a harness because, as stated before, I don't like airbags. I don't want to be in a crash and have the airbag deploy. I sit too close to the wheel that it wouldn't be properly inflated when I make contact with it. Wish this wasn't the case, but I'm mostly torso not legs :/

lowlife9

if you didn't know your stock seat is designed to give when enough pressure is added to it so in case of a roll over your seat will go back preventing your head from being squashed. now with a harness bar behind your seat thats impossible.so basically without a proper roll cage its just for looks and therefore rice. i have personal experience being in a roll over if i had been using a 4 point harness i would be dead rite now.

Roxie

Maybe I should have clarified... The Schroth Rallye 4. I don't need a harness bar for this one, and that's one of the reasons I'm getting it. So, anyone have information on anything other than a rollover?

lowlife9

ahh well then the only problem i can see with that is losing a rear passenger seat when you use it but what's wrong with your stock seatbelt ???

Roxie

As I've mentioned before, I'd like to be as safe as possible in my car. Not only am I primarily a freeway driver, but I also drive a bit faster than most people on the road. I'm not aggressive, but I drive my car pretty hard for the most part. Also, I live in Phoenix AZ, which the drivers here are just horrid.

Also, being that I'm a short person, I sit closer to an airbag. Therefore, I'm not a fan of airbags exploding in my face. It probably will not be fully inflated when I hit it, and I'm not willing to take the chance of being hit like a boxer's punch. I've had enough of that when I boxed lol. I would prefer a 4 point harness over a 3 point and airbag combo any day. I'd probably be hurt more by an airbag with my stature, than if it didn't go off.

maxtierney

iTrader: (5)

It seems that you are pretty set on getting the 4 point, so more power to you. Here's my advice then. In order to make it work, and as safe as possible, you'll need to keep your seat as upright as possible - to maximize the lateral and thigh supports. The more lean you have in the Civic's stock seats, the more you will be sliding around within the restraints. This is not a good thing. I'd drive around in this position before you buy/install the belts, because this is how you will sitting everywhere you go - Old Asian Lady style. No gangsta lean. While practicing this, make sure you never lean forward more than 2", or you've voided the test run. Make sure you have everything within arms distance, cause you won't get to it, unless you unbuckle. I've been in 5 point harnesses before. It's tolerable on the track, focusing on the road or for short periods in town, but it gets old after a while. Definitely not the way I like to drive around every day. I like my freedom of movement. I'm not trying to discourage you, I'm just letting you know what to expect. Disarming the airbag and extinguishing the SRS light is another topic for later.

Roxie

Glad you're giving me the heads up. I Will definitely try that. I typically don't have much of a lean in my seat, but I've straightened it a bit so it's practically up right. I usually don't move much in my car to begin with, but I'll keep note of it. The nice thing about the Schroth is it's side by side with your normal 3 point. So I can switch belts if needed.

Yeah, disarming the airbag is totally a whole different headache, but it's something I'll get to when I swap steering wheels.