Running Riot

ok so i had to head resurfaced, machined bench tested etc. now im having what seems to be leaking headgasket issues. I am using a Buddy Club head gasket so I would think that the head gasket isn't failing and I;m using arp head studs bolts etc. i'm leaning more towards human interface error then machanical error. My question is, i came across a thread somewhere that said the studs had to be retorqued after 500 miles or something like that and I can't find the thread again. I was wondering if someone out there knew if there was a retorque interval? I looked on arps website and emailed them and got no response. Im running a p30 b16a. any help would be great.

The bitch is hard to start after i drive it hard, its fine when i drive it conservatively or for a long period of time. Plugs always foul, and it almost won't start at all when its cold outside. I've put 3,000 miles on it since i got the head done and have had over heating problems since. It's never been in the red but had gotten hot a couple times. If i'm missing something please tell me.

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

What symptoms are you having that make you think its a headgasket issue?

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

only thing i can think of is the tightening order and torque wasnt followed. or its just too much hp. are you using the right heat range of plug? do they have white deposits? is coolant burning and being lost?

Running Riot

milky brown stuff under oil cap is one symptom. I mean i know it is the head gasket what im trying to get at is, i heard from someone that after the first 500 miles the head bolts had to be retorqued. I need to know if this is true or not so i can go back and set the mechanic that worked on my car on fire. I am completely sure that he under torqued the head studs. am i correct in my belief that the arp head studs require more torque then the stock ones?

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

yeah they should. but ive never heard about retorquing them again later. thats something you need to find out about arp. the honda manual does not mention anything about retorquing.

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

Lucky number 7: https://www.civicforums.com/forums/7...000-miles.html

As for torque, I think its just the OEM spec, nothing more. (If you find info proving otherwise, let me know!)

Running Riot

this is from a mod on honda-tech that i guess works for arp

"60ft lbs is when using ''ARP Moly Lube'' and 80ft lbs is when using engine oil.

Torque in 3 steps 10-20 wait for a bit (15-20mins) loosen then do it again all the way to a max of 60ft lbs. ( I do this process 3 times on heads & mains) Reason is because stud stretch for each individual stud is irregular. You'll notice after torquing all heads studs then loosening them that you don't use the same force loosening them."

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

Lets back up, I was under the impression ARP studs arent supposed to stretch like stock studs do... Which is why everyone buys them... and now your talking about stud stretch?

Running Riot

i could be wrong, but if the head studs aren't torqued in proper order/force the bolts will stretch regardless of whether they are stock or not.

Another quick ? I'm starting to think that i may just have a slow leak in the gasket. Its a buddy club gasket so i know it's good ****. I've driven cars with blown head gaskets and they run like ****. Mine is only shitty at idle and it consumes a slight amount of coolant, smokes out coolant on start up but after the car runs no smoke. i don't smell coolant when the heater is on and the car runs fine.

so with that being said, do you guys think i could just retorque the headstuds and maybe that will fix it? or do you guys think i should just replace the gasket again.

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

Since you dont have to pull the head to retorque the studs, make sure they are all within spec. If you still experience problems a few days after that, then replace it. Dont bother wasting money that doesnt need to be spent.

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

if you do replace the gasket, just go with oem. its prolly the best you will find and if you are blowing gaskets, then you have a different problem. you want the gasket to fail first, otherwise it could blow the whole motor. using these heavy duty metal gaskets is just trying to wrongly cover up a problem, usually because of bad tuning or hi compression.

Running Riot

The only reason I went with the BC headgasket in the first place is because it is a 2-layer instead of the 3 layer oem. I wanted the higher compression to compliment my other mods. If i use the oem head gasket ill drop below 11.0:1 right now i'm between 11:1-11:3. I'll give tightening the head a try and see what happens.

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

well, hi compression and turbos = blown headgaskets. you should be trying to lower the compression as much as possible. 11:1 is crazy for a turbo motor. what is your cam timing set at? and please tell me you have adjustable cam gears that were tuned on a dyno lol.

Running Riot

Its all motor build with ctr cams. This morning with a cool engine I pulled the valve cover and cams off and retorqued the bolts to 80ft/lbs and yeah they were in the right sequence but waaaaaay too loose and when I say loose I mran the torque wrench went 15 minutes or about 45 degrees befoire the ratchet clicked at 80 si think they were done at 45ft/lbs. I sprayed everything down with brake cleaner and cleaned the tec screen while I had the valve cover off. Put everything back on dialed in the diz cleaned off the plug deposits and tonight I'm going to drain the oil and run castrol deisel oil for a while both for better lubrication and for cleaning agents. But anyways

Put everything back together and god damn it sounds so much better starts right up no smoke hesitation rough idle and it pulls like it ought to. I'm convinced that's what the problem was and if I hadn't spent the extra cabbage on the arps and the buddy club gasket I would have been up **** creek and spend lotsa moolah. The old saying is true you get what you pay for and buying **** parts costs you more in the long run. No man is rich enough to afford cheap products. We'll see how th coolant level does for the next few days I hope this serves as a tool to others in my situation in the future... As long as the nubs learn to search. But I regress. Thanks again you two ya'll are always a big help.

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

ah okay i thought you had turbo for some reason. glad you got it working again. you cant always trust mechanics work these days, or maybe the studs just loosened.

Running Riot

very true. although if i had to guess which one is more likely, loosening arp studs or shoddy mechanic work, i'm leaning more towards the latter.

KYF 671

sounds like you figured it out and i would not go back to that tech that fixed it the first time seems like you did great for yourself. have fun drive it like you stole it.

Running Riot

i had a quick question for anyone still subscribed to this thread. is there any other way that coolant can get to the combustion chamber? i.e. bad iac down a plenum etc? just a thought