MindBomber

With at least three members seriously considering doing a k-swap and ongoing interest from the general community here, I feel it's time we have an official k-swap thread.

Please place any k-swap questions, thoughts, ideas or points of interest here.


I'll start it off, k-series mounts for engine swaps are insanely expensive, does anyone feel that DC5 mounts could be made to work with relative ease safely?

MindBomber

Innovative mounts for k-series swaps are only $400, they're stamped steel not billet, but a less expensive option none the less.
http://www.hybrid-racing.com/store/i...mount-kit.html

I found hybrid racing k-swap mounts for only $500 shipped here:
http://www.buyimportperformance.com/...SK1_p/esk1.htm

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.... As much as I agree going for the cheaper mounts Hasport are proven to work well and for the extra hundred bucks (They CAN be had for 500 shipped) I think I'd go for the billet... I mean, your spending 5k ish on a swap you might as well spend the extra hundred bucks on mounts. THAT being said if you save 100 dollars here and there in the end the swap can cost you a lot less. It's a crapshoot so you kind of have to decide yourself which route your going to take.

MindBomber

The thing about saving $100 on mounts is that if you do that on 10 different things during the swap, then you save yourself a $1000 overall, that pays for a k-pro ecu. Innovative mounts are well proven, I wouldn't have any concerns with quality just because they're stamped steel and not billet. I wonder what the actual advantage of going with the solid billet is aside from bling.


Edit: Did some research and the only advantage to the billet mounts is the bling factor of shiny aluminium, but they tend to oxidize and need to be re-polished frequently. Theoretically billet might be slightly stronger since they're one piece, but steel is also stronger than aluminium so it's a toss up on strength.

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

Nice find... I'm going to go with the steel I think, especially since they are cheaper. A big step towards the swap happened today... I told the wife and she OKAYd it.. It's just a matter of putting money away, I'll be doing this next February. I know that's a ways away but I need to prepare for all this.

MindBomber

I think I'll be doing it around the same time.
Picking up one or two of the parts a month and it shouldn't be to hard, I'm going to go with a k20a3 to start. People hate on it so much, but it's really not a bad engine, the original x-production DIY was done with one if memory serves.


I hope this thread isn't to redundant, there are older k-swap threads and faqs, but a lot of new info has come out since they were made.

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

I'm going K20Z3 I think... since they are newer engines with low mileage and the price is hardly different from K20A2

MindBomber

k20z3 would be my choice of engines if budget weren't as much of a concern, if I can get the k20a3 in now and then graduate to a z3 later I'll be happy.

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

Yeea.. I've been putting some thought into it and the car will be 6-7 years old when I do swap with over 200k on it. I did some driving today redlining the D17 and it runs okay... I think the noise I heard the other day was just the exhaust leak not completly welded up but it still makes other noises that I can't figure out what they are (bottom end knock). That's my main reason for a swap. The more I research it the less I want to do it

MindBomber

I want to do it, then I don't want to do it, then I want to do it. It's so expensive and I don't want to one of those people who sinks a ton of money into a car and never sees it again, I just want a reliable daily driver for years to come until I can afford something higher end. My transmission is going, I don't want another unreliable d17 auto and a manual swap isn't much less expensive than a k20a3 with a lot more power.

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

I was thinking on doing on mine when the time comes and the D17 dies out, but would you recommend just getting an engine and dropping in the bay?

If not, what would be some good parts to change over before dropping in the vay?


(:P)

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

I'm in the same boat... I do wanna do it then I don't... I'm afraid to eff it up but then again it's not much more advanced than **** i've already done... It just costs a lot more money than anything I've ever done.

D5cIvIc

iTrader: (18)

kswaps are over-rated. Buy a faster car to start out with.

Kswaps are not all that great.

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

Hrm... it's a good way to make a civic faster. I generally like the way the civic looks I just want it to have some more pep... That and I don't want to spend 12k on a newer, faster car. I also don't want to buy a used one that hasn't been taken care of since I've taken damn good care of this one. But your right, in a sense they are over rated.. hence why I can't make up my mind haha.

ricanswt

iTrader: (1)

tbohar, I was in the same boat when I blew my D17 head gasket. Considering I am a jobless college student at this time I decided to just put a stage 1 cam in the engine when i fix the gasket. This is on my tax return btw.

When I do get a job, a K20/24 engine swap is a much nicer option for me than a whole new car. Especially since I want the new Lotus Elise when it arrives.

We are veering off topic though heh.

Any thoughts on the new K24's, in the new SI, as a swap option? Is it similar to the TSX engine? K24 from the TSX is cheaper to get than the K20.

MindBomber

Anything done on a Civic is over rated, they're fwd 4 cylinder cars designed to be cheap and economical.

Spending $4-5k on a k-swap and breathing new life into a car for a few years until you have a bigger budget to buy something else is the incentive for Tom and I. When I'm finished grad school I want to buy an M3, that's not happening for another few years though and my transmission is.... unhappy


There's an amazing tuning community in Vancouver with shops that are unbelievably supportive, so I'm going to put that to work when I do my swap. I plan on pulling the engine, doing the rear five lug swap, and probably setting the new engine in myself and then towing it to a shop to let them finish. Taking **** apart is cake, it's putting it back together that takes skill.

Omg this is definitely a Honda site, we're starting to discuss swapping an engine that was just released.

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

I'm just wondering the value of it.. I plan to drive this car for a long time so I want one with low mileage.. Hmmm.. I'm starting to doubt all this will ever happen though

D5cIvIc

iTrader: (18)

You don't think 4-5k is all you're going to spend are you? You'll always run into things that will nickle and dime you which will end up costing much more. Why even waste your time swapping in an A3 when it's not even thy much faster than the d17?

If you plan on swapping in a motor it might as well as be something bigger and faster. Save a bit longer to so it all in one shot.

You guys dint realize is that swapping even in a stock k20a2 is still going to feel slow. I mean pretty dam slow.

After that you'll realize you want more power and you'll buy more stuff to end up realizing It's still slow unless you rev it past 5k all the time.

Take it from me, stock k20a2 swaps will be slow.

K20a3 swap is completely useless and a waste if time. You'll regret the a3.

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

I forgot to add that I'd be doing all the labor myself except the tuning of course.. I did some research and a Kpro is a must. I don't care much for getting my key reflashed etc. Its viable but it would cost 6000 dollars to do properly, including AC. That's for a Z3 or A2. ^I agree with that post to some extent, A2 is still slow but its got more potential than the D17... hmm.... when the difference is replace the D17, get a K20, or buy a new car though.. that's when it gets interesting.

D5cIvIc

iTrader: (18)

I never said anything aboutthe k20 not having potential. I just wanted to point out that's not all you're going to spend after you're done.

How do I know? Because I've been there done that

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

Haha I agree with you. I swapped an H22 into a 92 honda accord coupe and expected to spend 4k and I ended up spending like 7. That's also a MUCH easier swap. Nowadays you can do that swap for a lot cheaper but this was like 8 years ago H22s were pricey then. I will say though the car did feel pretty fast after the swap, even though it was roughly an 80hp increase... Same as D17 - K20

MindBomber

Prices have come down a lot of k-series parts and engines, someone offered to sell me a totalled DC5 base for $1800, at one point you couldn't buy an k20a3 for that price. I'm not saying it's possible to do a k-swap on the cheap, everything k is expensive, but it's not impossible to it for between $5-6k.

My reason for doing a k20a3 is simple, I'm building a k20 engine already. Finishing it and doing the swap makes things more complicated, so I rather just spend $500 on a k20a3 and get it and a manual trans in my car without having to rush the engine build. Once I finish the engine it will be a simple bolt in swap.

mac25

uhhh will a W16 bolt up to my auto tranny? that seems like a faster engine then the d17. well i need kpro?














=D

MindBomber

This is the K-series thread, not the w-series thread.... GTFO!!!

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

I'm calculating around 6400 dollars for a K20Z3 installed not tuned with 8000 miles on it with KPRO as long as there are no snags and there will be with Hasport mounts. I haven't actually priced out a few items but here is the breakdown Austin. This is for not working A/C.

Engine 3500 *
Mounts 550
Kpro 900
Subframe 500$?
Rad 150
Fans 100
Hoses 40
Throttle Cable - 50
Fuel Line - 50
Purge Line - 50
AC line - 100
Clutch Line - 40
P/S hose - 300
P/S return - 80
P/S reser - 80

*2010 Honda Civic Si K20Z3 Complete Swap [12,xxxKM] (Including: Engine, LSD Transmission, Engine Harness, ECU, Drive Shafts, Shifter Box, Shifter Cables)

I think that's everything needed as far as the big stuff goes. Doing some searching the small parts can be had for a lot cheaper than listed but it's good to overshoot. Count me out for now lol..

MindBomber

That's not to far off my estimate, I came in at just under $5000 with the k20a3 and that gets me a better engine and a manual transmission so I'm willing to pay that I think. It's not just a swap for power in my case, it's a repair. If I could get $5000 for my car I would consider selling and buying something a bit newer, but there are so many 7th gens here it's hard to sell with all the competition.

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

Yea I can get max. 5000 for my car... which sucks but it's got high mileage I'm going to keep thinking about it I have lots of time. I don't plan on ordering parts though. I'm gonna put the money away in a savings account and buy everything when I do the job unleses i find a badass deal on something. I'd hate to have almost everything on hand and then get sideswiped by a transport truck. Renderin all my parts useless...

MindBomber

^Good point!

Also, don't forget you can probably sell your d17 and trans for $500-1000.

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

Depends on if it's running or not

gearbox

iTrader: (95)

unfortunatley ive been realizing this too. you guys should really look at the dyno sheets for the k20a2 before spending $5k+ on something that will be about as fast as the d17 for normal driving (under 4k rpms). the torque on these k20 engines are very low and unless you hit redline all the time, you simply will not feel the extra power (but you will still have the lower gas mileage). it sounds like a good idea on paper, but having been in a good amount of k20 cars like ep3, type-s, base, si, etc i can tell you that in stock form they are pretty meh, esp in the lower rpms. the base rsx feels exactly like a civic, possibly even worse. the type-s is very similar until you get in the higher rpms. just dont want you guys to be disappointed after spending all that money and not getting much benefit, even with a kpro and some mods. now if you plan to supercharge, then it may be worth doing but that will cost way more than just buying a faster car to start. there is no way i can afford anything other than my civic right now so im just saving for the inevidable auto trans rebuild and keep the d17 til i find a normal job. i wish it had more power but it still gets you around.

if most of your driving is under 5k rpms, then the a2 and a3 are practically identical.